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Author Topic:   Golden Age of biblical principles?
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 1 of 144 (589257)
11-01-2010 9:30 AM


Buz made a comment in the Atheist Appreciation of Biblical Wisdom and Inspiration thread that I think deserves to be expanded on.
In Message 33 Buz says the following.
Buzsaw writes:
Sadly, Western cultures are rapidly declining in these (Biblically prophesied end of Gentile age days) of apostacy, commensurate with the decline of Biblical principles.
This whole line is off topic for that thread, but in order for the non-religious to understand the thinking of the religious fundamentalists here, I think we need to explore this topic.
Can Buz and others tell us when the golden age of biblical principles was. When did the calamitous decline start?
My premise is there never was such an age. I and others will attempt to refute there was such an age if Buz and other fundies argue there was.

Facts don\'t lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by frako, posted 11-03-2010 7:35 PM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 5 by Coragyps, posted 11-03-2010 8:01 PM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 7 by Dogmafood, posted 11-04-2010 8:38 AM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 10 by Buzsaw, posted 11-04-2010 11:29 AM Theodoric has not replied
 Message 18 by nwr, posted 11-05-2010 8:16 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 2 of 144 (589630)
11-03-2010 3:41 PM


Issue?
Is there an issue with this topic proposal?
This topic is an attempt to keep off topic items out of other threads, primarily the Atheist Appreciation of Biblical Wisdom and Inspiration thread.
The comment by Buz is something we see occasionally on many threads. I think it is a topic that can support its own thread.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

  
AdminModulous
Administrator
Posts: 897
Joined: 03-02-2006


Message 3 of 144 (589669)
11-03-2010 6:38 PM


Thread Copied from Proposed New Topics Forum
Thread copied here from the Golden Age of biblical principles? thread in the Proposed New Topics forum.

  
frako
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 2932
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 4 of 144 (589677)
11-03-2010 7:35 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Theodoric
11-01-2010 9:30 AM


Can Buz and others tell us when the golden age of biblical principles was. When did the calamitous decline start?
Well the golden age of biblical principles was during the dark ages in Europe.
Those where so happy days where any heretic would get tortured by varius contraptions desighned to inflict the maxsimum possible pain whitout killing the victim.
such contraptions to name a few where:
The iron maiden the spikes where desighned to miss vital organs and block the blood from flowing out of the wound so the victim would feel the pain of gods wrath for as long as possible before going to hell.
The rack was desighned to dislocate as many bones as possible to inflict as much pain as possible to the victim so he would confess to his transgression and by doing so god would show mercy after he was burned at the stake or beheaded.
A special device for women who where evil heretics, blasphemers, adulterers, erotic mages, or abortionists it was called the brest ripper, metal clamps desighned to grab the brests where heated and used to tare out the brests of these evil women.
And let us not forget the Pear a device that was inserted oraly, vaginaly or analy and used to tare those openings apart.
There where many more devices one more cruel than the other all used to make those evil heretic repent and to save their souls. Oh those where the days when the principles of the bible where held in high regard, and where not even death could save the heretics no the pure and good bible worshipers would dig them out of their graves and put them on trial. And if they where found guilty all their evily gained possesions would go to the good, god fearing church.
Edited by frako, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Theodoric, posted 11-01-2010 9:30 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Coragyps
Member (Idle past 734 days)
Posts: 5553
From: Snyder, Texas, USA
Joined: 11-12-2002


Message 5 of 144 (589683)
11-03-2010 8:01 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Theodoric
11-01-2010 9:30 AM


I look forward with anticipation to finding out about this Golden Age, too. I won't nominate my favorite decade yet, but will offer a likely-relevant quote that is attributed to Will Rogers:
"Things ain't like they used to be! And they never was."
Edited by Coragyps, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 6 of 144 (589685)
11-03-2010 8:11 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by Coragyps
11-03-2010 8:01 PM


There sure are a bunch to choose from.
It could be the effect expansion of Christianity by fire and sword around 1000, or again about 500 years later or again about 250 years after that or ...
More than enough genocide and oppression to fit anybodies definition of a Golden Age.

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
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Dogmafood
Member (Idle past 348 days)
Posts: 1815
From: Ontario Canada
Joined: 08-04-2010


Message 7 of 144 (589741)
11-04-2010 8:38 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Theodoric
11-01-2010 9:30 AM


...tell us when the golden age of biblical principles was. When did the calamitous decline start?
I thought it began on day 11 or so when Adam and Eve had the temerity to be guided by their God given instinctive curiosity.

This message is a reply to:
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frako
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 2932
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 8 of 144 (589742)
11-04-2010 8:39 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by jar
11-03-2010 8:11 PM


Well the decline began in 1834 when the inquisiton was abolished, and it took a steep dive when the pope in 1998 where the pope adressed the international syposium on the inquisition.
"The Inquisition belongs to a tormented phase in the history of the Church, which . . . Christians [should] examine in a spirit of sincerity and open-mindedness." However, the Pope also stated that "before asking for forgiveness, it is necessary to know the facts exactly and to recognize the deficiencies in regard to evangelical exigencies in the cases where it is so."
from The Aftermath of the Inquisitions | HowStuffWorks
and later it was found that only 99 people where exsicuted in italy, spain and portugal. I wonder how many died when they where forced to confess or after they confessed, by natural causes ofcourse. And gods will he showed his will by the infections, and other desieses that they got after the curch stopped torturing them. And i wonder if i took a look at the documents myself if i could find some more.

