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Author Topic:   Are Biblical claims about creation relevant to the Evolution vs Creation debate?
Maestro232
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 8 (170155)
12-20-2004 2:59 PM


I would like to propose a new topic with the title:
Are Biblical claims about creation relevent to the Evolution vs Creation debate?
My primary interest is in hashing out whether claims in the Bible about creation should be treated in the forum at large as equal evidence (in principle) with scientific data and held up to a high level of scrutiny concerning its accuracy and trustworthiness.
This topic stems from a recently closed thread which explored whether Creationists are held to a higher standard here than Evolutionists. My assessment there was that, because Biblical claims are largely deemed unimportant to the issue of evolution vs creation in this forum (an assertion also up for debate), creationists are forced to operate with an incomplete toolbox by not being granted an intellectual nod to explore with our evolutionary scientist friends a vital and highly relevent area of this issue.
Put more succinctly, Creationists are expected to argue only within scientists because it is largely believed that only science is relevent. I wish to explore the possibility that evolutionists should consider Biblical claims about creation and interact with those claims in an intellectual manner as creationists have interacted with relevent scientific data.
It is true that my opponents object on the grounds of there being no link between sprirituality and science. My response is the following:
The Bible does not just talk about the spiritual realm. It talks about this physical world, and I am saying that those claims are relevent to the discussion of our physical existence and origin. I am not asking evolutionists to study feelings and demons and angels, I am asking them to study the claims in the Bible about the creation of this physical world. Because, afterall, there is a question of whether or not we were created or evolved.
Thus, let us treat the related Biblical claims not as someone's bedtime valium, but as a serious documentation with claims about our origin that should be scrutinized.
This message has been edited by Maestro232, 12-20-2004 03:35 PM

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by AdminNosy, posted 12-20-2004 3:03 PM Maestro232 has replied
 Message 3 by AdminJar, posted 12-20-2004 3:04 PM Maestro232 has replied

AdminNosy
Administrator
Posts: 4754
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Joined: 11-11-2003


Message 2 of 8 (170156)
12-20-2004 3:03 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Maestro232
12-20-2004 2:59 PM


Needs more work
You should supply more in an OP.
Discuss what is to be included in the topic and what is outside it.
Give your own views as a kick off the topic.
You can do all of that by editting it into the OP (post number 1)
You need a clearer topic title too:
Are Biblical claims about creation relelent to the Evolution vs Creation debate?
might work, with your permission I will change it to that (shortened perhaps). You can't do that for technical reasons.
This message has been edited by AdminNosy, 12-20-2004 03:04 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 2:59 PM Maestro232 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 3:07 PM AdminNosy has not replied

AdminJar
Inactive Member


Message 3 of 8 (170158)
12-20-2004 3:04 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Maestro232
12-20-2004 2:59 PM


You need to flesh it out a little more. Present a summary of your belief and the reasons (brief, you can expand on them as it progresses) you hold that belief.

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This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 2:59 PM Maestro232 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 3:27 PM AdminJar has not replied

Maestro232
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 8 (170159)
12-20-2004 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by AdminNosy
12-20-2004 3:03 PM


Re: Needs more work
Yes...I meant to have the topic title the same as my suggestion. Please change it (notice I misspelled relevent though. Gracias. I'll work on an OP

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by AdminNosy, posted 12-20-2004 3:03 PM AdminNosy has not replied

Maestro232
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 8 (170164)
12-20-2004 3:27 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by AdminJar
12-20-2004 3:04 PM


Similar Topic to Quetzal's. Aggregation possible?
I should note that Quetzal and I seem to be trying to start similar topics. Perhaps we can aggregate the two some way. My only concern is that it is not presented as whether spirituality is relevent, as his title suggests, but as to whether the creation claims in the Bible deal with the physical, and are thus relevent.
This message has been edited by Maestro232, 12-20-2004 03:55 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by AdminJar, posted 12-20-2004 3:04 PM AdminJar has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by AdminIRH, posted 12-20-2004 4:02 PM Maestro232 has replied

AdminIRH
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 8 (170174)
12-20-2004 4:02 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Maestro232
12-20-2004 3:27 PM


Re: Similar Topic to Quetzal's. Aggregation possible?
I'm moving your message to Quetzal's thread. Your post will be considered along with his to define the thread topic.
I'm sorry if I'm rushing you, but I feel this is a very important topic and both of you contribute a vital part of it.
AdminIRH
This message has been edited by AdminIRH, 12-20-2004 04:09 PM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 3:27 PM Maestro232 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 4:14 PM AdminIRH has not replied

Maestro232
Inactive Member


Message 7 of 8 (170179)
12-20-2004 4:14 PM
Reply to: Message 6 by AdminIRH
12-20-2004 4:02 PM


Re: Similar Topic to Quetzal's. Aggregation possible?
I must admit, I'm feeling a bit disenfranchised here. I made an objection to his thread title in regards to our discussion, I'm curious why his was moved so fast?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by AdminIRH, posted 12-20-2004 4:02 PM AdminIRH has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by AdminNosy, posted 12-20-2004 5:50 PM Maestro232 has not replied

AdminNosy
Administrator
Posts: 4754
From: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Joined: 11-11-2003


Message 8 of 8 (170225)
12-20-2004 5:50 PM
Reply to: Message 7 by Maestro232
12-20-2004 4:14 PM


Re: Similar Topic to Quetzal's. Aggregation possible? - Rejected, closed 4/26/05
There are a lot of cooks involved here aren't there.
I'm glad, while I was away, things seem to have gotten settled out.
For the record, I agree with AIRH that the topic is important. I also see two somewhat different but relasted approaches to it.
It is possible that this thread could be used for one focus and the other for a different focus. However, it would probably be very difficult to keep them from being on the same topic so let's try it in the one thread.
I'm slightly miffed that, since Maestro started it first, his wasn't the one promoted. Maybe while I was away he hadn't gotten his fixed up first.
I'm no longer sure we need the continuation thread that that Nosy guy started though.
{Defered to different topic. This topic rejected and closed 4/26/05. - Adminnemooseus}
This message has been edited by Adminnemooseus, 04-26-2005 02:31 AM

This message is a reply to:
 Message 7 by Maestro232, posted 12-20-2004 4:14 PM Maestro232 has not replied

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