DB writes:
To detrmine there is no designer,you need to remove obvious order, otherwise all youve done is assumed his non-existence
None of this really helps our ability to consistently differentiate between that which is designed and that which is not.
How can we objectively tell design from non-design? That is the question being asked here.
If "obvious order" is the key then how do we objectively measure "order"? What units could order be measured in?
Unless there is a way to objectively measure order any argument for design on the basis of order will be purely subjective.
"I think this rock is so ordered as to indicate design"
"Well I think the same rock is unordered enough to have arisen via natural processes"
Likewise the same conversation could be had about life. But with no objective benchmark with which to evaluate order how can we even possibly begin to decide the point at which an object becomes too ordered to have arisen naturally? It just becomes a contest of words.
Is a man made box really more ordered than a snowflake? Subjectively I would say not.
If the argument for design rests almost entirely on the concept of order then those who advocate it would be best served by trying to determine a means of measuring order and then going onto show that a certain level of order is unobtainable by natural processes alone.
Because all of the observed evidence we have strongly suggests that mindless natural processes are capable of great feats of "order". Whatever exactly that is.
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