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Author Topic:   What mutations are needed for a particular trait (e.g. wings) to arise?
skepticfaith
Member (Idle past 5827 days)
Posts: 71
From: NY, USA
Joined: 08-29-2006


Message 1 of 4 (344821)
08-29-2006 5:45 PM


Is it possible mathematically?
How many random mutations would it have taken to create a bird and does this even seem remotely possible? Would it not take a series of random mutations (over time of course) - the odds of this happening being almost impossible?
What is the average mutation rate expected for a creature to evolve novel characteristics that are beneficial anyway?
What would be helpful would be a scenario - even a fictional one that could explain how a creature could evolve into a bird (not just with drawings of transitional types) but an explanation of the type of mutations that are needed.
Think about it like this - what are the all the possible errors due to mutation that could happen? And what is the likelihood that one of them will be beneficial? Has this been ever calculated mathematically?
The natural selection part seems to make sense but random mutation does not. Every SINGLE example of a beneficial random mutation e.g. resistance to black plague in Europeans seems too improbable to have occurred purely by chance.
Now - I cannot show that it is improbable but have the evolutionists have shown that random mutation ALONE IS responsible for these examples? Could they not be another unexplained force behind this?
Edited by skepticfaith, : Admin requested change..

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminWounded, posted 08-29-2006 6:05 PM skepticfaith has replied

AdminWounded
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 4 (344832)
08-29-2006 6:05 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by skepticfaith
08-29-2006 5:45 PM


There are already about 3 different threads open on almost exactly this general topic.
It moight be better if you framed your OP more towards the thrust of the final section dealig with the specific character, and presumably result, of the neccessary mutations for a particular trait to arise.
Otherwise this doesn't seem clearly differentiated from the other ongoing mutatiom/macroevolution threads.
TTFN,
AW

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by skepticfaith, posted 08-29-2006 5:45 PM skepticfaith has replied

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 Message 3 by skepticfaith, posted 08-30-2006 12:07 AM AdminWounded has not replied

skepticfaith
Member (Idle past 5827 days)
Posts: 71
From: NY, USA
Joined: 08-29-2006


Message 3 of 4 (344932)
08-30-2006 12:07 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by AdminWounded
08-29-2006 6:05 PM


How's this - better? I think this is a more unique for the forum now..

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by AdminWounded, posted 08-29-2006 6:05 PM AdminWounded has not replied

AdminWounded
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 4 (344960)
08-30-2006 2:44 AM


Thread copied to the What mutations are needed for a particular trait (e.g. wings) to arise? thread in the Biological Evolution forum, this copy of the thread has been closed.

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