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Author | Topic: Jose Guerena | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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Since I've asked you nicely to do this, anything else you say that's not accurate I will assume to be a lie. That makes you a liar. Spoken like a true prick cop. Are you sure you wouldn't fit in?
As I have been trying to explain to crashfrog all this time, which crash has refused to acknowledge (aka lie), there are varying levels of offenses and varying levels of loopholes. Crash was trying to make the point that ALL offenses are equal. Meaning going just 1 mph over the speed limit is a criminal offense. Not exactly. The point you're missing is that all laws are expected to be followed. There aren't any "sotra" laws that you may or may not follow, regardless of the severity of the offense. Its hypocritical of you to despise loopholes and speed slow enough that you won't get a ticket.
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Modulous Member Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
Its hypocritical of you to despise loopholes and speed slow enough that you won't get a ticket. I think Taz despises criminals that use loopholes to avoid conviction, not the majority of citizens that violate traffic laws in ways too minor for the majority of police officers to consider worthy of spending tax payers time and money pursuing. Taz would only be a hypocrite if he was accused of a criminal offense (especially the violent or property related crimes he cited) in which there was 'smoking gun evidence' of his guilt, but his lawyer argued that because the chain of custody was not rigidly followed (especially if it was, but some signature was missing or date was not entered into the correct box on some form), he should be acquitted. Or some situation that was actually analogous to the kind of thing he said he despised. You can't accuse him of hypocrisy unless you can cite him stating he despises people that break civil or traffic laws in minor ways.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
What with all the insults and bitching, I'm not really sure just what it is he despises...
ABE: Okay, I've looked: The original quote was:
quote: That's hilariously hypocritical in my opinion. But later:
quote: So, yeah, you're right. Edited by Catholic Scientist, : No reason given.
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Taz Member (Idle past 3291 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
CS writes:
Since when did we become a strict authoritarian state? Not all laws are equal. In fact, there are many laws in the law book that haven't been followed for a couple generations. Usually, these outdated laws were created for a specific purpose and then people forgot about them.
The point you're missing is that all laws are expected to be followed. Its hypocritical of you to despise loopholes and speed slow enough that you won't get a ticket.
No, it is not. I have stated very clearly that I'm not a perfectionist by any stretch of imagination. And as such, I don't expect perfection from anybody. I think many offenses are forgivable and can get away with a slap on the wrist. Most of such offenses were committed either by mistake, absent-mindedness, or just plain stupidity. But there are offenses that we know for sure weren't a mistake when they were committed. In fact, they were committed through careful planning and malice. Again, going 7 over is not a criminal offense by any stretch of imagination. Since when did we become a white and black society? Either we follow all laws or we don't follow them at all. Either everyone goes to a criminal island or nobody goes. Either you are a criminal or you're not. Are you willing to admit that you're putting words in my mouth and that you're trying to make me into some kind of hypocritical perfectionist?
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Taz Member (Idle past 3291 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
Yes, CS, take my quote completely out of context. Ignore everything I said around that quote.
What you're doing is citing these quotes as if they were in a vacuum. It is incredibly easy to make a person say something they're not saying by doing this. Lying must be a new fad these days with catholics on motorcycles.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Oh quit being such a whiny little bitch. You're getting to be about as bad as Theodoric.
Since when did we become a strict authoritarian state? Since the cops decided that maintaining authority was more important than justice and the civilians' safety. Did you see those dancers get arrested at TJ memorial?
I think many offenses are forgivable and can get away with a slap on the wrist. Most of such offenses were committed either by mistake, absent-mindedness, or just plain stupidity. But not speeding 7 miles over the limit.... You do that exact number on purpose because its the most you can go while still feeling comfortable that you won't get pulled over. You're attitude still comes off as hypocritical even if your point technically was not. You feel that you can determine which laws you really don't have to follow, yet you want to throw other criminals on an island because they "don't deserve to breath the same air as you". Disgusting.
But there are offenses that we know for sure weren't a mistake when they were committed. In fact, they were committed through careful planning and malice. Again, going 7 over is not a criminal offense by any stretch of imagination. But still not a mistake and committed through careful planning and malice. Regardless of the severity of the crime, you're attitude towards law itself is still comming off as hypocritical. As if only criminal laws are the ones that you have to follow and the other ones you don't have to if you decide that your breaking of it isn't that bad and that you should really just get away with it
Just like a motherfucking cop!
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Oh quit being such a whiny little bitch. You're getting to be about as bad as Theodoric.
You even make personal attacks against me when I am not even participating in the thread. You really need to see someone about your Theodoric obsession. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
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Taz Member (Idle past 3291 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
Now you're just rambling. I really had trouble following you this time.
Anyway, take a look at this case. Sex offender gets life sentence for abduction, rape of Jaycee Dugard Now that the guy has been sentenced to life imprison, I don't understand why I have to feed, clothe, and shelter him. A life sentence is just that. It's using my tax dollars to let him live a relatively comfortable life till he dies.
But not speeding 7 miles over the limit....
