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Author Topic:   Coffee House Musing - Webb, Hubble and Other Space Based Observatories
Tanypteryx
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Posts: 3698
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


(5)
Message 1 of 25 (899879)
10-20-2022 1:00 PM


In Message 316 Percy suggested a thread for the JWST, but I'm including other observatories because the others are making some fascinating discoveries on a daily basis also. It is not uncommon to see comparisons between them, but also composites of data from multiple detectors on different observatories.
Webb Uncovers Dense Cosmic Knot In The Early Universe Webb continues its search into the earliest times of our Universe, revealing the surprising formation of a massive galaxy cluster around a powerful, red quasar.
quote:
The quasar in question, SDSS J165202.64+172852.3, is an “extremely red” quasar that exists in the very early Universe, 11.5 billion years ago. Quasars are a rare, incredibly luminous type of active galactic nucleus (AGN). This quasar is one of the most powerful known galactic nuclei that’s been seen at such an extreme distance. Astronomers had speculated that the quasar’s extreme emission could cause a “galactic wind”, pushing free gas out of its host galaxy and possibly greatly influencing future star formation there.
An AGN is a compact region at the centre of a galaxy, which is emitting enough electromagnetic radiation to outshine all the galaxy’s stars. AGNs, including quasars, are powered by gas falling into a supermassive black hole at the centre of their galaxy. They typically emit vast amounts of light across all wavelengths, but this galactic core is a member of an unusually red class. In addition to its intrinsic red colour, the galaxy’s light has been further redshifted by its vast distance. That made Webb, having unparalleled sensitivity in infrared wavelengths, perfectly suited to examine the galaxy in detail.
To investigate the movement of the gas, dust and stellar material in the galaxy, the team used the telescope’s Near Infrared Spectrograph (NIRSpec). This powerful instrument can simultaneously gather spectra across the telescope’s whole field of view, instead of just from one point at a time – a technique known as integral field unit (IFU) spectroscopy. This enabled them to simultaneously examine the quasar, its galaxy and the wider surroundings.
So far, I have to say I have been pleased by the quality of images from JWST, many are exquisitely beautiful and strikingly different from Hubble images because it is sensitive the red and infrared portion of the spectrum.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


Replies to this message:
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Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 3698
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


(5)
Message 2 of 25 (899891)
10-20-2022 4:25 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Tanypteryx
10-20-2022 1:00 PM


Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
This is pretty cool!
Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Tanypteryx, posted 10-20-2022 1:00 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by Dredge, posted 10-21-2022 3:44 AM Tanypteryx has not replied
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Dredge
Member
Posts: 2087
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 3 of 25 (899921)
10-21-2022 3:44 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by Tanypteryx
10-20-2022 4:25 PM


Re: Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
If those space telescopes got close enough they would reveal that each of those stars is actually an angel (of the Biblical kind).
Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool) | ESA/Webb

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Tanypteryx, posted 10-20-2022 4:25 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by AZPaul3, posted 10-21-2022 5:25 AM Dredge has not replied
 Message 5 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 5:58 AM Dredge has not replied
 Message 8 by Theodoric, posted 10-21-2022 9:34 AM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 4 of 25 (899924)
10-21-2022 5:25 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Dredge
10-21-2022 3:44 AM


Re: Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
If those space telescopes got close enough they would reveal that each of those stars is actually an angel (of the Biblical kind).
Heretical liar! Angels are not that big else you couldn't fit 1000s of them on the head of a pin.
Go eat another meat-cracker and cleanse your wayward soul of this sacrilege.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Dredge, posted 10-21-2022 3:44 AM Dredge has not replied

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Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 5 of 25 (899926)
10-21-2022 5:58 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Dredge
10-21-2022 3:44 AM


Is God A Deadbeat Dad?
It seems that the Creator is hidden by shrouds of "smoke". Could it be that He is hiding much as the Wizard of Oz hid behind that curtain?
And I'm sure that AZPaul3 is making worship hymnals for the "heavenly choir" to gush praise at the creation itself...Creator Schmeator! Invisible as usual.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


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 Message 3 by Dredge, posted 10-21-2022 3:44 AM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by AZPaul3, posted 10-21-2022 6:01 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 9 by Tanypteryx, posted 10-21-2022 11:07 AM Phat has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 7324
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.7


(1)
Message 6 of 25 (899927)
10-21-2022 6:01 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Phat
10-21-2022 5:58 AM


Re: Is God A Deadbeat Dad?
And I'm sure that AZPaul3 is making worship hymnals for the "heavenly choir" to gush praise at the creation itself...
No. I'll pass.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 5:58 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


(1)
Message 7 of 25 (899928)
10-21-2022 6:03 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by AZPaul3
10-21-2022 5:25 AM


