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Author Topic:   A Bible For A Beginner
Eximius
Inactive Member


Message 1 of 13 (94018)
03-23-2004 1:32 AM


I've decided to start reading this Bible that everyone's been talking about but I need some help before starting. There are so many different versions that I don't know which one to pick, so I came here for advice. These are my criteria:
Authoratative: ie. relatively untampered with, not something that's been edited or changed to suit certain people or sects. (Is the KJV regarded as the most authoritative Bible?)
Accurate: in terms of translation.
Understandable: preferably a version that can be read by a modern reader, without too many archaisms.
Books: if I understand correctly (big "if"), different Bible's sometimes have different books in them. eg. some versions have books that other versions consider to be apocryphal. I guess it's simply a matter of opinion and none of the versions are "correct" in this regard, but is there a collection of books that the majority of Christians agree belong in the Bible.
I don't expect there is a "perfect" Bible, but what would you recommend and why?
Also, can you recommend any objective online guides that I could use to supplement my reading? The sort of thing I'm looking for is information about the Bible's history and composition, it's authors and editors, annotations to explain the meaning of obscure passages, relevant middle-Eastern history, etc.
Thanks in advance.

"Ah, there's nothing more exciting than science. You get all the fun of... sitting still, being quiet, writing down numbers, paying attention... Science has it all."
- Seymour Skinner, The Simpsons

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by berberry, posted 03-23-2004 2:28 AM Eximius has replied
 Message 3 by PaulK, posted 03-23-2004 2:53 AM Eximius has replied
 Message 13 by Zealot, posted 03-28-2004 7:27 PM Eximius has not replied

  
berberry
Inactive Member


Message 2 of 13 (94029)
03-23-2004 2:28 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Eximius
03-23-2004 1:32 AM


I don't see how you could go wrong with the KJV. That version is defended as inerrant by virtually all fundies, and it is also the one that secular critics regard as, in terms of literature, the most satisfying.
I would suggest you keep a copy of Asimov's Guide to the Bible handy as you read. If you come upon passages which are confusing, you can refer to it for commentary. Asimov was an atheist, but his treatment of the bible is fair and was not intended to denigrate it in any way. Many Christian scholars have a high regard for Asimov's guide. It's a large book; if you don't want to buy a copy you should be able to find it at your library.
The Catholic Bible is a bit larger than the Protestant versions. It contains some OT books and portions of books which do not appear in Protestant versions. At the time the Canon was closed (in the 4th(?) century) these books were added to the accepted Jewish OT. Catholics refer to these accretions as the Deuterocanon. Protestants, following Luther, reject them from holy scripture and refer to them as the Apocrypha.
EDITED to correct wording (1x) and capitalization (1x).
[This message has been edited by berberry, 03-23-2004]

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Eximius, posted 03-23-2004 1:32 AM Eximius has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 5 by Eximius, posted 03-24-2004 5:46 AM berberry has replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3 of 13 (94032)
03-23-2004 2:53 AM
Reply to: Message 1 by Eximius
03-23-2004 1:32 AM


The KJV is only the most authoritative English translation for some sects. It's not regarded as the most accurate translation (in part because older manuscripts have been discovered since the KJV was produced). It is also not the most readable since the English language has changed since the 17th Century - a fact which also sometimes leads to misunderstandings.
The version that I have usually seen recommended is the New American Standard Bible (NASB) - which is perhaps a little less easy to read than the New International Version (NIV) but doesn't have the omissions and questionable readings of the NIV.
BibleGateway.com: A searchable online Bible in over 150 versions and 50 languages. has the "Bible Gateway" which features several translations on line including the KJV, NASB and NIV.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Eximius, posted 03-23-2004 1:32 AM Eximius has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by Eximius, posted 03-24-2004 6:44 AM PaulK has replied

  
berberry
Inactive Member


Message 4 of 13 (94036)
03-23-2004 3:15 AM


If you're not familiar with Elizabethan English then PaulK is probably correct, a modern version might be an easier read. I will defer to his recommendations among those versions because I'm not familiar with them.
However, if you are able to read and understand Elizabethan English (if you can read Shakespeare and understand it without too much guidance, for example) then by all means I'd still suggest the KJV. The language is intellectually satisfying in a way I doubt any modern version could be.

  
Eximius
Inactive Member


Message 5 of 13 (94369)
03-24-2004 5:46 AM
Reply to: Message 2 by berberry
03-23-2004 2:28 AM


Does the KJV contain the Deuterocanon/Apocrypha, or will I need another version to check out those? And are they the same thing as the pseudipigrapha?
I'm glad you recommended Asimov's Guide to the Bible as I'm already a big fan of his. Hopefully it's still in print.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by berberry, posted 03-23-2004 2:28 AM berberry has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by berberry, posted 03-24-2004 11:26 AM Eximius has not replied

  
Eximius
Inactive Member


Message 6 of 13 (94377)
03-24-2004 6:44 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by PaulK
03-23-2004 2:53 AM


I've had the NIV pretty strongly recommended to me, but I've also been told to avoid it. Could you please elaborate on its "omissions and questionable readings".

