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Author Topic:   Arrogance of Elitism
mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 1 of 126 (483616)
09-23-2008 2:32 PM


I notice this at EvC occasionally, usually amongst evolutionist atheists, though not all of them ofcourse.
Basically, you are a welcome debater if you have the following attitude;
The Creationist says;
" Dear atheist, I know you are the scientific one, and I am just a poor, pathetic, unknowledgeable little git who doesn't know the difference between his arse and his elbow. If I verily will sacrifice a bull to your overlarge ego, and agree with your every scientific whim, then please doest not slaughter me before my peers. "
The Atheist responds;
" Thou foolish creationist, uneducated, with no pride that swelleth the head, verily I will treat thee with respect if you sacrifice a bull to my omniscience at Lake Darwin. And if thou pretendeth to have the useage of thine brain for even a moment, in the delusion that you can actually think like me, then I will smite thee asunder and leave thee in the road-side, as yet another foolish, teenage, under-educated twurp that you are. So be good little fool, as your arguments have been blown apart since the beginning of time, even though I don't even know what you know, or how you think. "
Edited by mike the wiz, : No reason given.

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mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 2 of 126 (483619)
09-23-2008 2:42 PM


Then we have the friends join in on the game, in this unspoken consensus that only atheists verily rule all thought.
" Why Mr Boffin, did thou hearest what that petulant ignoramus did call me during light up time at Darwin Lake.
He did pretend to have full function of his brain and pronounced some sort of knowledge showing that he could think. Quick, lable the bugger a pseudo-thinker and make his eyes water, by having Boffin, 2, 3 and 4 refute him in the same prevailing tongue. "
" Mr Boffin, I heard the little shit, he actually dared to say something to me, as if he could teach me a thing! Slaughter that twurp immediately, take no bulls for repentance, make him a laughing stick, let's drown him under ad hominem force before his kind up and take my lovely little free-thinking world where I make the rules, and Dawkins is held still sway in sainthood-status. "

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obvious Child
Member (Idle past 4115 days)
Posts: 661
Joined: 08-17-2006


Message 3 of 126 (483625)
09-23-2008 3:04 PM


lol. I laugh at your representation of creationists. That describes like 2. Out of millions. Some creationists are the most arrogant pieces of **** i've ever seen. Disregarding every thing they don't like independent of its source merely because it contridicts their own beliefs. And when they lose, they threaten eternal damnation.

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mike the wiz
Member
Posts: 4752
From: u.k
Joined: 05-24-2003


Message 4 of 126 (483629)
09-23-2008 3:14 PM
Reply to: Message 3 by obvious Child
09-23-2008 3:04 PM


Fair point, I agree. I have witnessed them also.
mikey is testing the naughty-waters.
However, one thing that does prevail is the misconception that the atheist is an educated person, who is informed totally, bordering on omniscience, and - at no stage is it possible to, after being atheist, become a theist.
At this site I have witnessed it. When someone says they used to be atheist, the response is that "no true atheist would become theist, knowing what atheists know".
LoL.
From now on, only comedic or silly responses similar to the OP, allowed!!

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bluescat48
Member (Idle past 4189 days)
Posts: 2347
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2007


Message 5 of 126 (483641)
09-23-2008 4:03 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 3:14 PM


However, one thing that does prevail is the misconception that the atheist is an educated person, who is informed totally, bordering on omniscience, and - at no stage is it possible to, after being atheist, become a theist.
If someone could come up with a rational idea that shows that a God or gods could logically exist, then I might possibly become a theist, but there would have to be overwhelming evidence.

There is no better love between 2 people than mutual respect for each other WT Young, 2002
Who gave anyone the authority to call me an authority on anything. WT Young, 1969

This message is a reply to:
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cavediver
Member (Idle past 3643 days)
Posts: 4129
From: UK
Joined: 06-16-2005


Message 6 of 126 (483647)
09-23-2008 4:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 2:32 PM


Small but important correction:
"So be good little fool, as your arguments have been blown apart since the beginning of time, for we once knew as little as you know now, and once thought as you now think."
Regarding elitism, I refer you to DrJones*
*Not a real doctor

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Rahvin
Member
Posts: 4032
Joined: 07-01-2005
Member Rating: 9.2


Message 7 of 126 (483652)
09-23-2008 4:50 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 3:14 PM


