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Author Topic:   Occupy Wall Street, London and Evereywhere Else
DC85
Member (Idle past 379 days)
Posts: 876
From: Richmond, Virginia USA
Joined: 05-06-2003


Message 196 of 208 (648197)
01-13-2012 8:33 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Straggler
01-13-2012 9:36 AM


Re: Adendum ... II
I agree. Here in the UK we have a conservative prime-minister declaring that boardroom pay is out of control and reflects a "market failure" that is the result of "crony capitalism" and which needs to be addressed
That's wonderful.
I 'm not sure you realize how big of a deal it is to hear it in the United States. Democrats(our "most" progressive party) hardly ever address it and have largely shied away from talking about progressive economics for about 40 years. . The country has been on a rightward trend back toward laissez faire trickle down economics ever since.
A Republican speaking in this way? Just doesn't happen. They of course have not spoken about a way to address it while also preaching about the wonders of cutting taxes and regulations for the "Job Creators". They are simply trying to tap into the new found anger.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Straggler, posted 01-13-2012 9:36 AM Straggler has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by Straggler, posted 01-14-2012 5:04 PM DC85 has not replied

  
onifre
Member (Idle past 2950 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


(1)
Message 197 of 208 (648309)
01-14-2012 11:18 AM
Reply to: Message 189 by RAZD
12-24-2011 12:44 AM


Re: Still dodging.
Most occupiers have college degrees, many have jobs and homes.
If you can follow this link...
Update Your Browser | Facebook
It's a picture of a bishop getting arrested. My buddy who also got arrested that day (sitting with the skully on, bottom right) with the bishop, and 50 others, said they were organizing in the cell and conducting meetings there. These aren't homeless people, or criminals getting arrested.
- Oni

This message is a reply to:
 Message 189 by RAZD, posted 12-24-2011 12:44 AM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 198 of 208 (648324)
01-14-2012 2:00 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by NoNukes
01-13-2012 5:20 PM


Re: trickle down is a joke
Hi NoNukes,
Apparently, there is no longer any pretense that the myth of trickle-down (voodoo) economics ever had any basis in fact.
May it forever lay on the trash-heap of history.
According to the leading candidate for Obama's house, people who want to discuss the increasing income gap between the rich and the middle class (outside of quite rooms) are simply envious, and perhaps sinfully covetous of their rich brethern.
They'd likely be trying to win a lottery without understanding that just being a millionaire is not enough.
The other Republican candidates are being encourage to stop pointing out problems with Romney's work at Bain because doing so is bad for the Republican party.
Don't look at the man behind the curtain ... you may find out that a lot of transactions amount to theft from the top, and they don't want the general public to know this.
There's no need to make this stuff up.
People are increasingly aware of this issue -- due to the Occupy movement -- and this leads to it becoming a part of the discussion ... just as raising awareness of the injustice of racism in the 60's brought it into the general consciousness, and then into legislation to resolve the injustice.
We are in the general consciousness stage. It will be interesting to see how this affects the debates for the upcoming elections. If republicans are branded as defenders of the 1% it could be bad for them across the nation.
Especially if it can resonate on an emotional level.
Enjoy.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by NoNukes, posted 01-13-2012 5:20 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
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Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


(1)
Message 199 of 208 (648336)
01-14-2012 5:04 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by DC85
01-13-2012 8:33 PM


Re: Adendum ... II
DC writes:
That's wonderful.
It's good that even a conservative politician feels the need to accept the legitimate public feeling on this issue to at least the extent of making PR proclamations on the issue. I think the Occupy movement can claim some credit in getting the issue to that level of awareness. But I wouldn't get too carried away. Cameron's proclamations are no doubt somewhat superficial and band wagon inspired.
David Cameron didn't go into politics to tackle the market failures in top pay. Indeed his party is significantly funded by these people and ideologically tied to a variety of policies that support the status quo. So we'll see what actually happens.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by DC85, posted 01-13-2012 8:33 PM DC85 has not replied

  
DC85
Member (Idle past 379 days)
Posts: 876
From: Richmond, Virginia USA
Joined: 05-06-2003


(2)
Message 200 of 208 (648337)
01-14-2012 5:07 PM
Reply to: Message 198 by RAZD
01-14-2012 2:00 PM


Re: trickle down is a joke
May it forever lay on the trash-heap of history.
It never will... They are convinced that the reason we're in trouble is because we just didn't go far enough. It really is insane.
Look back to the 1920's and the policies of Harding and Coolidge that drove the United States into the Depression, There were people spouting the same absurdities then. The Difference now is they have the corporate noise machine spreading stupidity nationwide.
They Never went away and now have even rewritten History to idolize Warren Harding as a Savior who pulled America out of a Recession that didn't exist in 1920 and Magically think that because Coolidge wasn't president in 1929 he cannot possibly have contributed to it.
They showed up again in 1964 in Barry Goldwater and AGAIN in 1980 and we've been turning right back into the stupidity ever since. Deregulation and tax cuts at the top all while raising them on everyone else and "reforming welfare".
Don't look at the man behind the curtain ... you may find out that a lot of transactions amount to theft from the top, and they don't want the general public to know this.
What gets me about this thing with Bain Capital ,banks and their defense of it as "great capitalism" is that those same people would demonize Bernie Madoff. The Difference? He stole from Billionaires... Can't have that