You're going on a limb here. Again, go back and read the conversation between crash and I. Crash made the ridiculous statement that going just 1 over the speed limit makes me a criminal. He claims to see no distinction between going just 1 over the speed limit and committing a criminal offense like armed robbery. Are you going to start doing the same thing? Are you going to claim that all offenses are equal? Because that's what you're starting to sound like. Edited by Taz, : No reason given.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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You really need to see someone about your Theodoric obsession. You got any evidence for that assertion?
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Taz Member (Idle past 3291 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
Here is the wiki article about the kidnapping of Jaycee Dugard. Sad story.
Kidnapping of Jaycee Dugard - Wikipedia So, basically, this guy had a history of sexual assault on young girls. He was sent to prison where my parents' tax dollars paid for his comfort, promptly released, allowed more opportunities to commit more sexual assaults, etc. He then kidnapped a 5th grader and kept her in a tent in his backyard for 18 years. And now, my tax dollars will be used to feed and shelter him for the rest of his life. This makes no sense to me. And according to crashfrog and CS, apparently there's no difference between me speeding 7 over and this guy's lifetime of criminal activity.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
And according to crashfrog and CS, apparently there's no difference between me speeding 7 over and this guy's lifetime of criminal activity. Now who's the liar? Or are you just stupid?
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Taz Member (Idle past 3291 days) Posts: 5069 From: Zerus Joined: |
Re-read the messages. Crash has made it perfectly clear that me speeding just a couple miles over the speed limit makes me a criminal. You have made it clear that you're arguing along the same line as crashfrog.
What, you're going to play semantics with me now? Edit. This is not to mention that both your and crashfrog's entire argument rests on a fallacy. Ever heard of tu quoque? Rather than addressing my main points, you two are trying to divert attention away from my main points and keep trying to make this ridiculous argument that I'm a criminal for speeding even a couple mph over the speed limit. Edited by Taz, : No reason given.
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Since when did we become a strict authoritarian state? Not all laws are equal. In fact, there are many laws in the law book that haven't been followed for a couple generations. You're right, and we should get rid of laws we don't need anymore. But surely you can see the slippery slope involved in personal judgments about what laws are supposed to be followed and what aren't? What's the practical difference between your judgment that traffic laws aren't "real" laws and, say, Smokey McPot's judgment that marijuana prohibitions aren't "real" laws? Seems to me that the level of harm is equivalent in both cases, so that's no recourse.
Most of such offenses were committed either by mistake, absent-mindedness, or just plain stupidity. What about the people, like you, who are breaking laws that they think shouldn't count? What about the people doing things they don't think should be against the law in the first place? Is that "mistake, absent-mindedness, or just plain stupidity"? For that matter, when you break the law by speeding, are you making a mistake, being absent-minded, or just stupid? Which of those excuses do you grant to yourself?
Are you willing to admit that you're putting words in my mouth and that you're trying to make me into some kind of hypocritical perfectionist? You've made yourself into a hypocritical perfectionist by complaining about criminals who break the law and get away with it, in the very same sentence where you described how you only occasionally break the law and get away with it.
Again, going 7 over is not a criminal offense by any stretch of imagination. So, laws only count when they're criminal laws? Civil laws don't count? Administrative laws don't count? It should be OK to dump toxic waste into the water because that's only an EPA administrative regulation?
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crashfrog Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 19762 From: Silver Spring, MD Joined: |
Now that the guy has been sentenced to life imprison, I don't understand why I have to feed, clothe, and shelter him. Because it's for your benefit that he's been imprisoned, not his. We don't put criminals into jail as a favor to them, we do it as a favor to ourselves. Ergo we're responsible for feeding and clothing them while they're there. (You don't explain, exactly, how you plan to incarcerate someone in an area that isn't also a shelter. If there's nothing keeping the wind out, what keeps them in?) You don't understand the purpose of incarceration? Here's a hint - people don't want to be punished even if you decide they deserve it, so a considerable degree of coercion is required. And they have to be fed and clothed or else every sentence longer than a few weeks is an execution.
It's using my tax dollars to let him live a relatively comfortable life till he dies. Yup! Nobody forced you to put the guy in jail in the first place; presumably you did it, or took part in it indirectly by funding and supporting a society with laws and jails, because you stand to reap some benefit by not having rapists walking the street freely.
He claims to see no distinction between going just 1 over the speed limit and committing a criminal offense like armed robbery. I never claimed that. I'm continuing to ask you - because you won't say - where this line between "real" laws and "pretend" laws is.
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bluescat48 Member (Idle past 4189 days) Posts: 2347 From: United States Joined: |
You don't understand the purpose of incarceration? Here's a hint - people don't want to be punished even if you decide they deserve it, so a considerable degree of coercion is required. And they have to be fed and clothed or else every sentence longer than a few weeks is an execution. So charge the cost to the prisoner and his family. There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002 Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969 Since Evolution is only ~90% correct it should be thrown out and replaced by Creation which has even a lower % of correctness. W T Young, 2008
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