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Author Topic:   Senator Al Franken?
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 44 of 300 (491950)
12-24-2008 6:24 PM
Reply to: Message 43 by Rrhain
12-24-2008 1:46 AM


Minnesota vs Florida
I can't help but wonder what the final outcome of the 2000 election would have been if they had been so ... civilized? ... thorough? ... patient about the recounting there, rather than trying to stampede the results to fit a non-existent calendar.
I note that we are still before the inauguration time ...
Enjoy.

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 43 by Rrhain, posted 12-24-2008 1:46 AM Rrhain has replied

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 126 of 300 (823921)
11-19-2017 9:59 AM
Reply to: Message 125 by Minnemooseus
11-19-2017 4:49 AM


Rush to Judgement with story origin from Faux Noise?
It appears that there is more to the story that what has been initially reported ...
quote:
New Information On Franken’s Accuser Proves MSM Is Botching This Story
Accusing someone of sexual assault is not an easy task, especially when the accused is in a major position of power. Ever since the #MeToo movement swept the nation, more and more woman are coming out and revealing their abusers. But here’s the thing: not everyone accused of sexual assault is always guilty. Moreover, it’s probably best to thoroughly report on a major sexual allegation.
Yesterday’s news of Senator Franken (D-MN) allegedly engaging in sexual misconduct during a USO trip caused a firestorm on Twitter. But Franken, being a gentleman and totally unlike creepo Roy Moore, immediately apologized to Leeann Tweeden, the woman pictured in the photo at the USO tour.
Perhaps in a rush to beat other networks to the punch in their shaming of Franken, the MSM has been completely reckless in covering this story. Firstly, they didn’t even bother to contact the photographer and get some context behind the photo that shows Franken apparently groping a sleeping Tweeden. Oddly enough, Tweeden was wearing a kevlar vest, military helmet, and sitting upright in a chair. The photographer has since spoken up.
But the bigger issue is how the MSM has completely failed to report on Tweeden’s fishy connections to right-wing media, which may or may not show Tweeden as trying to humiliate someone with whom she disagrees with politically.
Tweeden, for example, is no neutral party.
... Tweeden on Fox News’ Hannity calling Shirley Sherrod a racist Remember, Sherrod was attacked and set up by bogus journalism by Breitbart. To be clear, Tweeden was a participant in the right-wing echo chamber, amplifying and reinforcing the message of Breitbart.
Samantha Sanderson‏ @SamSanderson123
Replying to @danacbell @owillis
Al Franken isn't going to resign. He has two witnesses ... he had an escort/bodyguard who never left his side and says this didn't happen and the photographer saying she was in on the staging .. also @LeeannTweeden is on Hannity's show constantly ...
It was a comedy skit in poor taste and nobody is making apologies for Franken’s behavior. But that Tweeden is a Trump supporter with a history of appearing on decidedly right-wing news shows, makes this whole thing smell like a rotting corpse. Franken, of course, didn’t respond to her accusation by attacking her like Roy Moore did; he apologized and Tweeden accepted.
In contrast with Roy Scumbag Moore, Franken has requested an ethics inquiry ...
Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 125 by Minnemooseus, posted 11-19-2017 4:49 AM Minnemooseus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 127 by RAZD, posted 11-20-2017 10:53 AM RAZD has seen this message but not replied
 Message 133 by Minnemooseus, posted 11-21-2017 12:05 AM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 127 of 300 (823950)
11-20-2017 10:53 AM
Reply to: Message 126 by RAZD
11-19-2017 9:59 AM


Re: Rush to Judgement with story origin from Faux Noise?
More evidence that Tweeden's claim is politically motivated and misinformation:
quote:
Newly Released Photos And Videos Just Cast Doubt On The Claims Of Al Franken’s Accuser
In the tumultuous aftermath of Leeann Tweeden’s accusations against Al Franken during a 2006 USO trip to Kuwait, Iraq, and Afghanistan, new photos and videos have emerged that cast doubt on her account.
During the very same USO tour in question, Tweeden can be seen blatantly groping the backside of a male performer and kissing another.
While the details surrounding the rest of Tweeden’s interactions on this tour are still unclear, the images and videos of a woman who is not nearly as prim and puritanical as she has let on are striking, to say the least.
This USO tour is not the only time that Tweeden has put her sexually aggressive behavior on display. At one point, she even did so with the iconic, late Robin Williams.
It should also be noted that Tweeden just signed a book deal with Sinclair Broadcasting Group, which has also inked deals with prominent conservative voices, including Sebastian Gorka, Steve Bannon, and the Mercers.
As evidence has begun to spread that perhaps Tweeden had a political agenda behind her decision to name Franken, a growing movement of support has coalesced behind the Minnesota Senator.
If it is revealed that she perverted the important #MeToo campaign to launch a smear job on a Senator who has been a vital advocate for women, it would be a major blow to victims of sexual harassment and assault across the country.
So it looks like she owes Franken an apology, and also one to all the real victims of sexual assault as this ploy weakens the #metoo movement, and it gives perverts like Roy Moore a window to claim the women are just doing it for attention .. like Tweeden.
Curious that this claim of hers only came out now that Roy Moore is in trouble because of sexually assaulting girls.
Curious that it emanates from Faux Noise Nutwerk where she serves as part of the echo chamber.
Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 126 by RAZD, posted 11-19-2017 9:59 AM RAZD has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 131 of 300 (823986)
11-20-2017 5:56 PM
Reply to: Message 130 by NoNukes
11-20-2017 1:50 PM


