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Author Topic:   Why are there no human apes alive today?
LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 525 of 1075 (622316)
07-02-2011 10:00 AM
Reply to: Message 524 by Nuggin
07-02-2011 9:19 AM


Re: More evolved?
G'day Nuggin,
Animals are slaves of instinct. They do not have the ability to reason deductively and do not have the power of self determination. That is why you've never read a good book written by a turtle. And why apes have never ventured into space.

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 524 by Nuggin, posted 07-02-2011 9:19 AM Nuggin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 526 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 10:06 AM LucyTheApe has replied
 Message 539 by Nuggin, posted 07-02-2011 11:59 AM LucyTheApe has not replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 527 of 1075 (622318)
07-02-2011 10:24 AM
Reply to: Message 526 by jar
07-02-2011 10:06 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space.
Can you give me an example of an animal that has created an automaton?
Or a bird that decided it wanted to be landscape architect?
Edited by AdminModulous, : content hidden use peek to see

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 526 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 10:06 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 528 by Coyote, posted 07-02-2011 10:29 AM LucyTheApe has not replied
 Message 529 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 10:30 AM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 530 of 1075 (622321)
07-02-2011 11:04 AM
Reply to: Message 529 by jar
07-02-2011 10:30 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
OK Jar, next questions...

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 529 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 10:30 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 531 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:11 AM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 532 of 1075 (622325)
07-02-2011 11:31 AM
Reply to: Message 531 by jar
07-02-2011 11:11 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
Jar, do you have a reference to the memoirs of those space apes? Are you saying that humans are apes?
Do you really want to address my stated differences between humans and animals, or not?

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 531 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:11 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 533 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:32 AM LucyTheApe has replied
 Message 535 by Coyote, posted 07-02-2011 11:46 AM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 534 of 1075 (622329)
07-02-2011 11:40 AM
Reply to: Message 533 by jar
07-02-2011 11:32 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
Jar, at least try. When and why did only one type of animal develop the ability to reason?
How and why is it, that only one type of animal can decide how to live its life?

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 533 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:32 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 536 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:52 AM LucyTheApe has replied
 Message 547 by Larni, posted 07-02-2011 12:33 PM LucyTheApe has not replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 538 of 1075 (622333)
07-02-2011 11:54 AM
Reply to: Message 535 by Coyote
07-02-2011 11:46 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
Thanks and G'day Coyote, nice list of suppositions, but no mention of the development of REASON and SELF DETERMINATION.

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 535 by Coyote, posted 07-02-2011 11:46 AM Coyote has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 540 by Coyote, posted 07-02-2011 12:00 PM LucyTheApe has replied
 Message 544 by ZenMonkey, posted 07-02-2011 12:25 PM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 542 of 1075 (622337)
07-02-2011 12:06 PM
Reply to: Message 536 by jar
07-02-2011 11:52 AM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
Jar unwittingly writes:
There is ample evidence that Gorillas, Bonobos, Chimpanzees, Orangutans, Ravens, Crows, Mockingbirds, Beaver, Elephant, Dolphin as well as other critters have the ability to reason and decide how to live their lives.
Great, lets have some examples. And it is of the utmost importance to this thread; you are saying Apes are human.

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 536 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 11:52 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 543 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 12:13 PM LucyTheApe has replied
 Message 546 by Coragyps, posted 07-02-2011 12:32 PM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 548 of 1075 (622343)
07-02-2011 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 543 by jar
07-02-2011 12:13 PM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
Jar, what does it mean to be human?
No, I am saying that humans are apes. I am one of the Great Apes. You are one of the Great Apes. All humans are Primates.
So at least some apes are human according to you. But you're Great, hey? Just like Darwin et al were the highest form of animal; the apex of the evolutionary process.
What place does your a priori " All humans are Primates." have in this debate? Those things are for your personal world view.
In this very thread there are examples of ravens reasoning and building tools. Have you read the thread?
I've already explained I'm talking about deductive reasoning not induction. All living animals learn from experience, that's instinct. I haven't read all the posts in the thread, but I will.
Is there any differences between the abilities of humans and apes; and if so what are they, in your opinion?