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Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 144 (589762)
11-04-2010 11:26 AM


Buz Response To Jar and Frako
How many times over the years have I refuted this stuff, folks? How many times will I have to continue driving the facts home?
Jar and Frako, your examples are the usual strawmen. It weighs upon you or anyone else to cite New Testament evidence that the stuff you cited is NT (Christian) Biblical.
Jar, over and over, for years, you and others here at EvC town have been refuted on this count that any of these Dark Age attrocities, perpetrated by the Romish non-Biblical Catholic bishops and popes were sanctioned in the NT or anything Christian Biblically. It makes one wonder why anyone, over the centuries would willingly ascribe to the non-Biblical doctrines of the RCC, given their bloody history, their relationships with the anti-semetic Nazis, etc.
Obviously you are knowingly regurgitating strawmen which have been soundly refuted repeatedly over the years here at EvC.
As for the OT scriptures, I have repeatedly cited the fact that the only Biblical carnage related to Israel and sanctioned by Jehovah was confined within one tiny nation, Israel, for the express purpose of Jehovah to establish a messianic kingdom for the future. The only time Israel, either then or now in modern times has ever struck beyond their Biblically designated borders was for defensive purposes and their own survival.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by frako, posted 11-04-2010 12:43 PM Buzsaw has seen this message but not replied
 Message 12 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-04-2010 7:22 PM Buzsaw has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 10 of 144 (589763)
11-04-2010 11:29 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Theodoric
11-01-2010 9:30 AM


Buz Be Back, God Willing
Thanks, Theodoric for proposing this thread. I have to be out of town for most of the day but hope to contribute more to your thread when I find time.
Edited by Buzsaw, : Add To Title

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Theodoric, posted 11-01-2010 9:30 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
frako
Member (Idle past 305 days)
Posts: 2932
From: slovenija
Joined: 09-04-2010


Message 11 of 144 (589780)
11-04-2010 12:43 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Buzsaw
11-04-2010 11:26 AM


Re: Buz Response To Jar and Frako
Deuteronomy 18:10-12 "No one shall be found among you who makes a son or daughter pass through fire, who practices divination, or is a soothsayer, or an augur, or a sorcerer, or one that casts spells, or who consults ghosts or spirits, or who seeks oracles from the dead. For whoever does these things is abhorrent to the Lord"
Exodus 22:18 prescribes "thou shalt not suffer a witch to live"
Samuel 28, reporting how Saul "hath cut off those that have familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of the land"
it looks like doing bad things to witches is in the bible, so who is reading the bible wrong the Curch or you?
It weighs upon you or anyone else to cite New Testament evidence that the stuff you cited is NT (Christian) Biblical.
so the whole old testament should be torn out, cause it is wrong except for the flood, creation and other stuff right those things you can leave in, cause you gave it your blessing and it is the law and word of god.
As for the OT scriptures, I have repeatedly cited the fact that the only Biblical carnage related to Israel and sanctioned by Jehovah was confined within one tiny nation, Israel, for the express purpose of Jehovah to establish a messianic kingdom for the future. The only time Israel, either then or now in modern times has ever struck beyond their Biblically designated borders was for defensive purposes and their own survival.
a so the good old days of biblical principal go back to the times before jesus cause quite soon after him witch hunts began.
Edited by frako, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 12 of 144 (589848)
11-04-2010 7:22 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Buzsaw
11-04-2010 11:26 AM


Re: Buz Response To Jar and Frako
Jar, over and over, for years, you and others here at EvC town have been refuted on this count that any of these Dark Age attrocities, perpetrated by the Romish non-Biblical Catholic bishops and popes were sanctioned in the NT or anything Christian Biblically.
Protestants burnt witches and heretics too.
But in any case, let us for the sake of argument say that, when people went around burning other people, they were No True Christians and that these were ages in which not-really-Christianity held sway. Then these periods, therefore, were not the golden age of Biblical principles, according to Buz. We shall make a note of it.
So when was?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Buzsaw, posted 11-04-2010 11:26 AM Buzsaw has replied

Replies to this message:
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 Message 22 by Buzsaw, posted 11-05-2010 8:59 AM Dr Adequate has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 13 of 144 (589850)
11-04-2010 7:32 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Dr Adequate
11-04-2010 7:22 PM


Re: Buz Response To Jar and Frako
What is so funny is if Buz actually read what I wrote there was no mention of any "Dark Ages."

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-04-2010 7:22 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 14 by Buzsaw, posted 11-04-2010 8:57 PM jar has replied

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 144 (589875)
11-04-2010 8:57 PM
Reply to: Message 13 by jar
11-04-2010 7:32 PM


Re: Buz Response To Jar and Frako
Content edited out so as to propose a new topic, content leading off topic here.
Edited by Buzsaw, : No reason given.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 13 by jar, posted 11-04-2010 7:32 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by jar, posted 11-04-2010 9:01 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 16 by Dr Adequate, posted 11-04-2010 9:04 PM Buzsaw has not replied
 Message 38 by frako, posted 11-06-2010 6:57 AM Buzsaw has seen this message but not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 15 of 144 (589876)
11-04-2010 9:01 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Buzsaw
11-04-2010 8:57 PM


Re: Buz Response To Jar and Frako
Again Buz, the Inquisition is NOT what I referenced.
And you are just playing the normal Not a Real Scotsman tactic. We are all familiar with that one.
So we await your definition of the Golden Age of biblical principles.
Who knows, maybe it is the American genocides?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Buzsaw, posted 11-04-2010 8:57 PM Buzsaw has not replied

  
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