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Author Topic:   Prophecy vs Free will
Dawn Bertot
Member (Idle past 166 days)
Posts: 3571
Joined: 11-23-2007


Message 136 of 168 (630864)
08-28-2011 6:29 PM
Reply to: Message 134 by jar
08-28-2011 6:15 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
And by now I would have though you would realize I don't wander down even attractive rabbit holes.
Its attractive and you wandered already, otherwise you would not have responded when you did.
Give it a shot, Im sure you reasons for believing the prophecy were not fullfilled will be intersting
Dawn Bertot

This message is a reply to:
 Message 134 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 6:15 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 137 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 6:49 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

jar
Member
Posts: 34058
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 137 of 168 (630865)
08-28-2011 6:49 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by Dawn Bertot
08-28-2011 6:29 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
Been there, done that.
There are many many threads on Biblical Prophecy and very few of the Old Testament prophecies stand up to examination, and no prophecies of Jesus or by Jesus stand up to examination.
Find one of the threads or post whichever prophecy you think can be supported.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 6:29 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 139 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 8:02 PM jar has replied
 Message 146 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 9:54 PM jar has replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 138 of 168 (630866)
08-28-2011 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 132 by Dawn Bertot
08-28-2011 5:53 PM


Re: COME, LET US REASON TOGETHER.
quote:
Its like i am in a discussion with two different people. At times you seem steady and rational, then the next moment you seem irrational and paranoid.
Sorry if I appear irrational about covert Nazism. When one says a Pope who rejected the return of Jews to their land, even while they are being holocausted in a Christian country, because your lord did this to them for their rebeliousness, yes I am irrational for not supporting you. I am rebelious and should be more rational of the triumph of evil instead. It all becomes rational if the greatest evil deeds are followed by an IN JC dance, you get saved, rght? Yet the world is in chaos and great natural disasters are seen. Eurostan is happening and the regimes Christians support are crumbling.
I say a Nuremberg II Trial is required for European Christianity. Every Christian and atheist becomes guilty here according to a majestic law, one who remains silent of evil becomes evil. How irrational is such a prophesy?
Edited by IamJoseph, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 132 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 5:53 PM Dawn Bertot has not replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 139 of 168 (630868)
08-28-2011 8:02 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by jar
08-28-2011 6:49 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
quote:
Find one of the threads or post whichever prophecy you think can be supported.
I can mention a most disdained prophesy standing up to examination. The return of Israel when this was nigh impossible.
This was a rag tag people being holocausted in Christian Europe - because they rebelled against depraved Rome and a Roman Christian Pope declared the fleeing Jews must not be supported back to their homeland - so 1000's of refugee Jews in boatloads were sent back to Europe's camps and all Christians chanted VE VERE NOT AVARE. This return happened despite all the world looking that away, while Europe's chimneys still fumed and when hordes of Muslims swayed swords when they landed. Christian Europe than re-transfered the name Palestinian to those panting for another holocaust - a name applied eclusively upon the Jews by Europe. Rock science what it means!
However, I agree that only few such prophesies can stand under examinaion - and none from the NT.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 6:49 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 140 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 8:07 PM IamJoseph has replied

jar
Member
Posts: 34058
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 140 of 168 (630869)
08-28-2011 8:07 PM
Reply to: Message 139 by IamJoseph
08-28-2011 8:02 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
Sorry but that post may well contain the most falsehoods and misrepresentations of any post you've made yet.
Rome had nothing to do with the Jews being dispersed and in fact it is likely that the return of the Jews happened even before the prophecy was written.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 139 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 8:02 PM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 142 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 8:18 PM jar has replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 141 of 168 (630870)
08-28-2011 8:10 PM
Reply to: Message 135 by Dawn Bertot
08-28-2011 6:26 PM


quote:
the question arises, how and why did they respond so quickly and immediately to the statement:
"follow me"
None followed. The people were busy defending against Rome, a magestic stance, which appears outside the radar of alledged apostles. Is this not what occured in Nazi urope?
Paul was thrown out, Christianity only flouroushed centuries later, by enforcement and the rake, and none demanding proof. This is why you cannot put a shred of evidence of the claims made in the Gospels which you post here: read, its a total lie.
Call me when you come up with a Christian dead sea scrolls in Hebrew by any of the 12 alledged apostles. A Messiah will demand this of you!
Edited by IamJoseph, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 135 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 6:26 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 148 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 10:09 PM IamJoseph has replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 142 of 168 (630871)
08-28-2011 8:18 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by jar
08-28-2011 8:07 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
quote:
Sorry but that post may well contain the most falsehoods and misrepresentations of any post you've made yet.
Rome had nothing to do with the Jews being dispersed and in fact it is likely that the return of the Jews happened even before the prophecy was written.
Which planet are you referring to? There was a 70 year war between Rome and Judea. The return is prophesized in the dead sea scrolls [200 BCE] and the Septuagint [300 BCE].
A disdained truthful prophesy cannot be transcended by a cherished lie.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 140 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 8:07 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 143 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 8:37 PM IamJoseph has replied