Re: Rush to Judgement with story origin from Faux Noise?
... Tweeden groped another performer? Did that turn out to be unwanted? ...
Is that the standard now? Gropers will applaud. She's done her job, and now they can vote for Roy Moore?
Tweeden was seen kissing another performer? ...
Remember her complaint is that Franken kissed her, a kiss was part of the act (there is footage), and there was no actual groping (just staged "bathroom humor" pretend to grope gag and she was in on it).
In other words, she was doing exactly what she complained Franken was doing ... do we have one standard for men and a different one for women? Not for me.
It was a USO show and some bawdiness was expected ... as is tradition (look at old Bob Hope footage ... or do we have to classify HIM as a groper now ...)
... but I won't react by differently to what seem to be attempts at shaming the victim ...
So question the source of the story (the Faux Noise echo chamber of which she is a active member), question the accuracy of the claim (does any of the footage support it), question the politics (she is an ardent Trump supporter), and question the timing of the claim (why now when Roy Moore is in the headlines) ... does the claim pass the smell test?
Personally I think it stinks.
Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 130 by NoNukes, posted 11-20-2017 1:50 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 132 by NoNukes, posted 11-20-2017 7:19 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 134 of 300 (824015)
11-21-2017 10:27 AM
Reply to: Message 132 by NoNukes
11-20-2017 7:19 PM


Re: Rush to Judgement with story origin from Faux Noise?
... Tweeden groped another performer? Did that turn out to be unwanted? ...
Is that the standard now?
Is that the standard now?
Yes. The standard for whether sexual contact between adults is even a problem is strictly based on consent. You are saying that she kissed somebody and that she grabbed somebody else's butt. Absent those folks having a problem with it, or those folks being intimidated by her, you haven't shown me a problem yet.
The question was about post kiss "consent" not prior ... you seem to say it is okay if it is post kiss consented. I don't.
And context is important -- this occurred during the same show, it was part of the whole routine, and such routines are rehearsed, so the time to object is during the rehearsal. Additionally the Al Franken kiss is a prelude to her calling a soldier up to kiss. We can take this as the purpose of the skit: kiss a random serviceman as a proxy for all the soldiers. It's entertainment.
Personally I think you are reacting exactly the way this issue was raised to do: distract from Roy Moore and gaslight people into stepping down the 50 shades of grey between a stage kiss and a statutory rape. One is disappointing at worst while the other is absolutely deplorable and the perp should be in jail.
She's done her job, and now they can vote for Roy Moore?
Roy Moore is scum. That is completely independent of whether or not Al Franken groped anyone.
And yet you are talking about Franken and not Moore. Like I said, the publication of this issue at this time is for the purpose of distraction and gaslighting, and it looks like job done.
I am addressing an attack on her that has a completely different basis. The attack I am rejecting seems to be based on either the accuser being a slut or having participated in sexual misconduct or her own.
o we have one standard for men and a different one for women? Not for me
No. If she did what she was accused of, that does not get Al Franken off, in my opinion.
Except that it was staged, and both occurred on stage during the skit. Taking it as anything else is like quote-mining: taking it out of context to make it seem different than it was.
We also have the curious incident of the party celebrating Franken's election ... and she was there and all smiles and congratulations, etc ... the incident was not used then to discredit Franken before the election, which would have been a more appropriate timing than now, when Franken is not up for election and Roy Moore is.
Franken has asked for a senate ethics investigation, not a normal course from someone who is guilty.
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 135 of 300 (824017)
11-21-2017 10:36 AM
Reply to: Message 133 by Minnemooseus
11-21-2017 12:05 AM


