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Author Topic:   Did Jesus Exist? by Bart Ehrman
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


(3)
Message 144 of 563 (915302)
02-12-2024 2:58 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by Theodoric
02-12-2024 2:54 PM


I suppose next you'll say there's no evidence of Santa Claus. Man, I sat on that dude's lap when I was 4!

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by Theodoric, posted 02-12-2024 2:54 PM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by Theodoric, posted 02-12-2024 3:04 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 146 of 563 (915304)
02-12-2024 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by Theodoric
02-12-2024 3:04 PM


Oh, that happens to me too!

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by Theodoric, posted 02-12-2024 3:04 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 157 of 563 (915317)
02-12-2024 4:58 PM
Reply to: Message 155 by Granny Magda
02-12-2024 4:31 PM


I think that concluding that Jesus was not real simply because there is little evidence is a bit odd, given that we all agree that a historically plausible Jesus would not have left much evidence.
You say little evidence, but it seems to me like no physical evidence at all. There's no Jesus lived here signs, there no independent evidence that the character that was the model for Jesus was anything but fictional. Historians of the time documented other obscure preacher characters but never even mentioned Jesus in passing.
You would think someone would have noticed a white man preaching to a dark skinned culture and contemporary scribes would have mentioned it.
I think Paul was probably sincere. I think he really had a vision, which he genuinely believed was of a divine Jesus and it changed his life, not necessarily for the better.
Yeah, we've seen numerous visionaries here at EvC, Phat, Dredge, ICANT, candle2. Humans are very good at imagining voices in their heads and it seldom seems to make their lives better.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 155 by Granny Magda, posted 02-12-2024 4:31 PM Granny Magda has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 159 by Granny Magda, posted 02-12-2024 5:52 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 160 of 563 (915324)
02-12-2024 7:44 PM
Reply to: Message 159 by Granny Magda
02-12-2024 5:52 PM


Please tell me that this entire post was just a wind up, please.
Yep, my only point was really that there is less than a little evidence. I shouldn't have said anymore than that.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by Granny Magda, posted 02-12-2024 5:52 PM Granny Magda has seen this message but not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


(1)
Message 182 of 563 (915403)
02-13-2024 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 179 by Tangle
02-13-2024 1:44 PM


Tangle in Message 179 writes:
PaulK in Message 177 writes:
It’s hard to say. How do we tell the difference between pure fiction and fiction with some historical basis?
We don't we just say there's no evidence and then shrug.
Exactly! Fiction is the operational term here. The bible is fiction and there is no independent verifiable evidence that Jesus was not a fictional character. If there was everyone would know by now.
The thing that's odd to me is seeing people who don't believe in Jesus and who know there is no evidence are using the same arguments as creationists and pretending that no evidence is actually evidence. These are the same meaningless arguments GDR uses when he knows there is not a shred of evidence, but he wants to rationalize his beliefs.
There is NO verifiable evidence that Jesus was a real person.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 179 by Tangle, posted 02-13-2024 1:44 PM Tangle has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 184 of 563 (915405)
02-13-2024 2:29 PM
Reply to: Message 180 by PaulK
02-13-2024 1:54 PM


PaulK in Message 180 writes:
The Gospel stories are there. Saying that they were just made up is not an adequate explanation for their existence - it explains nothing about them.
Since we don't have an adequate explanation for their source or basis, I don't see how making up an explanation helps.
quote:
We don't we just say there's no evidence and then shrug.
It’s better than claiming certainty when no certainty is available.
Yes!

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 180 by PaulK, posted 02-13-2024 1:54 PM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 186 by PaulK, posted 02-13-2024 2:35 PM Tanypteryx has seen this message but not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 458 of 563 (916804)
03-13-2024 1:47 AM
Reply to: Message 456 by Theodoric
03-13-2024 12:19 AM


Re: Expert Testimony on Jesus and His Resurrection
I think this must be his strategy: saturation bombing forums with his drivel and he occasionally makes a sale. They can add up, I think there's an Audible version as well. I looked it up on Amazon and probably contaminated my online footprint, but the religious nutters lose interest in me pretty fast...