jar
Member
Posts: 34058
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 143 of 168 (630874)
08-28-2011 8:37 PM
Reply to: Message 142 by IamJoseph
08-28-2011 8:18 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
Too funny. That has NOTHING to do with the Jews returning.
The return happened in 538 BCE. Guess which is earlier, 538 BCE or 300 BCE?
And even then most Jews chose not to return.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 142 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 8:18 PM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 144 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 9:28 PM jar has replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 144 of 168 (630878)
08-28-2011 9:28 PM
Reply to: Message 143 by jar
08-28-2011 8:37 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
quote:
Too funny. That has NOTHING to do with the Jews returning.
It does. Its about a RETURN.
quote:
The return happened in 538 BCE. Guess which is earlier, 538 BCE or 300 BCE?
Then a Pope rejected their return. He was answered as was Babylon in 586 BCE. The prophesy stands.
quote:
And even then most Jews chose not to return.
They were unable to return, by this time the pre-Islamic Arabs took hold of the Jewish land, barring their return - an eerie parallel of what is seen today. However a small remnant rsked all and the prophesy was fulfilled. A disdained truth transcends a cherish lie.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 143 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 8:37 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 145 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 9:33 PM IamJoseph has replied

jar
Member
Posts: 34058
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 145 of 168 (630879)
08-28-2011 9:33 PM
Reply to: Message 144 by IamJoseph
08-28-2011 9:28 PM


Do you really know as little as it seems?
Utter bullshit.
There were no popes in 538 BCE.
The Jews were pre-Islamic Arabs.
You really are fun.
Edited by jar, : Fix subtitle.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 144 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 9:28 PM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 150 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 10:14 PM jar has replied

Dawn Bertot
Member (Idle past 166 days)
Posts: 3571
Joined: 11-23-2007


Message 146 of 168 (630881)
08-28-2011 9:54 PM
Reply to: Message 137 by jar
08-28-2011 6:49 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
Find one of the threads or post whichever prophecy you think can be supported.
I dont need another thread, all I need is half a brain and a set of eyes to see the Church he predicted, flourishing just as he promised
His disciples went to the utter most parts of the earth as he promised and prophecied
As far as your other threads on prophecy, i demonstrated that you dont even understand what biblical prophecy is about or how it should be applied
If you care to take that dare, the hole awaits.
Yeah those rabbits and sheep are scary arent they, better watch out for those vivious creatures
Dawn Bertot
Edited by Dawn Bertot, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 137 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 6:49 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 147 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 9:56 PM Dawn Bertot has replied
 Message 153 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 10:26 PM Dawn Bertot has not replied

jar
Member
Posts: 34058
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 4.9


Message 147 of 168 (630882)
08-28-2011 9:56 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by Dawn Bertot
08-28-2011 9:54 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
So as usual you do not respond but just try to change the subject.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 9:54 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 149 by Dawn Bertot, posted 08-28-2011 10:12 PM jar has replied

Dawn Bertot
Member (Idle past 166 days)
Posts: 3571
Joined: 11-23-2007


Message 148 of 168 (630886)
08-28-2011 10:09 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by IamJoseph
08-28-2011 8:10 PM


Paul was thrown out, Christianity only flouroushed centuries later, by enforcement and the rake, and none demanding proof. This is why you cannot put a shred of evidence of the claims made in the Gospels which you post here: read, its a total lie.
Not only is not a lie, but it can be witnessed
The prophesy stands. The church never departed from the earth after its establishment in 33AD. I could just be imagining things, but Im pretty sure its the largest religion correct?
The prophesy was a success. Please if you dare, show mw how this is any different than the one concerning Israels return
Call me when you come up with a Christian dead sea scrolls in Hebrew by any of the 12 alledged apostles. A Messiah will demand this of you!
Im sure you understand that a dead sea scroll, moving things back, still 1000 years from any original autographs, is the pot calling the kettle black, correct
Ironically I use the same evidence for the NT as I do for the OLD. its very reasonable to assume that if things were kept in tact 1000 or 2000 years removed from the event, its reasonable to assume they were kept pure to the originals.
samething for the NT. Its reasonable to assume from the fragments, early christian writers, Apostolic fathers and earliest manuscripts that they reflect nearly all of the original compsitions, liberal or conservative dating notwithstanding
Dawn Bertot
Edited by Dawn Bertot, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 141 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 8:10 PM IamJoseph has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 151 by IamJoseph, posted 08-28-2011 10:22 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

Dawn Bertot
Member (Idle past 166 days)
Posts: 3571
Joined: 11-23-2007


Message 149 of 168 (630887)
08-28-2011 10:12 PM
Reply to: Message 147 by jar
08-28-2011 9:56 PM


Re: Resond to what is actually written
So as usual you do not respond but just try to change the subject.
No the subject is the same since the thread started. You do remember you just started here correct
Ill refresh your memory. I asked a question, you said NO to that question, I challenged you to demonstrate why, you then started to trail off about other threads
Will you now demonstrate why Christs prophecy concerning the church was not fullfilled
I now wait with great anticipation
Dawn Bertot

This message is a reply to:
 Message 147 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 9:56 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 152 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 10:26 PM Dawn Bertot has replied

IamJoseph
Member (Idle past 3751 days)
Posts: 2822
Joined: 06-30-2007


Message 150 of 168 (630888)
08-28-2011 10:14 PM
Reply to: Message 145 by jar
08-28-2011 9:33 PM


Re: Do you really know as little as it seems?
quote:
Utter bullshit.
There were no popes in 538 BCE.
Gee thanks for that brilliant observation. Ignore the 'return' factor twice!
quote:
The Jews were pre-Islamic Arabs.
Utter Islamic BS. There was no temple under today's mosque either. Utter zionist and gospel BS, no?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 145 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 9:33 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by jar, posted 08-28-2011 10:27 PM IamJoseph has not replied

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