bulletproof alternate universe

This forum has helped lead me to a new possible way of looking at the cosmos. A lot of good work has been done, studying this for years. I actually never realized the depth of this stuff before. I think I may be able to keep it more or less all intact, yet put a creator into it.
I think it is 'bulletproof' from any critisism from science. It goes something like this.
Back near the creation of our universe, it was necesary for the process of time to be set up, that the physical universe be seperated from the invisible, or spiritual one. As it was seperated, what we had was more or less what we see now. Our physical universe was now under time. So that, the cosmos would reflect that. In other words it really is billions of our light years away!
The day that the two universes merge into one, time will be no more. Heaven itself will suddenly appear different, as even the bible talks about. The invisible, the spiritual, the unseen, will then be no longer seperate.
We can not detect the invisible universe now, with our physical science, so I guess it could never be disproved! It explains a 6200 year old creation, despite the present physical time distance! It leaves science pretty well intact!
Once again, just in case I'm missing something somehow, I'm running it by this forum. I suspect this will be a short thread, as I can't see anyone able to dispute it! If anyone sees a flaw, or some reason science would not allow this, give it a shot.
Job 38:7 -"When the morning stars sang together, and all the sons of God shouted for joy?"

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This does not logically follow from any of the previous concept and in fact contradicts the "So that, the cosmos would reflect that. In other words it really is billions of our light years away!" statement due to the lenght of time required for the light to get here in order to be seen.

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Well, actually, I perhaps didn't explain it too well. Yes, indeed the stars, then would be billions of our light years away. Before the physical universe was seperated, there were no limtations of time, and light speed. This is because the spiritual is able to travel much much faster, with the speed of thought. When the 2 universes were together, a whole different universe, in some ways, would exist. What we see now is only a shadow, or part. A part that has been made to exist in time. When the 2 universes are reunited, or merged, then as the bible says, there shall be time no more. Just as we cannot see or understand the other side, that most people on our planet know exists, so we can't really now understand an immortal world, and body, and universe, as they will be.
The old physical universe (us, now) speed of light will be largely irrelevant. Just as, around creation 'time' somewhere it was not affecting God, or the spiritual world. When it was seperated, or our universe made, 6000 some years ago, there in the sky, in a now strictly physical universe, was the far away stars. Withe the spirit world no longer merged with us, we can not explain any physical force that would allow the creation to be when it was, as God said, only thousands of years ago. The missing ingredient is the other part of the universe, or, you could even say, the 'other' universe now.
Make any sense now?

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Woman in front of Mona Lisa at the Louvre
"I've seen reproductions that are better than this!"

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So the masterpiece was not able to be appriciated. Good thing she doesn't read this forum, she might not even get something as simple as this 2 universe stuff.

Whoops, maybe she does.

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Before the moment of separation with no time, light travel would be instantaneous.

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Perhaps more irrelevant than instant. With things that move much faster. A world where we are not bound by time, or light speed, but doesn't mean they won't co-exist. Invisible forces you now can not even see, much less understand. Forces where a spirit could travel billions of light years faster than you can type a post.
A merged universe where these unseen worlds and forces are seen, and a new part of all equations. Not a physical only universe.

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Yes, it is bulletproof. That's because it's not science. It's an ad-hoc religious rationalization.

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It is, just beyond our present scope. Evidence? Billions of witnesses over time to an unseen world!

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Anyone can come up with an idea that cannot be disproven by science.