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 Message 198 by RAZD, posted 01-14-2012 2:00 PM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 201 of 208 (648344)
01-14-2012 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 119 by New Cat's Eye
12-09-2011 12:27 PM


Re: hear from a conservatively inclined but not entirely lunatic person
Hi Catholic Scientist
I think it can be. Sure, the floors need to be cleaned, but a CEO who brings in 10 million dollars in new revenue is worth the million he got to do that.
You're assuming that the money brought in is distributed. We see companies being bought up, the new executives pay themselves high wages, borrow against the company and then leave it bankrupt while they walk off with their millions. See Bain for example.
Personally I think it is immoral for any company to pay anyone less than a poverty level wage for full time work. Paying less is abuse.
Once you are able to do that, THEN you can think about padding your pocket.
Note that IF the people had been able to pay their mortgages that the whole financial "crisis" would not have occurred
Yeah, I just don't know about that.
It is pretty universally agreed that the mortgage failures is what caused the crisis. There is no arguing that point.
It is also pretty universally agreed that actual income of people in the lower brackets has been going down for the last decade or so.
No trickle-down, failure of people to continue to afford mortgages they already had, failure of the whole mortgage program. Failure of trickle-down.
When you get a loan, that is someone making an investment in you. If they make a bad investment, then they are to blame.
I dunno, if you enter a contract that says you're gonna pay back a particular amount every month, and they're betting on you fullfilling that contract, then when you don't/can't then that is your fault for violating the contract.
Investments are risky. That is part of the reality of capitalism. Should they be protected by public tax funds from making bad risk investments? Really?
Enjoy.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 202 of 208 (648345)
01-14-2012 7:34 PM
Reply to: Message 192 by New Cat's Eye
12-27-2011 12:24 PM


Re: Adendum ... II
Hi again Catholic Scientist,
I haven't heard much about the Occupy movement in the last week....
What's the next stage?
As DC85 said, it is getting the issue into mainstream conversations, just as the civil rights movement moved from initial protests to national discussions and then to actions to resolve the injustices.
The next stage is actions that return some justice to the economic and political systems.
Already we see the republicans responding to some of the issues. It will be interesting to see how the election proceeds, and how much the democrates paint the republican incumbents as protectors of the 1% at the increased expense of the 99%.
Enjoy.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 192 by New Cat's Eye, posted 12-27-2011 12:24 PM New Cat's Eye has seen this message but not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(5)
Message 203 of 208 (649169)
01-20-2012 11:50 PM



  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 204 of 208 (650698)
02-02-2012 9:56 AM


Prosecute Wall Street

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 205 of 208 (650965)
02-03-2012 3:58 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Dr Adequate
02-02-2012 9:56 AM


Re: Prosecute Wall Street -- and it begins ...
Hi Dr Adequate.
Prosecuting Wall Street Gets Real.
Indeed.
quote:
NY's Schneiderman sues banks in foreclosure effort
LBANY, N.Y. (AP) New York's attorney general on Friday accused some of the nation's largest banks of deceit and fraud in using an electronic mortgage registry that he said puts homeowners at a disadvantage in foreclosures.
Democrat Eric Schneiderman sued Bank of America, J.P. Morgan Chase and Wells Fargo over their use of the Mortgage Electronic Registration Systems Inc., or MERS, claiming the banks submitted court documents containing false and misleading information that appeared to provide the authority for foreclosures when there was none.
The lawsuit also names the registry operator, MERSCORP Inc. of Virginia.
Schneiderman claims the MERS system has eliminated homeowners' ability to track property transfers through traditional public records. He said the electronic system now stores that data and is plagued by inaccuracies.
One step at a time.
Enjoy.
Edited by Zen Deist, : quote not qs

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Dr Adequate, posted 02-02-2012 9:56 AM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 206 of 208 (651999)
02-11-2012 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 205 by RAZD
02-03-2012 3:58 PM


Top 10 Issues\Demands concilient with the protests
10 Clearest Demands of Occupy Wall Street
quote:
Too Much Money in Politics
Income Inequality is a Problem
There’s Plenty of Money for Banks, None for the Average American
We’re All in this Together
Government Inactivity
We’re Talking About the Wrong Things
We Don’t Want Handouts, We Want Solutions
Class Warfare is Already Being Waged
Economic Mobility is a Myth
Something Is Wrong
Some duplication, but read the article for the details.
Get money out of politics, fix the economic system so this kind of failure doesn't happen a third time, fix the tax system to be fair to the lower brackets and fund the government properly ...
Enjoy

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 205 by RAZD, posted 02-03-2012 3:58 PM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

  
frako
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 2932
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


(1)
Message 207 of 208 (652869)
02-16-2012 3:56 PM


Basicly what the banks are doing and have been doing in a funny cartoon simple enough for anyone to understand.

Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 208 of 208 (672595)
09-09-2012 8:00 PM


Some update and other information about wall street protests
Hi all, thought I would share some videos,
These are links to the videos so they don't take so long to load the thread:
(1) a history of the first protest
http://youtu.be/ayUGOgFaCs8
(2) I am not moving
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGRXCgMdz9A&feature=share
(3) Hypocrisy has it's own elegant symmetry
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovlWWXIahIs
Those who think the wall street protests are pale in comparison to the arab spring\summer\fall protests should watch the last one in particular.
Enjoy.

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
Rebel American Zen Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

  
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