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Author Topic:   Your eternal destination: you decide.
Archer Opteryx
Member (Idle past 3598 days)
Posts: 1811
From: East Asia
Joined: 08-16-2006


Message 196 of 246 (361838)
11-05-2006 1:06 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by alacrity fitzhugh
11-05-2006 11:08 AM


Re: beyond . . . doubt
Thanks, AF, for a lovely picture of a lovely lady.
Where did I ever say I believed in god/s?
I understood ts to be speaking generally--a bit of wisdom in harmony with your comment in Message 189 about not limiting oneself.
I'd like to put that in my quote file, ts. Is that original with you?
___
Edited by Archer Opterix, : HTML.

Archer
All species are transitional.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by alacrity fitzhugh, posted 11-05-2006 11:08 AM alacrity fitzhugh has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 198 by alacrity fitzhugh, posted 11-05-2006 2:44 PM Archer Opteryx has not replied

  
Legend
Member (Idle past 5006 days)
Posts: 1226
From: Wales, UK
Joined: 05-07-2004


Message 197 of 246 (361876)
11-05-2006 2:37 PM
Reply to: Message 185 by iano
11-04-2006 7:13 PM


Re: so many choices
You can't do that which he said would gain you life. "Do unto others". You can't do it.
well, sorry to disappoint you, but I do. I treat others like I want to be treated myself. I will never do to someone else what I wouldn't like someone else doing to myself (unless they ask for it ofcourse ).

"In life, you have to face that some days you'll be the bug and some days you'll be the windscreen."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by iano, posted 11-04-2006 7:13 PM iano has not replied

  
alacrity fitzhugh
Member (Idle past 4289 days)
Posts: 194
Joined: 02-10-2004


Message 198 of 246 (361880)
11-05-2006 2:44 PM
Reply to: Message 196 by Archer Opteryx
11-05-2006 1:06 PM


Re: beyond . . . doubt
archer opterix writes:
Thanks, AF, for a lovely picture of a lovely lady.
You are welcome, just that when I googling Guan Yin it came up with over 1.5 million links that was in the one that mention Taiwan. Figured I post it. Wanted to ask after I saw it if this is where David Mack got the idea for his character Kabuki ( Keyboard was and is still acting up, placing 7 intermittently while typing, need new batteries.)? I saw jar posted some excellent info, like he aways does.
archer opterix writes:
I understood ts to be speaking generally--a bit of wisdom in harmony with your comment in Message 189 about not limiting oneself.
If that is what ts meant, then I apologize. qs

Look to this day, For yesterday is already a dream. And tomorrow only a vision. But today We lived, makes every Yesterday a dream of Happiness and every tomorrow A vision of hope. Look well there to This day.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 196 by Archer Opteryx, posted 11-05-2006 1:06 PM Archer Opteryx has not replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 199 of 246 (362120)
11-06-2006 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 177 by jar
11-04-2006 12:38 PM


Re: Still no evidence of KNOW
I did refute that assertion. First, others CAN see it.
Not crap jar, I know others can see it, that is why I presented to you differently than that, yet you keep going back to that.
The point is, you do not need to verify anything, it is plainly obvious that when you look at this forum, you are indeed looking at this forum, unless you want to start getting into some kind of abstract conversation.
Other people see and hear from God, but it is not neccessary for me to verify it with them. Everyone can llok at a cloud and see a different picture within, that doesn't mean that the cloud does not exist.
How can you know that it is GOD and not some demon?
Because demons are evil.
How do you know you are looking at this forum, and not some naked woman?
If you are honest, you admit that unless it can be tested and verified you cannot.
Verification is in your heart, since God created it.
The testing lies in your journey with Him.
He exists, but it is up to you to choose whether you want to accept it or not, and if you do accept it, just how you see fit to accept it.
You believe in God, that is some sort of verification right there. Even though your opinions differ from mine, that does not mean that god does not exist.
You though assert that you "KNOW" God.
For clarification, I always claim that I believe in God to others. I do not want to come across as a know it all. In my heart I believe I know God, would be more accurate. I say it that way, because God cannot be proven to others, except but to love them the way God loves me.
It is within your right to accept what I am saying, or not accept it.Both me and God leave it up to you, I find that to be "Christ like".
There is little doubt that I exist.
But there is always doubt. Nothing in science is ever proven. So I don't even know why we are having this conversation.
You think because there is less doubt that you exist, or should I say more proof that you exist, than God exists, that somehow you exist more than God?
I don't believe in odds, if there are odds are that it will happen, then one day it will happen. The percentage of validity has little to do with the possibilities, in reality. But for now it is the best tool we have in certain situations to acertain life. I find the lines between objectiveness and subjectiveness are blurred, and really eveything is sunbjective, because we view it through our subjective minds.
How do you know that it is God and not some demon?
Would you say that the truth has a feeling accociated with it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 177 by jar, posted 11-04-2006 12:38 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 200 by jar, posted 11-06-2006 11:45 AM riVeRraT has replied
 Message 202 by iceage, posted 11-06-2006 12:46 PM riVeRraT has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 200 of 246 (362138)
11-06-2006 11:45 AM
Reply to: Message 199 by riVeRraT
11-06-2006 9:35 AM


