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Author Topic:   Does God Really Exist???
CreationMan
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 305 (86730)
02-16-2004 5:21 PM


THE COSMOS IS ALL THAT IS, EVER WAS, OR EVER WILL BE"
~ Carl Sagan
Is this statement true? Or is there really a God?

"The Fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'"
Creation Man

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-16-2004 5:25 PM CreationMan has not replied
 Message 4 by Darwin's Terrier, posted 02-17-2004 8:01 AM CreationMan has not replied
 Message 5 by Mammuthus, posted 02-17-2004 8:34 AM CreationMan has replied
 Message 220 by charlie, posted 02-25-2004 2:56 PM CreationMan has not replied
 Message 251 by WiseMan, posted 03-28-2004 9:58 PM CreationMan has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 305 (86733)
02-16-2004 5:25 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by CreationMan
02-16-2004 5:21 PM


Does it matter?

"Perhaps you should take your furs and your literal interpretations to the other side of the river."
-Anya

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by CreationMan, posted 02-16-2004 5:21 PM CreationMan has not replied

Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3974
Joined: 09-26-2002


Message 3 of 305 (86740)
02-16-2004 5:37 PM


Thread moved here from the Origin of Life forum.

Darwin's Terrier
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 305 (86931)
02-17-2004 8:01 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by CreationMan
02-16-2004 5:21 PM


Creation Man writes:
THE COSMOS IS ALL THAT IS, EVER WAS, OR EVER WILL BE"
~ Carl Sagan
Is this statement true? Or is there really a God?
Firstly, I’m not sure that that is what Sagan was getting at. But assuming it was...
It’s entirely possible that there are gods bodding around incorporeally somewhere. One thing we can be pretty certain of, however, is that if there really is a god, it is not the one advertised.
"The Fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'"
... And the wise man says it out loud.
But Dan is quite right. Who cares? I’ll start showing an interest in god when he starts showing an interest in us. Fixing malaria would be a start.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by CreationMan, posted 02-16-2004 5:21 PM CreationMan has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 44 by Lizard Breath, posted 02-17-2004 9:09 PM Darwin's Terrier has replied

Mammuthus
Member (Idle past 6476 days)
Posts: 3085
From: Munich, Germany
Joined: 08-09-2002


Message 5 of 305 (86935)
02-17-2004 8:34 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by CreationMan
02-16-2004 5:21 PM


There could be a god, gods, demi gods, supernatural killer pickles, demon farts (this one's for you Stephen) or anything else anyone wishes to come up with. However, there is no way to know, no way to go about knowing, and no way to determine which is correct among the infinite possibilities (not to mention that there is no way to falsify anything supernatural)...so as Dan indicated..who cares or why should I care?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by CreationMan, posted 02-16-2004 5:21 PM CreationMan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by MrHambre, posted 02-17-2004 9:22 AM Mammuthus has replied
 Message 8 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 10:43 AM Mammuthus has not replied

MrHambre
Member (Idle past 1393 days)
Posts: 1495
From: Framingham, MA, USA
Joined: 06-23-2003


Message 6 of 305 (86944)
02-17-2004 9:22 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Mammuthus
02-17-2004 8:34 AM


I find it curious that so many of our creationist colleagues are so hell bent (as it were) on proving God through whatever scientific procedures they deem appropriate. In science, the line cuts both ways: if a hypothesis has the possibility of being demonstrated and supported, it also runs the risk of being falsified and discarded. I assume it's a rare believer indeed who would accept the possibility that empirical evidence could falsify his belief in God, so why should he expect that the same evidence would support his philosophical belief? I'd be a betting man too, if I didn't have to call heads or tails until after the coin toss.
regards,
Esteban "Lucky" Hambre

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Mammuthus, posted 02-17-2004 8:34 AM Mammuthus has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Mammuthus, posted 02-17-2004 9:48 AM MrHambre has not replied
 Message 133 by Runner18, posted 02-19-2004 5:31 PM MrHambre has not replied

Mammuthus
Member (Idle past 6476 days)
Posts: 3085
From: Munich, Germany
Joined: 08-09-2002


Message 7 of 305 (86948)
02-17-2004 9:48 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by MrHambre
02-17-2004 9:22 AM


The misuse of science is a clear case of ignorance. However, I also have to wonder what the motivation is for even attempting to misuse or mischaracterize science in order to support ones religious beliefs. I am beginning to conclude that it is a result of very shallow and fragile faith on the part of creationists. Thus they seek support from any kind of unlikely source and are unable/unwilling to understand anything that contradicts their worldview. They do not seem to have a clear reason for believing what they believe and feel threatened by anything that challenges their beliefs. Maybe that is also why it is the fundies/poorly educated that see evolution in conflict with their beliefs in the first place. Everything seems threatening when you have no clue and at the same time it is easy to believe in things that conflict with observable reality when you are scared as well...some are even scared of farts (though I have to admit..after eating a Whopper with extra cheese one would tend to fear my demon farts as well).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by MrHambre, posted 02-17-2004 9:22 AM MrHambre has not replied

CreationMan
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 305 (86967)
02-17-2004 10:43 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Mammuthus
02-17-2004 8:34 AM


Spoiled Brat
There could be a god, gods, demi gods, supernatural killer pickles, demon farts (this one's for you Stephen) or anything else anyone wishes to come up with. However, there is no way to know, no way to go about knowing, and no way to determine..."
Have you ever stopped to actually think? If there is no way of "knowing" that there is a God, could there possibly be NO WAY of knowing that there is NO God?
I’ll start showing an interest in god when he starts showing an interest in us. Fixing malaria would be a start."
Oh I see the Invention of penicilin (sp?) and other drugs which cure fatal diseases (Polio vaccine etc.) aren't good enough for you? You want an immediate cure for everything right now. What's the matter, you don't like living with the consiquences of your own actions? You are a selfish brat who says
"I'm not going to beileve that my father exists unless he gives me all the toys I want when I want it."
Grow up and start thinking with a little logic.