There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
blz paskal

This message is a reply to:
 Message 543 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 12:13 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 549 by jar, posted 07-02-2011 1:16 PM LucyTheApe has not replied
 Message 555 by Mazzy, posted 07-02-2011 3:02 PM LucyTheApe has replied

LucyTheApe
Inactive Member


Message 550 of 1075 (622345)
07-02-2011 1:31 PM
Reply to: Message 540 by Coyote
07-02-2011 12:00 PM


Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
LTA in response to Coyote re: where are the suppositions writes:
  • Forward-facing eyes for binocular vision (allowing depth perception)

  • Increased reliance on vision:

  • Grasping fingers aid in power grip
  • Flattened nails for fingertip protection, development of very sensitive tactile pads on digits

  • Primitive limb structure, one upper limb bone, two lower limb bones, many mammalian orders have lost various bones, especially fusing of the two lower limb bones

  • Generalist teeth for an opportunistic, omnivorous diet; loss of some primitive mammalian dentition, humans have lost two premolars

  • Progressive and increasingly efficient development of gestational processes

  • Prolongation of postnatal life periods

  • Reduced litter sizeusually just one (allowing mobility with clinging young and more individual attention to young)

  • Complicated social organization
  • To mention a few.
    If you can't see it I can't help you!

    There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
    blz paskal

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 540 by Coyote, posted 07-02-2011 12:00 PM Coyote has seen this message but not replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 553 by Percy, posted 07-02-2011 2:45 PM LucyTheApe has not replied

    LucyTheApe
    Inactive Member


    Message 551 of 1075 (622346)
    07-02-2011 1:41 PM
    Reply to: Message 544 by ZenMonkey
    07-02-2011 12:25 PM


    Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
    Hi Zen Monkey we have a lot in common, we are both primates.
    ZM writes:
    To bring this around to the alleged topic of this thread, I don't think that it's surprising that no other of our Homo cousins have survived. What's surprising is that we've lasted this long.
    This is an interesting observation, can you please elaborate?

    There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
    blz paskal

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 544 by ZenMonkey, posted 07-02-2011 12:25 PM ZenMonkey has not replied

    LucyTheApe
    Inactive Member


    Message 552 of 1075 (622347)
    07-02-2011 2:20 PM
    Reply to: Message 546 by Coragyps
    07-02-2011 12:32 PM


    Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
    Thanks Coragyps,
    The Caledonian Crow is a fine example of inductive learning, adaptive behavior, without which no life would survive.
    And yes, I get the picture;

    Your perspectiveAnd mine

    There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
    blz paskal

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 546 by Coragyps, posted 07-02-2011 12:32 PM Coragyps has not replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 560 by Percy, posted 07-02-2011 3:31 PM LucyTheApe has not replied
     Message 567 by Nuggin, posted 07-02-2011 4:12 PM LucyTheApe has not replied

    LucyTheApe
    Inactive Member


    Message 735 of 1075 (623268)
    07-09-2011 1:38 AM
    Reply to: Message 555 by Mazzy
    07-02-2011 3:02 PM


    Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
    G'day Mazzy.
    Mazzy the enlightened writes:
    ...the difference between mankind and apes is our higher reasoning powers and perception. Mankind was created in the image of God...
    They still haven't shown how an ape developed the ability to do mathematics; they can't. They also wont be able to show how apes developed to ability to percieve reality and determine their destiny. They will just use the same useless rhetoric they have always used.
    Mazzy the enlightened writes:
    I suggest there are no mid species fossils found. Rather they are either human or ape.
    They'll create them out of their imagination, something that they have no answer for in their evolutionary paradigm.
    It's difficult to understand that intelligent humans can hold such a ridiculous belief.
    Edited by LucyTheApe, : grammar

    There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
    blz paskal

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 555 by Mazzy, posted 07-02-2011 3:02 PM Mazzy has not replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 736 by hooah212002, posted 07-09-2011 1:59 AM LucyTheApe has replied
     Message 738 by Dr Adequate, posted 07-09-2011 2:28 AM LucyTheApe has not replied

    LucyTheApe
    Inactive Member


    Message 739 of 1075 (623275)
    07-09-2011 2:31 AM
    Reply to: Message 736 by hooah212002
    07-09-2011 1:59 AM


    Re: Apes have ventured into space and animals that have built automatons.
    hooha the descenter writes:
    a cosmic Jewish zombie screwed his own teenager virgin mother so he could get her pregnant with himself. He did this so he could sacrifice himself to himself in order to save the world from himself because a rib-woman was convinced by a talking snake with legs to eat fruit from a magical tree
    The Angel Gabriel approached Mary, our Mother and Eternal Virgin, and asked her if she would consent to be overcome by the Holy Spirit to inpregnate her; She agreed. God then became flesh. Sin requires blood. He shed his blood for our sins.
    Did Adam walk out of the garden proud. I don't think so, he left a broken man doomed to die, he realised what he had done and so did Eve.

    There no doubt exist natural laws, but once this fine reason of ours was corrupted, it corrupted everything.
    blz paskal

    This message is a reply to:
     Message 736 by hooah212002, posted 07-09-2011 1:59 AM hooah212002 has seen this message but not replied

    Replies to this message:
     Message 745 by Nuggin, posted 07-09-2011 4:02 AM LucyTheApe has not replied

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