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Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
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Author | Topic: If US is a "Christian Nation" what brand is it? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Cliven Bundy says it is Mormon:
Explainer: The Bundy Militia’s Particular Brand Of Mormonism quote: Note that the central LDS church does not agree with the Bundy clan version, so they are a branch, fundamentalist extreme faction. So are they right that the US is a Mormon inspired nation? Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4409 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.4 |
If our (U.S.) Constitution is an inspired document by our Lord Jesus Christ, then isn’t it scripture? Bundy asked. WTF ????What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy
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Blue Jay Member (Idle past 2718 days) Posts: 2843 From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts Joined: |
Hi, RAZD.
Mainstream Mormon beliefs do hold that the U.S. Constitution was inspired by God, which is not an unusual thing for an American church to believe. The idea that the Constitution therefore counts as 'scripture,' is somewhat... less mainstream. The argument "inspired by God, therefore scripture" is a common Mormon meme, but I think most Mormons still see a distinction between 'scripture' and 'ScriptureTM.' ----- There are other stories in Mormon history that link the Constitution to the LDS Church in various ways. For example, one Mormon prophet, Wilford Woodruff, claimed that the founding fathers appeared to him in a vision, requesting that he conduct their temple ordinances by proxy for them (and censuring the Church for not having done that work yet). Of course, there are some problems with his claim, but it's a good example of how the LDS Church views the link between the 'one true religion' and the 'greatest nation on Earth.' Edited by Blue Jay, : typo Edited by Blue Jay, : other typo-Blue Jay, Ph.D.* *Yeah, it's real Darwin loves you.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
WTF ???? Fundamentalist Mormons, now terrorizing an unmanned remote bird sanctuary ... because "god" told them to. With guns. To return public land to the people ... by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Mainstream Mormon beliefs do hold that the U.S. Constitution was inspired by God, which is not an unusual thing for a American church to believe. This is not much different what Faith's always claiming and other evangelical Christian's. So who's right?
... but I think most Mormons still see a distinction between 'scripture' and 'ScriptureTM.' Like Jar's god\God\GOD distinction? I would take from this that they would put (Mormon) "ScriptureTM" ahead of (constitution) "scripture" when there is a conflict, hence insurrection? Thanksby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Blue Jay Member (Idle past 2718 days) Posts: 2843 From: You couldn't pronounce it with your mouthparts Joined:
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Hi, RAZD.
RAZD writes: This is not much different what Faith's always claiming and other evangelical Christian's. So who's right? None of them, I think. The US Constitution was an imperfect, though forward-thinking, document that allowed future generations to build this nation into something great (though still imperfect). Mythologizing it or trying to superimpose a divine will onto it is unjustifiable, in my opinion. If we had to choose one though, I'm sticking with Mormonism, because I've yet to overcome the social conditioning that has instilled a pro-Mormon bias in me. The LDS Church argues that the freedoms granted by the Bill of Rights paved the way for the Restoration of the Lord's True Church (which arguably couldn't have happened under other socio-political systems of the time). So, Mormonism is rather intimately linked with the Constitution in that regard. I suppose Faith would likely argue the same thing about her brand of Christianity: the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were necessary steps on the road to the emergence of the True Way. It would be rather more difficult for the Catholics or Lutherans (to name a few) to make the same claim.
RAZD writes: Like Jar's god\God\GOD distinction? I would take from this that they would put (Mormon) "ScriptureTM" ahead of (constitution) "scripture" when there is a conflict, hence insurrection? Yeah, I borrowed Jar's terminology a little there. And, you'd probably get a lot of Mormon objections that claim that there are no conflicts between the Scriptures and the Constitution, because they both c8me from the same source. Mormonism might have a somewhat better claim to this than other churches, simply because the people in the Book of Mormon are very (suspiciously?) American-like in their championing of freedom and human rights (such as the Captain Moroni mentioned in the news article you linked to); while the Bible is... somewhat less clear in its support of democratic principles.-Blue Jay, Ph.D.* *Yeah, it's real Darwin loves you.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1425 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Mormonism might have a somewhat better claim to this than other churches, simply because the people in the Book of Mormon are very (suspiciously?) American-like in their championing of freedom and human rights ... Perhaps because it came after (1820's) the constitution and bill of rights? by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Phat Member Posts: 18298 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1
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Are you sure thats the LDS church and not the LSD Church?
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain
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caffeine Member (Idle past 1045 days) Posts: 1800 From: Prague, Czech Republic Joined: |
The LDS Church argues that the freedoms granted by the Bill of Rights paved the way for the Restoration of the Lord's True Church (which arguably couldn't have happened under other socio-political systems of the time). So, Mormonism is rather intimately linked with the Constitution in that regard. I suppose Faith would likely argue the same thing about her brand of Christianity: the Constitution and the Bill of Rights were necessary steps on the road to the emergence of the True Way. I don't think Faith would argue that. As I hear her, she believes that people have consistently held the same views as her for the last 2,000 years - the early Christians; various sects deemed as heretics after the Roman church polluted Christ's message, and then some of the non-conformists and Protestant reformers - all forming an unbroken chain to today's True Christians. I'm sure she can speak for herself, but that's how I saw her views anyway.
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3983 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 7.0
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RAZD writes: So are they right that the US is a Mormon inspired nation? Most U.S. Christians coalesce around the Mammon Temple. "If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." Homo sum, humani nihil a me alienum puto.-Terence
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nwr Member Posts: 6409 From: Geneva, Illinois Joined: Member Rating: 5.3 |
Cliven Bundy says it is Mormon
Supreme court justice Scalia is Catholic, and seems to be a theocrat. And there are several other Catholics on the court.Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity
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Hyroglyphx Inactive Member
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Absolutely not a Mormon nation. Mormonism was ran out of the Eastern United States. Lol, Joseph Smith, the self-proclaimed prophet was killed in a shootout. That's how much he was viewed as a dangerous heretic
"Reason obeys itself; and ignorance submits to whatever is dictated to it" -- Thomas Paine
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NoNukes Inactive Member
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And there are several other Catholics on the court. That's an understatement of sorts. The court is currently made up of six Catholics and 3 Jews. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams
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jar Member (Idle past 414 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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But that's just their cover; really they are gay mormon muslims.
Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!
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ringo Member (Idle past 432 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Hyroglyphx writes:
You can't get any more American than that.
Lol, Joseph Smith, the self-proclaimed prophet was killed in a shootout.
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