Can random mutations cause an increase in information in the genome?

In order to adequately discuss the issue, I'll first put forward a definition of what I mean by information in this context. Stated simply, it means organized complexity. Take the alphabet as an example; the random letters mean nothing on their own. Only when they are ordered into a complex and meaningful pattern do they take on any meaning, and thereby become information. Information is the product of a mental process, not a material one.In terms of human biology, information would be defined as the message or meaning that is derived from the ordered complexity of DNA molecules. DNA by itself means nothing unless organized into a structure that is meaningful, so DNA is not information but a medium by which information is conveyed.Evolutionary theory would require the earliest simple organisms to gain new information (ordered complexity) which would allow for new properties (ie. bone structure or body plan). However, all observations of mutations are either not moving at all or are moving in the opposite direction, meaning they are decreasing in ordered complexity or not changing at all.According to Dr. Jonathan Wells, a cell biologist at the University of Berkeley, in response to an article on this subject by Richard Dawkins:”But there is no evidence that DNA mutations can provide the sorts of variations needed for evolution ... The sorts of variations which can contribute to Darwinian evolution, however, involve things like bone structure or body plan. There is no evidence for beneficial mutations at the level of macroevolution, but there is also no evidence at the level of what is commonly regarded as microevolution.The claim that mutations explain differences among genes, which in turn explain differences among organisms, is the Neo-Darwinian equivalent of alchemy. Compare:We know that mutations happen, and that they alter DNA sequences; organisms differ in their DNA sequences, so the differences between organisms must be due (ultimately) to mutations.We know that we can change the characteristics of metals by chemical means; lead and gold have different characteristics; therefore it must be possible to change lead into gold by chemical means.In both cases, the mechanisms invoked to explain the phenomena are incapable of doing so. Darwinists (like alchemists) have misconceived the nature of reality, and thus hitched their wagon to an imaginary horse.’So, the question is...Can you provide an example of a random mutation that is known to increase the information content of the genome?This message has been edited by Garrett, 02-13-2006 02:24 PM

To begin such a discussion it is necessary that you outline the definition as you see it.Go back and edit your original post and put in what your definition is so that there is a start point for discussion.

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Thanks for taking this topic to the PNT forum.At the moment this looks like a suggestion for a topic rather than an actual useable opening post.What you would normally do for an opening post on a PNT is write a paragraph or two describing the issue you want to dicuss and maybe say something about your own views on the topic. you might want to give your own defintion of information for instance, or a reference to a particular definition you prefer.As it stands this isn't a suitable OP for a thread. Either use the *Edit* button to change your post or rephrase your OP and post it as a reply to this post.TTFN,AW

Sorry...this is my first topic submission. I'll work it up as you suggest and repost.

Thread copied to the Can random mutations cause an increase in information in the genome? thread in the Biological Evolution forum, this copy of the thread has been closed.