Re: Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
Either that or it must be a REALLY BIG PIN! Absolutely huuuge.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by AZPaul3, posted 10-21-2022 5:25 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7848
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


(1)
Message 8 of 25 (899936)
10-21-2022 9:34 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by Dredge
10-21-2022 3:44 AM


More religious crap
Do you have to impose your religious crap on everything. Crawl back under your rock , troll.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by Dredge, posted 10-21-2022 3:44 AM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 11:15 AM Theodoric has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 3698
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 3.2


Message 9 of 25 (899942)
10-21-2022 11:07 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Phat
10-21-2022 5:58 AM


Re: Is God A Deadbeat Dad?
If you don't have anything to contribute to this thread you could consider the alternative.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 5 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 5:58 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 11:43 AM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 10 of 25 (899944)
10-21-2022 11:15 AM
Reply to: Message 8 by Theodoric
10-21-2022 9:34 AM


Re: More religious crap
I don't know about Dredge, but I see the images from Hubble and James Webb as striking a profoundly spiritual vibe deep within me.
Let's take the term "space-based observatories". We are essentially peering back through time. If we go back far enough and accurately enough, we get right up against the known beginning and Big Bang itself.
Of course, we trolls believe in a Big Bang, but we are forever attempting to reconcile our religious/spiritual beliefs and preconceptions with the reality of the telescopic probe backward in time. Personally, I don't expect to actually *see* angels or demons, though from a believer's standpoint it would forever be probable. In fact, the idea of a Supreme Creator *should* remain forever probable in everyone's mind. This universe is far too big for us to manage ourselves.

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Theodoric, posted 10-21-2022 9:34 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Theodoric, posted 10-21-2022 11:31 AM Phat has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7848
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


(1)
Message 11 of 25 (899945)
10-21-2022 11:31 AM
Reply to: Message 10 by Phat
10-21-2022 11:15 AM


Re: More religious crap
Bullshit.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 11:15 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by Phat, posted 10-21-2022 11:47 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 12 of 25 (899947)
10-21-2022 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by Tanypteryx
10-21-2022 11:07 AM


Observing Reality
If you don't have anything to contribute to this thread you could consider the alternative.
Death? Or silence. I feel that it is an honor to contribute my opinion on topics that I myself don't originate and apologize if I am cluttering it up.
I think that the images garnered from these telescopes are nothing short of amazing and wonderful.
Unlike people who once thought that the moon landings were faked, I have little doubt that these images are anything other than real and special to humanity. They reassure us in that we can see the past. They help provide useful data to further science. And if nothing else, they essentially prove that 5 or 6000 years is far too short of a probable timeframe
for human development.
That being said, I tried to interject some humor from the Holy Trollers. (A better term than Holy Rollers! )

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Tanypteryx, posted 10-21-2022 11:07 AM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 16627
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003
Member Rating: 1.0


Message 13 of 25 (899948)
10-21-2022 11:47 AM
Reply to: Message 11 by Theodoric
10-21-2022 11:31 AM


Re: More religious crap
There you go again. Have you considered being nominated for EvC's crankiest old man?
I want to see beyond the clouds. I would be happy if I saw a Huge Eye peering back at me, but even if I find nothing except stars and dust and vibrant colors and validation of many scientific theories, I will forever be your special troll who lives under a special rock.
R.I.P Ignorance

"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain "
***
“…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox

“A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.”
H. Richard Niebuhr, The Kingdom of God in America

“The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
(1894).


This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by Theodoric, posted 10-21-2022 11:31 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 16 by ringo, posted 10-21-2022 12:51 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
xongsmith
Member
Posts: 2339
From: massachusetts US
Joined: 01-01-2009
Member Rating: 3.4


(2)
Message 14 of 25 (899953)
10-21-2022 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Tanypteryx
10-20-2022 4:25 PM


Re: Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
as i mentioned in the other older thread, interesting that the little "trapezium" of 4 white stars at the bottom of the 3rd leg (the small one at the right half way down) in the JWST is INVISIBLE in the Hubble version due to them being so far in the Red end.

"I'm the Grim Reaper now, Mitch. Step aside."
Death to #TzarVladimirtheCondemned!
Enjoy every sandwich!

- xongsmith, 5.7dawkins scale


This message is a reply to:
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Replies to this message:
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Theodoric
Member
Posts: 7848
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.5


(1)
Message 15 of 25 (899956)
10-21-2022 12:23 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by xongsmith
10-21-2022 12:10 PM


Re: Hubble and Webb Showcase the Pillars of Creation (Slider Tool)
This slide look of the two images really points that out.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by xongsmith, posted 10-21-2022 12:10 PM xongsmith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 20 by xongsmith, posted 10-21-2022 2:29 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
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