Still no Know and you even admit it. LOL
You think because there is less doubt that you exist, or should I say more proof that you exist, than God exists, that somehow you exist more than God?
No. That is not what I said. I said that we can verify I exist so we can say that we KNOW I exist. That is not true of GOD.
You believe in God, that is some sort of verification right there.
No that is NOT.
Because demons are evil.
How do you know you are looking at this forum, and not some naked woman?
If demons existed, and seemed evil, they would fail. If demons existed they would be like many pastors and almost all televangelists, seemingly good to con the gullible.
I know I am looking at this forum and not a naked women because it is verifiable. You respond to me. Even inanimate objects can find and catalog the forum and this thread and message.
For clarification, I always claim that I believe in God to others.
Good. So you admit yuo do not Know GOD.
In my heart I believe I know God, would be more accurate.
Finally. Yes. You believe in GOD. So do I. But I do not KNOW GOD exists, I can only believe in GOD.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by riVeRraT, posted 11-06-2006 9:35 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 201 by riVeRraT, posted 11-06-2006 12:42 PM jar has not replied

  
riVeRraT
Member (Idle past 416 days)
Posts: 5788
From: NY USA
Joined: 05-09-2004


Message 201 of 246 (362150)
11-06-2006 12:42 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by jar
11-06-2006 11:45 AM


Re: Still no Know and you even admit it. LOL
seemingly good to con the gullible.
That's evil.
I know I am looking at this forum and not a naked women because it is verifiable. You respond to me. Even inanimate objects can find and catalog the forum and this thread and message.
And still you cannot prove any of it.
For clarification, I always claim that I believe in God to others.
Good. So you admit yuo do not Know GOD.
Not to others. That's not my job.
This does not mean that I do not know God, and that god has indeed verified Himself to me.
Finally. Yes. You believe in GOD. So do I. But I do not KNOW GOD exists, I can only believe in GOD.
That's where we part ways. I know God exists, or at least the illusion that some critter is posing as God to this earth.
Nothing is 100% certain in life, so stop asking me to make it so.
But I verify God's existance on a daily basis, and He exists for me, just like this forum exists for you.
I know God exists just like I know that I exist. None of it is provable. You can't even really prove that 2+2=4.
For a long time it was not verifiable at all. But thanks to the Holy Spirit, and God's grace, my faith extends beyond just a simple belief.
I am not privy to this, anyone can experience it, that is my belief.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 200 by jar, posted 11-06-2006 11:45 AM jar has not replied

  
iceage 
Suspended Member (Idle past 5915 days)
Posts: 1024
From: Pacific Northwest
Joined: 09-08-2003


Message 202 of 246 (362151)
11-06-2006 12:46 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by riVeRraT
11-06-2006 9:35 AM


Re: Still no evidence of KNOW
Other people see and hear from God, but it is not neccessary for me to verify it with them. Everyone can look at a cloud and see a different picture within, that doesn't mean that the cloud does not exist.
The different images they see are subjective and have no bearing in reality. They will all agree that the cloud is white and puffy and the wind is blowing in a certain direction - the important parameters.
Verification is in your heart, since God created it. The testing lies in your journey with Him.
The heart pumps blood not much else going on there. Point is the term "heart" is implicit in misunderstanding. The ancients actually believed the heart was the source of feelings.
All your confirmation of your faith from experience and feelings is no less or more valid than a pious Muslim’s experience and feelings. Their strength in their faith is just as strong as yours with the same degree of "confirmation".
There is statistical proof that "feelings" and experience are a poor guide to truth and understanding. There is a dominate and overwhelming correlation that the prevailing religious faith is predicated on the prevailing culture. Very very few people go counter to the surrounding culture either way. The ones that do are the interesting ones.
Also interesting is that Jesus went counter to the prevailing culture. I have little doubt that the strict biblical believers of today would be ones stoning the adulterous women or calling for crucifixion.
Edited by iceage, : No reason given.
Edited by iceage, : No reason given.
Edited by iceage, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by riVeRraT, posted 11-06-2006 9:35 AM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 212 by riVeRraT, posted 11-06-2006 6:13 PM iceage has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 203 of 246 (362161)
11-06-2006 1:22 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by iano
11-01-2006 10:40 AM


