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Author | Topic: Well this is awkward... Used to be a YEC | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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Isn't it curious. I've seen many stories from people who turned away from creationism and accepted science after they stopped simply believing what others told them and looked at the evidence themselves. I've never seen one story about anyone who turned away from science to creationism because the evidence told them so. The closest I can think of is Kurt Wise, but he's the first to admit that he believes the bible despite the evidence, not because of it.
Can anyone point me to a scientist who turned from science to creationism because that's where they believed the evidence led them?Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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Just a friendly tip; don't get too involved with Dawn. You'll find he's barely literate and a font of ignorance and misunderstanding about science, reason and just about everything else related in any meaningful way to the real world.
But he can be a fun toy to bat about a bit if you're into that kind of thing.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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I'd suggest that you modify your Dawkins Scale to reflect the fact that the claims of logically valid and invalid do not come from Dawkins. At least, I don't think it does, since he considers himself a 6.9.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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Now then, was there any reason that you felt the need to lie about this? It's not even a good lie, I mean we could go back and show you the number of times it's been pointed out that abogenesis is about how life started and evolution is what happens after that. Isn't it enough for you that you can say that science can't yet say how life started? Why lie when you've got a decent story anyway? Is it just habbit? I feel I must rise to the defense of Dawn. I don't for a moment believe that he's lying. A lie is knowingly stating a falsehood to be true. It's clear that Dawn's connection with reality is so tenuous that he actually believes that supporters of the ToE lump it in together with abiogenesis. He is, of course, wrong. But I don't believe he knows he is.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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...he claims it was his discoveries in astrophysics and subsequent study of several different religions that drove him to that choice. Not exactly. He does claim he was a scientist before he was a Christian. But, at least in the page you linked, he doesn't attribute his conversion to any discoveries in astrophysics. He attributes it to his reading of the creation accounts in Genesis and his conclusion that they describe 11 unnamed "creation events" in a manner that he believes is too accurate to be explained other than that it was divinely inspired. He doesn't say what he considers these "creation events" to be. He doesn't explain how they coincide with what science knows about the history of the universe or the history of life on Earth. Nor does he provide his calculations to support his conclusion that the odds of the 11 "creation events" being randomly put in the correct order are less than one in six billion. Actually, the whole thing reads much the same as just about any other piece of apologetics I've ever read. There's certainly nothing there to suggest that it was science that led him to religion.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
It wasn't the science that led him to faith .... Ah, so he has absolutely nothing to do with the question I asked. Okay, well, thanks for the input.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
Even if reality were reflected in religious writings, that still wouldn't make them scientific and, as such, they don't belong in science class. Whether it should be regarded as rubbish is a separate question, but it certainly shouldn't be regarded as science.
Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined:
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I'm pretty sure I made my point in the post you're replying to. If it's not science, it doesn't belong in science class.
Very few of us here would object if cdesign proponentists want to run around pretending that they are doing science, publish in their own "journals," hold conferences and conventions and generally conduct their cargo cult. It's when they try to equate it with actual science, get it taught in public school science classes, get public money to pursue their dogma, that we speak up and point of that it's not science, it's religion. Go ahead, preach it in your churches. If you insist on making your children scientifically illiterate by teaching it in public schools, we'd probably criticize the practice, but most of us wouldn't try to prohibit it. Just keep it out of science.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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subbie Member (Idle past 1254 days) Posts: 3509 Joined: |
So ... you're still spamming this forum with the same crap? And you still haven't come up with any arguments to substantiate it? You might as well ask your shoe to come up with something better. He keeps driveling the same dreck because he genuinely believes he's making some kind of point. He's incapable of understanding any of the 100s of criticisms of it. Seriously, you're more likely to make headway with Buz.Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate ...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist
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