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by PaulK, posted 03-23-2004 2:53 AM PaulK has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 7 by Dr Jack, posted 03-24-2004 6:57 AM Eximius has not replied
 Message 10 by PaulK, posted 03-25-2004 2:48 AM Eximius has not replied

  
Dr Jack
Member
Posts: 3514
From: Immigrant in the land of Deutsch
Joined: 07-14-2003
Member Rating: 8.7


Message 7 of 13 (94379)
03-24-2004 6:57 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Eximius
03-24-2004 6:44 AM


The NIV is (IME) the most popular bible among progressive Christians. It is clearer than most, and more positively written. On the other hand, the translators deliberatly altered some passages to 'correct' contradictions.
The problem, then, is that it will differ from the Hebrew texts more greatly than some other bibles, and that most fundies claim the KJV is the one inerrant bible (completely without justification incidently - I think they prefer it because the archaic language makes it easier to twist for their purposes).
If your looking for a Bible to read as a Christian, I would say NIV is one of the best, if your looking for one to read as a Scholar, or an interested party in the E/C debate it's to be avoided.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by Eximius, posted 03-24-2004 6:44 AM Eximius has not replied

  
berberry
Inactive Member


Message 8 of 13 (94423)
03-24-2004 11:26 AM
Reply to: Message 5 by Eximius
03-24-2004 5:46 AM


Eximius asks:
quote:
Does the KJV contain the Deuterocanon/Apocrypha...
Most prints don't, but I believe there are editions available that include it as an appendix. In any case, it is available in paperback.
I'm referring of course to Protestant bibles. The Catholic bible does include these writings. The best-known Catholic version of the Bible would probably be the Douay-Rheims. As I understand it, that version is comparable to the KJV in terms of language and literary value, but I don't know this first-hand.
quote:
And are they the same thing as the pseudipigrapha?
No, those writings are considered extra-canonical (and in some cases worthless) by both Catholics and Protestants.
EDIT: I forgot to mention that Asimov's Guide is indeed still in print, and it covers the Apocrypha.
[This message has been edited by berberry, 03-24-2004]

This message is a reply to:
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balyons
Inactive Member


Message 9 of 13 (94583)
03-24-2004 8:03 PM


I personally use the New King James Version, which keeps the same wording as the KJV for the most part, only changing thees and thous to yous and things like that. The New American Standard is also a version I prefer, as the NIV often leaves out words and sometimes changes entire passages.
I might also suggest having more than one version on hand to cross check wording. It gives a better representation of meaning and helps you understand different connotations.

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by Angeldust, posted 03-25-2004 5:19 PM balyons has not replied
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PaulK
Member
Posts: 17822
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 10 of 13 (94623)
03-25-2004 2:48 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by Eximius
03-24-2004 6:44 AM


The NIV is pretty notorioue for smoothing over difficulties. If you want a (not *the*) modern Christian view of what the Bible means it is probably OK. The KJV-only crowd also attack it for leaving bits out.
On the other hand it is one of the most readable translations so if that is your primary criterion it isn't a bad choice. But I still think that the NASB is probably a better one.

This message is a reply to:
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Angeldust
Inactive Member


Message 11 of 13 (94774)
03-25-2004 5:19 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by balyons
03-24-2004 8:03 PM


Cross checking is always important, but for those with small pocket books (i.e. any college student in the country)the cheap way to do it is, of course, the internet.
If you want a decent bible search site with an option of translations try Grow in Faith with Daily Christian Living Articles and BibleGateway.com: A searchable online Bible in over 150 versions and 50 languages.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by balyons, posted 03-24-2004 8:03 PM balyons has not replied

  
berberry
Inactive Member


Message 12 of 13 (94895)
03-26-2004 4:50 AM
Reply to: Message 9 by balyons
03-24-2004 8:03 PM


balyons writes:
quote:
I might also suggest having more than one version on hand to cross check wording.
That is an excellent suggestion, but it would be somewhat obviated if Eximius does indeed acquire a copy of Asimov's guide. Asimov uses the KJV as his basis, but he makes significant references also to the RSV, the New Catholic Bible, the Jerusalem Bible and the Masoretic text. For the Apochrypha, he uses the New Catholic.
I've made frequent mention of this guide here at evc because I consider it invaluable. If you are not a bible scholar, or at least a serious student of ancient history, you won't be able to fully appreciate the beauty and worth of the bible without some guidance. Asimov has no ax to grind with the text, he simply explains it where it's confusing and fleshes out the stories by providing social and historical context. Along the way, he gives you a sense of the overwhelming impact the bible has had on all aspects of our society.

This message is a reply to:
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Zealot
Inactive Member


Message 13 of 13 (95468)
03-28-2004 7:27 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Eximius
03-23-2004 1:32 AM


I've decided to start reading this Bible that everyone's been talking about but I need some help before starting. There are so many different versions that I don't know which one to pick, so I came here for advice. These are my criteria:
Hi Eximius. Your criteria should simply be to discover God.
Simply put, if you can believe that the Bible is the Word of God, God will do the rest. Any Bible will provide you with adequate knowlege to find Christ.
I wish you all the best.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Eximius, posted 03-23-2004 1:32 AM Eximius has not replied

  
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