Belief...a choice?

We are back at the idea that spiritual belief requires a different mechanism than naturalistic belief. If the choice is that of God to impart or not impart evidence, how does this affect the admonition that He wants us all to follow Him? Are you saying that He doesn't give this evidence to everyone? If so, then He becomes responsible for our failing to believe.
If He does give this evidence to everyone, then why does He make the evidence so subtle that many don't realize that it is evidence or even realize it is anything at all?
Since God is omniscient, He should know what it takes to get each of us to believe. The choice of following is still ours and He can allow free will to reign in that arena. How is that value measured?

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He has succeeded in is bid for anonymity

zolThe problem is two fold. First, your analogy was simply terrible and in fact 100% wrong in relation to this thread. Wind is a great example of belief based on evidence. Wind is something that everyone can test, measure, demonstrate, document.Second, in your response you wander off into making a whole host of unfounded statements about the Bible, none of which have anything to do with the subject.Try to stick with the subject.

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Aslan is not a Tame Lion

The problem with the analogies given are that both 'invisible' sources of the effects mentioned do just that...HAVE AN EFFECT! God doesn't seem to have an effect, on anything. Does He help you in a time of crisis? The bible states that your faith or belief gets you through the tough times. So God doesn't even help you there...your belief or faith in God does.If Jesus' deciples (Christians by inference) "will do greater things than these" as Christ says, then where are the resurrections, miraculous healings, water into wine, walking on water, and multiplications of food that we should expect. Note: Christ said that His followers will not might do these things.Show me an effect that can be definitively attributed to God/Jesus and I will concede that your analogies have some merit. Of course you should be able to rule out all other reasonable causes for this example you provide.Until then I suspect you will influence more people if you don't get upset when someone points out that your poor analogy should be judged based on its lack of merit.

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He has succeeded in is bid for anonymity

But it is exactly because we can sense the wind in other ways, "touch" being one, that means your analogy breaks down. The wind is not unobservable.You are asking for acceptance of things that are not objectively observable to be accepted. There are an infinite number of such things. How would one distinguish between them?

If you were on trial I think you might like people in the jury to "suspend [their] feelings" so as not to "bias their conclusion". So, feelings are certainly not appropriate for many situations, and science is not the only place they should be discouraged when making a decision.

you did not answer my question. But that is ok.

that is sweet, thank you.

I don't think you are doing a very good job of contributing to the discussion in a productive way with little posts like that.Please give more thought before posting.If you think you're being picked on; you're right. I intend to for the next while.

What about the guy who finds out that she might be pregnant? "Oh God, I hope she isn't pregnant!"Dennis Miller IS funny, however. There is truth to it. We tend not to pray unless things are not going OUR way. Pesky human nature.

Hey, Lin. I said:The evidence for belief is an impartation that is not measureable apart from the value of it. You replied, My answer? The only way that I have been able to sense Him is the fact that He is now alive in me whereas He previously was not. The value is infinite! My perception of it is to accept Him, yet I COULD refuse Him in which case the value would be zero. Many are called yet few chosen. He chooses all, yet not all choose Him.

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that is sweet, thank you.

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uhh, you're welcome, I think.Since your response was so short and contentless, I don't know if you are being serious or sarcastic.Don't you want to actually respond to what I said. I thought I made some interesting points.

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Dennis Miller IS funny, however.

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He used to be, anyway.Now that he's gotten old he's turned into a conservative asshole. Back when he skewered everybody he was great.

Regarding Belief as a choice...Is Belief formed out of experience? If so, I maintain that much of my personal belief arose out of experience(s) which I regarded as an impartation of the Spirit but which SOME people may label an overactive imagination!

LinearAq responds to JazzloverPR:

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It seems that we agree on belief in that it cannot really be a choice. Rather it is something that grows out of evidence, experience and teaching.

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That still doesn't prevent the phenomenon from being an informed choice. In the same way as your heredity, your upbringing and past experience can strongly influence your choice of a mate, your decision to marry (and who you marry) is a conscious choice.My parents aren't fundies by any means, but neither are they particularly science-savvy. I still recall my mother mentioning seashells in the mountaintops, and her forthright belief that this supported the worldwide flood myth. Later in life, when I learned more about geology, it made more sense that seashells in the mountains were the result of plate tectonics. My basis for knowledge was logic and reason, and I didn't consider it an affront to my heritage to expand my knowledge of the world.We don't choose the time or place in which we're born. We can't see the world through the eyes of someone born and educated in a different era, and we can't completely disregard the perspective that we owe to modern science and technology. However, we decide what's meaningful to us and judge the plausibility of certain beliefs according to what we already acknowledge as reality.regards,
Esteban Hambre

I agree, and in particular, our acknowledgment of reality plays a large role in our individual beliefs. To a man who has encountered a U.F.O. or who thought that he did, reality would be defined in a differing context from what science alone teaches.