"The Fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'"
Creation Man

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Mammuthus, posted 02-17-2004 8:34 AM Mammuthus has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-17-2004 11:03 AM CreationMan has replied
 Message 10 by AdminBrian, posted 02-17-2004 12:33 PM CreationMan has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 305 (86973)
02-17-2004 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by CreationMan
02-17-2004 10:43 AM


Re: Spoiled Brat
quote:
Have you ever stopped to actually think? If there is no way of "knowing" that there is a God, could there possibly be NO WAY of knowing that there is NO God?
Which brings us squarely back to "so who cares?"
For all intents and purposes, there is no God. Might there be an irrelevant one? Sure. So?
quote:
Oh I see the Invention of penicilin (sp?) and other drugs which cure fatal diseases (Polio vaccine etc.) aren't good enough for you?
I could have sworn Alexander Fleming invented penicillin.

"Perhaps you should take your furs and your literal interpretations to the other side of the river."
-Anya

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 10:43 AM CreationMan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:07 PM Dan Carroll has not replied
 Message 12 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:10 PM Dan Carroll has replied

AdminBrian
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 305 (86994)
02-17-2004 12:33 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by CreationMan
02-17-2004 10:43 AM


Re: Spoiled Brat
Hi Creation Man.
You are a selfish brat who says
Grow up and start thinking with a little logic.
These personal insults violate rule 3 of the Forums Rules.
Address the argument and not the member of the forum.
Thank you for your help in this matter.
AdminBrian

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 10:43 AM CreationMan has not replied

CreationMan
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 305 (86998)
02-17-2004 1:07 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Dan Carroll
02-17-2004 11:03 AM


Re: Spoiled Brat
Who Cares? An expected response. But Let's suppose for a minute that God really does exist. If God really is God, and He created us, then who owns us? God Does. Who are we accounable to? God. Therefore if we live in contradiction of His rules and Morals, which He has established, then we must suffer the penalty for it.
So if God does exist, and you don't believe in him, you will suffer eternal punishment.
Who Cares? The answer is you should!

"The Fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'"
Creation Man

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-17-2004 11:03 AM Dan Carroll has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by :æ:, posted 02-17-2004 1:19 PM CreationMan has replied

CreationMan
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 305 (86999)
02-17-2004 1:10 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Dan Carroll
02-17-2004 11:03 AM


Re: Spoiled Brat
Yes Alexander Fleming did invent penicillin, but who invented Alexander Fleming??? Who gave him the knowledge, who allowed him to be born, who gave him the breathe of life?
GOD

"The Fool has said in his heart, 'There is no God'"
Creation Man

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-17-2004 11:03 AM Dan Carroll has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Dan Carroll, posted 02-17-2004 1:18 PM CreationMan has replied
 Message 15 by Cthulhu, posted 02-17-2004 1:20 PM CreationMan has replied
 Message 16 by MisterOpus1, posted 02-17-2004 1:23 PM CreationMan has replied
 Message 55 by MrHambre, posted 02-18-2004 6:52 AM CreationMan has not replied

Dan Carroll
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 305 (87001)
02-17-2004 1:18 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by CreationMan
02-17-2004 1:10 PM


Re: Spoiled Brat
quote:
So if God does exist, and you don't believe in him, you will suffer eternal punishment.
But which God would that be? YHWH? Christ? Allah? Odin? Osiris? That little cloned kid the Raelians worship? David Icke's snake demons?
So many ways to get damned, so little time... better hope the Vikings weren't right, or you're never gonna reach Valhalla.
They all threaten damnation (maybe not the Raelians... I don't know too much about them) and they're all mutually exclusive. Simply playing the odds, there's no safe bet.
So who cares?
quote:
Yes Alexander Fleming did invent penicillin, but who invented Alexander Fleming??? Who gave him the knowledge, who allowed him to be born, who gave him the breathe of life?
Apart from his parents, no one we can see.

"Perhaps you should take your furs and your literal interpretations to the other side of the river."
-Anya

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:10 PM CreationMan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 19 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:50 PM Dan Carroll has replied

:æ: 
Suspended Member (Idle past 7185 days)
Posts: 423
Joined: 07-23-2003


Message 14 of 305 (87002)
02-17-2004 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by CreationMan
02-17-2004 1:07 PM


Re: Spoiled Brat
CreationMan writes:
But Let's suppose for a minute that God really does exist.
First give us a good reason to.
Yes Alexander Fleming did invent penicillin, but who invented Alexander Fleming??? Who gave him the knowledge, who allowed him to be born, who gave him the breathe of life?
GOD
Bald assertion. You got any evidence that might support it?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:07 PM CreationMan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 22 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:54 PM :æ: has replied

Cthulhu
Member (Idle past 5852 days)
Posts: 273
From: Roe Dyelin
Joined: 09-09-2003


Message 15 of 305 (87003)
02-17-2004 1:20 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by CreationMan
02-17-2004 1:10 PM


Re: Spoiled Brat
So...
In order to show that God exists, you must first assume that God exists.
That's circular reasoning.

Ia! Cthulhu fhtagn!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:10 PM CreationMan has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 18 by CreationMan, posted 02-17-2004 1:47 PM Cthulhu has replied

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