At this site I have witnessed it. When someone says they used to be atheist, the response is that "no true atheist would become theist, knowing what atheists know".
Provide examples, please. I've never witnessed any such thing.
Personally as an Atheist, I don't claim to know much at all regarding the existence of gods...which is exactly the problem. Without evidence supporting the existence of a deity, I simply have no reason to believe in them. You could say I am simply unconvinced. I don't claim to know that here are no gods, any more than I claim to know that ghosts and souls and the afterlife and the Force don't exist - I simply don't believe in them. If you ask me "do ghosts exist?" I would respond "I don't think so," not "it is impossible for ghosts to exist."
If you look at my posts, while I'm certain you'll detect a significant amount of condescention and sometimes even insult, you'll also note that I tend to simply lay out the facts as I see them and flatly point out the errors in my opponent's reasoning. I don't have the education of cavediver or Son Goku in physics, nor ICANT's in theology, but I don't need to, and I similarly don't look down on anyone on the basis of education. My focus is entirely on the logical consistency of an argument and consistency with known facts. I point out logical fallacies and clarify strawman arguments (very few Creationists I've ever spoken to actually understand what the Theory of Evolution actually says, let alone cosmology or geology or any of the other topics we touch on around here), and I admit that I can be extremely condescending in the way I approach arguments that I find particularly foolish, but I'd challenge you to point out where I'm actually wrong.
After all, elitism, condescention, insult, anger, cockyness, all of these, even education level, are compeltely irrelevant.
All that matters is the argument. In a debate, a person can be elitist, or cocky, or insulting, or uneducated, or have multiple PhDs, but the only thing that matters is the logical consistency and factual basis of his argument. All else is distraction.

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onifre
Member (Idle past 2950 days)
Posts: 4854
From: Dark Side of the Moon
Joined: 02-20-2008


Message 8 of 126 (483679)
09-23-2008 6:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 2:32 PM


Mike the Wiz writes:
The Creationist says;
" Dear atheist, I know you are the scientific one, and I am just a poor, pathetic, unknowledgeable little git who doesn't know the difference between his arse and his elbow. If I verily will sacrifice a bull to your overlarge ego, and agree with your every scientific whim, then please doest not slaughter me before my peers. "
...the atheists responds:
"Stop being a condescending little bitch, read a few science books, ask questions, listen to the answers and quit trying to sound like the victim."*
*Assuming of course that the atheist responding is me.
Edited by onifre, : spelling

"All great truths begin as blasphemies"
"I smoke pot. If this bothers anyone, I suggest you look around at the world in which we live and shut your mouth."--Bill Hicks
"I never knew there was another option other than to question everything"--Noam Chomsky

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Straggler
Member
Posts: 10333
From: London England
Joined: 09-30-2006


Message 9 of 126 (483690)
09-23-2008 6:53 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 2:42 PM


Mechanics Convention
I think I can see a caricature of my own behaviour within your well written little parody..................
He did pretend to have full function of his brain and pronounced some sort of knowledge showing that he could think
Ah this is where your parody falls down. All too often the creationists seem to have given the subject at hand no thought at all. Yet they remain convinced that they have seen the error everyone else is making regardless. That is the problem.
Imagine a convention of mechanics. Everything from amateur car enthusiasts to formula 1 design teams. Swapping info and ideas. Being desperately geeky about all things carrish. Then imagine a guy who has changed a bicycle tire three times in his life and read the wiki article on the internal combustion engine. He comes in, gets up on the stage and proceeds to tell the entire auditorium where it is that they are all going wrong with regard to a number of technical details.
The arrogant idiot would rightly be derided as a conceited fool and I for one would not drive a car he had put together. Would you?
Not all opinions are equally well founded.

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bluegenes
Member (Idle past 2477 days)
Posts: 3119
From: U.K.
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 10 of 126 (483693)
09-23-2008 7:06 PM
Reply to: Message 4 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 3:14 PM


mike the wiz writes:
At this site I have witnessed it. When someone says they used to be atheist, the response is that "no true atheist would become theist, knowing what atheists know".
I'm happy to become a theist as soon as the first God manifests himself. I'd rather be a polytheist than a monotheist, though, so I hope it's not a miserable, solitary sadist like the old testament God who turns up.
I prefer the idea of Goddesses to Gods, to be honest, especially if they want to make little demi-gods in the style of deities like the Greek ones. No question of boring virgin births for the Greek demi-gods. I always fancied a roll in the olive groves with Athena.
As for elitism, surely it's those who delude themselves that they're amongst a chosen elite who will go to heaven who are the most open to that accusation?