quote:
If you were to die a few minutes from now where do you think God would send you? And why do you think he would send you there.
I'm coming here late, but to answer the question...
I have no idea where I'd be sent.
I hear so many contradictory explanations of god's character and nature that I have absolutely no basis upon which to make a prediction one way or the other.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by iano, posted 11-01-2006 10:40 AM iano has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 204 by jar, posted 11-06-2006 1:29 PM nator has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 204 of 246 (362164)
11-06-2006 1:29 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by nator
11-06-2006 1:22 PM


Yeah! The right answer!
Fantastic. Love to see right answers crop up. You get a 100 on the quiz.
see Message 11

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by nator, posted 11-06-2006 1:22 PM nator has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 207 by nator, posted 11-06-2006 1:35 PM jar has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 205 of 246 (362165)
11-06-2006 1:30 PM
Reply to: Message 32 by CK
11-01-2006 5:02 PM


Re: To be fair to Iano...
quote:
Iano - I'm scared that the crows are about to fly from London Tower and the world is about to end
Aren't those ravens, not crows, at the Tower of London?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by CK, posted 11-01-2006 5:02 PM CK has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by jar, posted 11-06-2006 1:33 PM nator has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 206 of 246 (362168)
11-06-2006 1:33 PM
Reply to: Message 205 by nator
11-06-2006 1:30 PM


Re: To be fair to Iano...
Aren't those ravens, not crows, at the Tower of London?
Yeah but two of them are just there to gather the news and will fly back to their normal place on Odin's shoulders where they will tell him what is going on in the world.

Aslan is not a Tame Lion

This message is a reply to:
 Message 205 by nator, posted 11-06-2006 1:30 PM nator has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 207 of 246 (362170)
11-06-2006 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by jar
11-06-2006 1:29 PM


Re: Yeah! The right answer!
LOL! It's all I could come up with using the information I have at hand.
Going further is just making stuff up.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by jar, posted 11-06-2006 1:29 PM jar has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 208 of 246 (362176)
11-06-2006 2:33 PM
Reply to: Message 54 by iano
11-01-2006 7:22 PM


quote:
An atheist cannot know God doesn't exist. Whereas I can know he does.
You believe you know.
But that doesn't mean you actually know.
You'd have to demonstrate a few things first.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 54 by iano, posted 11-01-2006 7:22 PM iano has not replied

  
nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 209 of 246 (362178)
11-06-2006 2:48 PM
Reply to: Message 83 by iano
11-02-2006 6:47 AM


Re: YEC = KFC
quote:
For example: I believe/think/hope the sun will rise tomorrow. I don't know that it will. If someone were to ask me what would I do were it not to I could answer them.
That is trust based upon experience. It is, in fact, true that we cannot know with 100% surety that the sun will rise tomorrow. But the probability is very high based upon many independent observations and borne out predictions.
Do you think that trusting in the likely constancy of the Physical Laws of the Universe is exactly the same as believing in an invisible, undetectable God?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 83 by iano, posted 11-02-2006 6:47 AM iano has not replied

Replies to this message:
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nator
Member (Idle past 2170 days)
Posts: 12961
From: Ann Arbor
Joined: 12-09-2001


Message 210 of 246 (362179)
11-06-2006 3:06 PM
Reply to: Message 176 by riVeRraT
11-04-2006 12:30 PM


Re: beyond a shadow of a doubt
quote:
I know many people who feel EXACTLY the same thing I feel from God.
It is not possible for you to know that.
You cannot feel what another person feels.
What, are you claiming to have PSI abilities now?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 176 by riVeRraT, posted 11-04-2006 12:30 PM riVeRraT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 213 by riVeRraT, posted 11-06-2006 6:16 PM nator has replied

  
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