50 shades of gaslighting
I think the photo clearly is staged, maybe or maybe not with Tweeden's awake participation. The photo documented a variety of "bad taste humor" but does not document a groping.
... Maybe she is telling the truth, but would one find the statement "Fox News corespondent lies to make liberal politician look bad" implausable?
Now consider that the purpose is not to make Franken look bad, but it is aired now to distract attention from Roy Moore sexual predator ... that the purpose is to create false equivalence between a stage kiss and statutory rape.
That goal seems to be accomplished.
Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 133 by Minnemooseus, posted 11-21-2017 12:05 AM Minnemooseus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 136 by NoNukes, posted 11-21-2017 12:35 PM RAZD has replied

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 137 of 300 (824026)
11-21-2017 1:39 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by NoNukes
11-21-2017 12:35 PM


Vote for Doug Jones with Campaign Donations
Not going to happen to me at least. But what difference do I make? I don't vote in Alabama.
But you do vote in America, and winning a senate seat from the republicans would (a) knock Thrump down another notch and (b) help prevent more republican disastrous bills and judge appointments from passing.
You can help by contributing to Doug Jones
Go to Doug Jones for Senate
and Contribute
I have a weekly donation going to him, because Roy Moore should be in jail, not the senate.
Enjoy
Edited by RAZD, : st

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by NoNukes, posted 11-21-2017 12:35 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(2)
Message 139 of 300 (824081)
11-22-2017 1:55 PM
Reply to: Message 138 by NoNukes
11-21-2017 2:45 PM


The other woman
Well this just got a little more interesting ...
The image on the left is obviously photoshopped (where did that green patch come from on the wall) ... but why do that when you have the one on the right?
Well the word is that it was photoshopped as well:
quote:
facebook post
Some sharp eyed hero pointed out there was something fishy on this photograph.
And there it is. Clone duplication on the woman's shoulder where Franken's hand was.
There are residual smudges outlining fingers.
Anyone who's used Photoshop to play with images knows; you Clone the nearest clean patch and paste it over the object to be removed.
But you can accidentally leave "color smudges" behind.
There they are.
Shaped like "fingers".
Which means this was a lie from the BEGINNING.
and in the comments
quote:
Kris Broderick If you zoom in you can even see the blocks of cloned pixels... are very definitely not like the rest of the picture.
Why?
Because Franken's hand was on her shoulder, and they had to hide the fingers ...
So
Franken is being "swiftboated" and maligned with false information, in an attempt to deflect news from Roy Moore child molester, pedophile and statutory rapist, and to provide false equivalence to gaslight people, especially voters in Alabama, into thinking it's ok to condone\vote for despicable Moore.
quote:

The Al Franken Scandal Is A Godsend For Alabama Republicans
Nobody in the Alabama GOP wants to talk about Roy Moore it’s bad politics. Everyone else is fair game.
HUNTSVILLE, Ala. ― At the monthly meeting of the Madison County Republican Men’s Club here on Saturday, the subject at hand was Judge Roy Moore. You could tell from the way people kept talking about anyone and anything else, such as Sen. Al Franken.
The keynote speaker of the event, for which nearly 200 Moore supporters shared breakfast inside a Methodist church’s gymnasium, was Tommy Battle, Huntsville’s mayor and gubernatorial candidate. Battle noticeably avoided any mention of Moore despite standing nestled among gigantic Roy Moore election posters. He spoke about veterans, jobs, the economy and the great state of Alabama, but never mentioned the judge during his speech.
Another speaker, local criminal court Judge Chess Bedsole, also tiptoed around Moore, but drew an audible reaction when he mentioned the senator from Minnesota by name.
I read in Politico that Doug Jones is taking money from Democratic senators, Bedsole said to the crowd. The four Senators that gave him the most are, Kirsten Gillibrand, Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, and our good friend, Al Franken.
He added: If you want those people telling our senator how to vote and what to do, that’s what you’ll be voting for if you vote for Doug Jones. That’s a story that didn’t make the rounds yet and we need to start pushing.
Sadly this tactic will likely win, because republicans have shown time and again they don't care squat about morality if it interferes with the GOP agenda. They just talk about it to fool the gullible.
Edited by Admin, : Change image width.

