Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,817 Year: 3,074/9,624 Month: 919/1,588 Week: 102/223 Day: 0/13 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Ken Ham is ... EXPELLED
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 1 of 76 (609850)
03-23-2011 7:30 PM


Here.
Answers in Genesis, recognized as one of the strongest advocates for homeschooling in America, has been kicked out of two homeschool conventions where AiG President Ken Ham had been scheduled to speak. In addition, AiG as an exhibitor has also been expelled. [...] At the end of the day, they are censors. They claim to want open debate and discussion, but when we engage them in the battle of ideas, they launch invectives and ad hominem arguments, and then seek to exclude AiG from the debate.
Someone should make a movie about that.

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by subbie, posted 03-23-2011 8:40 PM Dr Adequate has not replied
 Message 5 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 8:52 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 2 of 76 (609851)
03-23-2011 7:37 PM


The Christian Cult of Ignorance parents that support such home schooling abortions should still be ashamed of themselves.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5930
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 5.8


Message 3 of 76 (609855)
03-23-2011 8:14 PM


Cat Fight!
But still, a creationist cat fight! Anyone bring the popcorn?
Creationists, especially Ken Ham, have a long-ish history of reserving their worst vitriol for other creationists whose theology "isn't quite right". Many years ago, a few years after Ken Ham started working for the ICR (he ran their "Back to Genesis" seminars), NCSE reported on his vicious attacks against some old-earth creationists, I think on a talk-radio show.

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1255 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


(1)
Message 4 of 76 (609857)
03-23-2011 8:40 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dr Adequate
03-23-2011 7:30 PM


Proposed movie titles...
Someone should make a movie about that.
They could call it....
Dumb and Dumber
The Great Brain Robbery
Psycho
Silence of the Ham
The Terminated
Inglorious Basterds
Unforgiven
Touch of Evil
Despicable Me
Cast Away
Gone With the Wind
True Lies
The Departed
The Nutty Professor

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-23-2011 7:30 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 76 (609858)
03-23-2011 8:52 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Dr Adequate
03-23-2011 7:30 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Dr Adequate writes:
Here.
Answers in Genesis, recognized as one of the strongest advocates for homeschooling in America, has been kicked out of two homeschool conventions where AiG President Ken Ham had been scheduled to speak. In addition, AiG as an exhibitor has also been expelled. [...] At the end of the day, they are censors. They claim to want open debate and discussion, but when we engage them in the battle of ideas, they launch invectives and ad hominem arguments, and then seek to exclude AiG from the debate.
Someone should make a movie about that.
Homeschooling conventions are not necessarily Christian or Biblical. The comprise of all varieties of ideologies, some which would be incompatible with AIG.
I assume all conventions are pretty much like the Washington State WHO. According to Wiki, "Its mission is to serve the diverse interests of home-based education in Washington State. WHO is nonpartisan, nonsectarian, and nondiscriminating in its views of homeschooling and participation in its activities. "

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-23-2011 7:30 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by arachnophilia, posted 03-23-2011 9:00 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 7 by subbie, posted 03-23-2011 9:08 PM Buzsaw has replied
 Message 8 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-23-2011 9:44 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
arachnophilia
Member (Idle past 1344 days)
Posts: 9069
From: god's waiting room
Joined: 05-21-2004


Message 6 of 76 (609859)
03-23-2011 9:00 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 8:52 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Buzsaw writes:
I assume all conventions are pretty much like the Washington State WHO. According to Wiki, "Its mission is to serve the diverse interests of home-based education in Washington State. WHO is nonpartisan, nonsectarian, and nondiscriminating in its views of homeschooling and participation in its activities. "
yes, the home schooling organizations around here are like that, too. they advertise nonpartisanship (and hand out lawn signs for republican candidates), nonsectarian (and start their meetings with a prayer), and nondiscrimation of views (and look at you really funny when you question the other two).
when you actually show up to one, you find approximately two groups of people:
  1. people who don't want their kids learning about evolution, and
  2. people who don't want their kids going to school with black people
i say "approximately" because there is some degree of overlap between the two.

אָרַח

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 8:52 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by Dr Jack, posted 03-24-2011 6:19 AM arachnophilia has replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1255 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


Message 7 of 76 (609860)
03-23-2011 9:08 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 8:52 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Here is a list of speakers at their next convention. I'm sure you and I would come to opposite conclusions from this list.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 8:52 PM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 10:06 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 8 of 76 (609862)
03-23-2011 9:44 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 8:52 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Homeschooling conventions are not necessarily Christian or Biblical. The comprise of all varieties of ideologies, some which would be incompatible with AIG.
The board of this particular homeschooling convention is exclusively Christian, Biblical, and YEC, and say that they "largely share AIG's perspective". But obviously not "largely" enough.
From their email to Ham:
After much prayer and deliberation over the weekend, Great Homeschool Convention's Advisory Board has unanimously decided to disinvite Ken and AIG from all future conventions, including the Cincinnati convention next week. The Board believes this to be the Lord's will for our convention and searched the Scriptures for the mind of the Lord and the leadership of the Holy Spirit before arriving at this decision. [...] Please know that our Board is 100% young earth and we largely share AIG's perspective from a scientific standpoint.
Edited by Dr Adequate, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 8:52 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Theodoric, posted 03-23-2011 9:58 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 9 of 76 (609865)
03-23-2011 9:58 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Dr Adequate
03-23-2011 9:44 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
You would think buz would at least read the article that was referenced on this before he commented.
Nah, I guess wouldn't think he would.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Dr Adequate, posted 03-23-2011 9:44 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 10:24 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 76 (609867)
03-23-2011 10:06 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by subbie
03-23-2011 9:08 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
subbie writes:
Here is a list of speakers at their next convention. I'm sure you and I would come to opposite conclusions from this list.
How so? In my reading of the whole thing, unless I missed something I only saw the word Christian once and never saw the word, Bible. I did see one couple, one of which was black and one white which debunks Arachophilia's bogus point. .
How so would we come to opposite positions?