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Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 11 of 126 (483702)
09-23-2008 7:46 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by mike the wiz
09-23-2008 2:32 PM


mike the wiz writes:
Dear atheist, I know you are the scientific one, and I am just a poor, pathetic, unknowledgeable little git who doesn't know the difference between his arse and his elbow.
...and who thinks the pucking snake told all lies to the first man and he ate the pucking fruit. And due to this pucking snake's lies i am mortal and science and medicine are trying to overcome the obstacles laid down by this disgraceful lying snake.

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Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 12 of 126 (483706)
09-23-2008 8:19 PM


Ihr seid so leise
Double post
Edited by Agobot, : No reason given.

  
Agobot
Member (Idle past 5529 days)
Posts: 786
Joined: 12-16-2007


Message 13 of 126 (483707)
09-23-2008 8:20 PM


Ihr seid so leise
Am ersten Tag schuf Gott die Welt
Am zweiten Tag erschuf Gott die Menschen
Am dritten Tag schuf Gott die Musik
Am vierten Tag erschuf Gott den Club
und die Menschen tanzten
Und Gott sah wie die Menge tanzte
Am fnften Tag bemerkte Gott dass die Menschen noch immer nur tanzten
Und er sah, dass es Nicht Gut war
Gott wollte dass die Menschen feiern
Da schien ein helles Licht vom Himmel herrab
Und Gott sprach zu der Menge
Ihr seid so leise!
Doch Die Menge verstand es nicht
Und Gott hrte sie nicht
Doch er wollte sie Hren
wie sie schreien und feiern
Da sprach Gott zu der Menge
Warum seid ihr so leise?
Cool song with cool lyrics by Aquagen, making a mockery of the Biblical account of creation:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYSjkaLpymA&feature=related
Here's roughly what it would be about, if it were in English:
On the first day created God the world
On the second day created God the humans
On the thrid day created God the music
On the forth day created God the Club
And the crowd began to dance
On the fifth day noticed God that the people were still just dancing
And he saw that it wasn't good
God wanted that people party
And sent God a beam of light from the skies
And spoke God unto the crowd:
"You are so quiet"
But it fell on deaf ears
And God didn't hear of them
But because God wanted to hear
how they screem and party
Then spoke God unto them:
"Why arst thou so quiet?"
Edited by Agobot, : No reason given.
Edited by Agobot, : No reason given.

  
Buzsaw
Inactive Member


Message 14 of 126 (483722)
09-23-2008 10:00 PM
Reply to: Message 5 by bluescat48
09-23-2008 4:03 PM


Example Of The Arrogance of Elitism
bluescat48 writes:
If someone could come up with a rational idea that shows that a God or gods could logically exist, then I might possibly become a theist, but there would have to be overwhelming evidence.
By the same token if someone could come up with a rational idea that a BB, originating from a submicroscopic speck, having no place to exist, no time to have existed and no place to expand into, emerged to become, naturally, what the universe is today, could have logically existed, then I might possibly become a BBist and evolutionist, but there would have to be overwhelming evidence.
This is a classic example of the hypocrisy of the secularistic arrogant elitist.

BUZSAW B 4 U 2 C Y BUZ SAW.
The immeasurable present eternally extends the infinite past and infinitely consumes the eternal future.

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DrJones*
Member
Posts: 2284
From: Edmonton, Alberta, Canada
Joined: 08-19-2004
Member Rating: 6.8


Message 15 of 126 (483723)
09-23-2008 10:16 PM
Reply to: Message 14 by Buzsaw
09-23-2008 10:00 PM


Re: Example Of The Arrogance of Elitism
This is a classic example of the hypocrisy of the secularistic arrogant elitist
Right, cause if Joe Sixpack from Middle-of-Nowhere USA can't understand something it obviously must be false.
I refer you to the second last line of my sig.
Edited by DrJones*, : No reason given.

soon I discovered that this rock thing was true
Jerry Lee Lewis was the devil
Jesus was an architect previous to his career as a prophet
All of a sudden i found myself in love with the world
And so there was only one thing I could do
Was ding a ding dang my dang along ling long - Jesus Built my Hotrod Ministry

Live every week like it's Shark Week! - Tracey Jordan
Just a monkey in a long line of kings. - Matthew Good
If "elitist" just means "not the dumbest motherfucker in the room", I'll be an elitist! - Get Your War On
*not an actual doctor

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