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 143 of 300 (824156)
11-23-2017 2:34 PM
Reply to: Message 141 by Minnemooseus
11-22-2017 11:45 PM


Lest we Forget -- Al Franken is NOT Roy Moore
Lest we Forget -- Al Franken is NOT Roy Moore:
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 144 of 300 (824157)
11-23-2017 2:35 PM
Reply to: Message 140 by Minnemooseus
11-22-2017 9:59 PM


Re: The other woman
Of course, this might be a photoshopping by some left winger, to make it look like some right winger had photoshopped the image.
The way Schrubbia's National Guard record was a set-up?
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 153 of 300 (824410)
11-28-2017 7:59 AM
Reply to: Message 152 by Phat
11-28-2017 3:41 AM


Re: Franken: Hold Your Ground But Be Honest
It is politics at its usual dirty best.
Not to say that Franken isn't guilty---which he wisely admitted--but waiting for the ethics committee and holding his ground appear to be good strategies for now.
So far the worst I have seen as an accusation is a hand on a buttock, not a pussy grab, and not a grapple ...
Just remember -- Al Franken is NOT Roy Moore:
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 156 of 300 (824423)
11-28-2017 12:04 PM
Reply to: Message 155 by ramoss
11-28-2017 11:28 AM


Re: Franken: Resign Now hold that thought ...
We have evidence of dirty tricks being pulled by the Republicans for political purposes in the past, and we have claims of evidence tampering in this particular set of accusations. I don't think that politicians should roll over for dirty tricks. On the other hand, they shouldn't be given a free pass either.
Indeed, the timing is suspicious, and that's why I will await the ethics committee results.
I would also like to see similar investigations done for all politicians who have settled similar accusations by paying off the accusers with taxpayer money or contributions.
and I still don't see how Franken's purported actions rise to the level of child sex trading and serial child abuse.
If Franken resigns and other more serious scumbags don't then that will not be just.
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 233 of 300 (825567)
12-16-2017 6:32 AM


Floodgates opening?
Heard on Facebook that the next 72 hours will see a lot of resignations.
Implied but not stated is that the names of those who used taxpayer funds to settle sexual harassment suits could become known.
Also Paul Ryan is retiring (job done?).
If so, then the 2018 elections just became a whole lot more interesting, get your popcorn ready.
Enjoy

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 237 of 300 (825675)
12-17-2017 8:49 AM
Reply to: Message 235 by Rrhain
12-16-2017 9:07 PM


another view
... But if we can't tell if I was sexually assaulted, by what right have we to say that Franken assaulted anybody?
I think we need to distinguish between inappropriate touching, sexual harassment, and sexual assault.
Consider a person going down the street and patting people on the butt -- should they be put on a sexual predator registry? I think not, just told it isn't appropriate.
A kiss with tongue falls into that category -- it's inappropriate, but it's not necessarily sexual. Groping the crotch is sexual assault. Grabbing a breast is sexual assault. Reaching inside someones clothes is sexual assault.to
Continually asking someone to have sex is sexual harassment not assault
My experience - when I was 19 that involved me being too drunk to stand, and a person unzipped me and fondled my boys - was sexual assault. It was not a kiss. It was not a request.
Lumping these together in my mind diminishes the actual sexual assault. Just like making false claims diminishes #MeToo.
Franken, as far as I can see, at most made inappropriate contact and inappropriate mock (for a gag photo) groping, but not actual sexual assault.
Meanwhile in the last 24 hours we have two more republicans and one more democrat that will be resigning and one mention of a woman being accused of sexual harassment.
Now I do think that sexual harassment and inappropriate touching are not proper for an elected official. I also think that sexual assault should lead to prosecution and if convicted to being registered as a sexual predator.
The 2018 elections will be quite interesting.
Enjoy

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 235 by Rrhain, posted 12-16-2017 9:07 PM Rrhain has replied

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1491 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 244 of 300 (825852)
12-18-2017 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 243 by Percy
12-18-2017 11:11 AM


Re: Why no ethics committee hearing for Franken
... The ethics committee hasn't investigated sexual harassment or assault allegations in 25 years, Axios reports - I wonder if Franken knew that when he invited investigation.
And the reason they haven't is ...
... the allegations were being "settled" (paid off) with taxpayer money, so the amounts and the perps would not be a matter of public record and continue to sit in congress and on committees ... like the ethics committee?
Certainly having a hearing on Franken would open the door to exposing these other accusations, particularly if Franken was one.
And I still think there is no comparison between Al Franken's alleged actions and the alleged statutory rape by Moore and Trump and the admitted sexual assault of women by Trump in the Hollywood Bus tapes, grabbing by the p***y -- attempted rape?
One is inappropriate behavior for an elected official, the other is a prosecutable offense.
But now, even worse (imho) is the walking back of democrats on Franken's resignation: it becomes situational morality all over again.

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