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by subbie, posted 03-23-2011 9:08 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Theodoric, posted 03-23-2011 10:21 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 11 of 76 (609868)
03-23-2011 10:21 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 10:06 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Will you read the freaking link in the OP.
quote:
After much prayer and deliberation over the weekend, Great Homeschool Convention's Advisory Board has unanimously decided to disinvite Ken and AIG from all future conventions, including the Cincinnati convention next week. The Board believes this to be the Lord's will for our convention and searched the Scriptures for the mind of the Lord and the leadership of the Holy Spirit before arriving at this decision. The Board believes that Ken's public criticism of the convention itself and other speakers at our convention require him to surrender the spiritual privilege of addressing our homeschool audience.Please know that our Board is 100% young earth and we largely share AIG's perspective from a scientific standpoint. That is why Ken was originally invited and treated so graciously and extremely generously in Memphis and Greenville (far beyond what we do for other speakers or their ministries). Our expression of sacrifice and extraordinary kindness towards Ken and AIG has been returned to us and our attendees with Ken publicly attacking our conventions and other speakers. Our Board believes Ken's comments to be unnecessary, ungodly, and mean-spirited statements that are divisive at best and defamatory at worst.
One of the core values of our convention is that we believe that good people can disagree and still be good people. We believe that Christians do not need to personally question the integrity, the intelligence, or the salvation of other Christians when debating Biblical issues. Ken has obviously felt led to publicly attack our conventions and a number of our speakers. We believe that what Ken has said and done is unChristian and sinful. A number of attendees are demanding explanations from our board and we must respond to them.
We believe that Dr. Ham is very intelligent and deliberate and that he decided that publicly slandering our conventions and defaming a number of our speakers is what he wanted to do. Whereas Ken chooses to conduct himself in a way that we believe to be unscriptural, we cannot countenance that spirit as we believe it would not honor the Savior whom we serve.
A public statement will be prepared for distribution at the convention explaining our Board's decision. Anyone who inquires regarding Dr. Ham or AIG will be referred to that statement. We have no intention to defame or publicly slander Dr. Ham, the Creation Museum, or the work of AIG. Our Board would respectfully request that Dr. Ham and AIG prayerfully consider doing the same. Our Board takes seriously the admonition of Jesus in John 13:35, "By this shall all men know that ye are My disciples, if ye have love one to another.
Sincerely,
Brennan Dean
Great Homeschool Conventions, Inc.
No, not christian at all. Must be those damn Unitarians.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 10:06 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 17 by dwise1, posted 03-24-2011 1:18 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 76 (609869)
03-23-2011 10:24 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Theodoric
03-23-2011 9:58 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Theodoric writes:
You would think buz would at least read the article that was referenced on this before he commented.
Nah, I guess wouldn't think he would.
My comments pertained to homeschooling organizations at large. Evidently some are more diverse and inclusive than others.
Admittedly, I have little knowledge about the organizations, though I know people of diverse ideologies who homeschool, one large family in particular, being more Native American pagan in belief, having no regard for anything Biblical. I've been in their home and we get along better better than most who know them, though we have little in common ideologically.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The Immeasurable Present Eternally Extends the Infinite Past And Infinitely Consumes The Eternal Future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Theodoric, posted 03-23-2011 9:58 PM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by subbie, posted 03-23-2011 10:30 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 14 by Coyote, posted 03-23-2011 10:36 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1255 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


Message 13 of 76 (609870)
03-23-2011 10:30 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 10:24 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
My comments pertained to homeschooling organizations at large. Evidently some are more diverse and inclusive than others.
Admittedly, I have little knowledge about the organizations,
Well, when did lack of knowledge ever keep you from spouting off?
{Move along - No real content here. - Adminnemooseus}
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : It the stuff in red.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
...creationists have a great way to detect fraud and it doesn't take 8 or 40 years or even a scientific degree to spot the fraud--'if it disagrees with the bible then it is wrong'.... -- archaeologist

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 10:24 PM Buzsaw has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Adminnemooseus, posted 03-23-2011 10:59 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

  
Coyote
Member (Idle past 2106 days)
Posts: 6117
Joined: 01-12-2008


Message 14 of 76 (609871)
03-23-2011 10:36 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Buzsaw
03-23-2011 10:24 PM


Re: Homeschooling conventions
Native American pagan...
Maybe they are right and you are wrong.
From Alexander Pope, Essay on Man:

Lo, the poor Indian! whose untutor'd mind
Sees God in clouds, or hears him in the wind;
His soul proud Science never taught to stray
Far as the solar walk or milky way;
Yet simple nature to his hope has giv'n,
Behind the cloud-topt hill, an humbler Heav'n,
Some safer world in depth of woods embraced,
Some happier island in the wat'ry waste,
Where slaves once more their native land behold,
No fiends torment, no Christians thirst for gold.
To be, contents his natural desire;
He asks no Angel's wing, no Seraph's fire;
But thinks, admitted to that equal sky,
His faithful dog shall bear him company.

Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Buzsaw, posted 03-23-2011 10:24 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 15 of 76 (609872)
03-23-2011 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by subbie
03-23-2011 10:30 PM


Less grump, more nice please
Well, when did lack of knowledge ever keep you from spouting off?
Shall we strive for a little more "nice", Minnesota or otherwise?
No replies to this message, in this topic. There is a better place somewhere (something to do with "important topics").
Adminnemooseus

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by subbie, posted 03-23-2011 10:30 PM subbie has seen this message but not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024