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3

This message is a reply to:
 Message 456 by Theodoric, posted 03-13-2024 12:19 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


(1)
Message 551 of 563 (917651)
04-12-2024 11:57 AM
Reply to: Message 538 by Theodoric
04-12-2024 8:24 AM


Re: Troll alert
Theodoric in Message 538 writes:
Hard to tell if trolling, delusion, mental illness or defect. Either way it is impossible to have a conversation that is this disjointed.
Yep, I had forgotten that every single discussion with him morphs into indecipherable gobbledygook. I started asking for clarification and lost track of the point immediately. I don't think it's possible to have a coherent conversation with him. It's like Percy said, it's trying to interpret reality looking at the reflection in pieces of a broken mirror.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3
If you are going to argue that evolution is false because it resembles your own beliefs then perhaps you should rethink your argument. - - Taq

This message is a reply to:
 Message 538 by Theodoric, posted 04-12-2024 8:24 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 553 by LamarkNewAge, posted 04-12-2024 12:18 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 556 of 563 (917657)
04-12-2024 12:32 PM
Reply to: Message 554 by LamarkNewAge
04-12-2024 12:21 PM


Re: Troll alert
Well, most of us here seem to quickly find what you write completely indecipherable, so we quit in frustration, and your behavior becomes more and more trollish. We seem to be able to communicate with each other clearly, but we're all increasingly confused by what you write. Sorry, but that is our reality, confusion when we try to talk with you.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3
If you are going to argue that evolution is false because it resembles your own beliefs then perhaps you should rethink your argument. - - Taq

This message is a reply to:
 Message 554 by LamarkNewAge, posted 04-12-2024 12:21 PM LamarkNewAge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 557 by LamarkNewAge, posted 04-12-2024 12:43 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4443
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.0


Message 560 of 563 (917661)
04-12-2024 1:28 PM
Reply to: Message 557 by LamarkNewAge
04-12-2024 12:43 PM


Re: Troll alert
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
That is one interpretation.
Yep, I was giving you MY interpretation of MY interactions with you and MY interpretations of your behavior with other participants here at EvC.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
Most would say EvC is packed with people with a fundamentally unscientific mindset
Most of who, I don't know who you mean. I was commenting on how discussions with with you always go, NOT how much knowledge any participants posses.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
I am not great at debating techniques,
Well, that explains why you resort to insults and name calling when we cannot follow your argument or refuse to follow you down obscure rabbit holes.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
You refuse to follow an argument or datum to it's logical end.
Because I cannot understand what you are talking about, and I rapidly lose interest in your insults.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
You refuse to engage with evidence you don't want to respond to.
That's because since I could not understand you, so I did not know you presented any evidence.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
You only want to debate the evidence you feel is weak enough to destroy.
Well, here I was not debating at all, because I was commenting on your repeated behavior in every debate topic I have seen you participating in.
LamarkNewAge in Message 557 writes:
(Percy and now Tangle have brought it up)

(Tangle has talked about nothing but the supernatural, but it is not what we should be bringing up. It is off topic)
If you don't like what people have to say, the solution is simple, ignore them, don't engage with them.
Every time you show up here you have a massive chip on your shoulder, why bother if you despise us that much?
And BTW is there any subject that you are not the absolute top planetary expert in?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python
One important characteristic of a theory is that it has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie
If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --Percy
The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
Why should anyone debate someone who doesn't know the subject? -- AZPaul3
If you are going to argue that evolution is false because it resembles your own beliefs then perhaps you should rethink your argument. - - Taq

This message is a reply to:
 Message 557 by LamarkNewAge, posted 04-12-2024 12:43 PM LamarkNewAge has not replied

  
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