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Glad to hear you can not disprove it! Galeleo talked of things his observations concluded, that were not accepted by 'science' of his day. If I had talked about atoms, which we can't see, to darwin or someone then, they would not have been able to see them, I think. Not seeing someting with the available technology does not mean it is not science.
There is dark matter and stuff thet I think we can't see yet either. Why do some police forces use psyhics to help in some cases, if there is no measureable supernatural? All it means, is that science has severe limits.
How much of quantum theory or cosmology is really not seen? Yet is is discussed as science. Black holes, anti matter, and cosmic background radiation, a lot of that is not something that we can hold in our hands, yet we think it helps us explain things, so it is science.
The USSR did experiments in the supernatural, I believe, as it is said other countries have done. Were they unscientific?
An invisible other universe on it's way to merging with our physical one, and verified by the bible, and many different religions, and millions of unreligious witnesses to haunted houses, healings, etc. should be considered.
Were any traces of the seperation left? Could this explain some things not yet understood? Is there any scientific law or theory it is refuted by?
Now if I said we should go dip in the Ganges river, or even the Jordon, you could say it was religious. After all, this is a 'creation' evolution debate forum, not just an evo one.
But if you say my space time, alternate universe, light speed explaining, well documented idea is religious, I say your faith is also pure religion. God is a scientist. He actually invented the thing!

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After all if the earth is older then we don't need all this talk of light speed changes and stuff do we?

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Maybe someone thinks it is impossible for the speed to be affected. Maybe someone thinks the billions of light years figure into things, and that the big bang would not allow it?

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If you can show how it is only 6,000 years old then I'd say you've kinda done the ToE in with one swipe of that sword. It would sure change my mind in a hurry.

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That's only one aspect of the invisible universe, what about things we know about that could be a by product of the seperation, or some redshifting or something that could be applied to indicate a soon re merging? What if someone thinks anti matter may yet somehow be related? What if the missing matter some have talked about was not actually matter at all, but could be better explained this way? What if it happens to fit in with someone's time travel theory, or something like the so called 'god particle' they just found?
What if someone has a disproof, but hasn't posted yet?
What if relativity were possibly affected by this, or some law, or phenomena? etc. Maybe it should wait a bit before leaving the cosmos entirely?

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But there is objective evidence of their existance.

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Maybe some objective doubt as to how, and if, and why as well?

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No police forces regularly use psychics, and on those few occasions where a police force has accepted the "help" proffered by a psychic, that "help" has been useless and often has led in a totally wrong direction. Psychics make claims ... but they're all false.

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Woah! All false? Nostradamus, Jeanne Dixon on JFK murder, etc. I couls see you saying 50%, or 30%, or 23% false. But I could dig up many many hundreds easy, if this were not a cosmos thread, to knock that arguement right out from under you.

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It restricts itself to naturalistic explanations for phenomena

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They say love is blind. We can't see that either, but we know it exists, and that it has a demonstrable effect! I can't see electricity, but it's science too. Some things, like god particles, etc, we might see for a millioneth of a second, but don't know much about. If we have no adequate theory, because we rule out all unseen force, some things might not get proper explanations.

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And there is objective evidence of their existance, and yes, they do help us explain what we see.

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Where is the grand wizard judge who decides how much of this stuff we can't see is possibly science? How come he likes universes the size of a pin head, but not entire symbiotic parallel ones?

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If you want to get picky, absolutely nothing is directly seen ... all that's happening is photons are striking our retinas and nerve impulses go to our brains and we think we see something.

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So nothing you think you see is science? How about what we hear, feel, smell?

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An invisible other universe is not mentioned in the Bible,

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Then how come no man has seen Him, and lived? Sonds like when this spirit world appears in the physical, it can have measureable effects. Namely the guy would die. How about the burning bush? What if the star of Bethlehem was actually the throne of the Almighty, fresh outta the other universe, hoovering over the birth of His Son!? Can your physical records explain it? What other things do we think are cosmological that could have an other universe partial or full orgin?

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What evidence, whether it exists or not, woudl prove that your hypothesis is wrong?

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I've noticed a lot of highly trained people post here, who knows they might have an educated doubt!

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How fast is that? My thoughts travel as fast as the chemical reactions at my synapses can generate those electrons, and that really isn't all that quick. Do your thoughts have a faster path?

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The speed of thought I was talking about is generally thought to mean that as fast as it takes you to think of a place, or person, bingo, there you are! If you were on Jupiter, say, and I was over renaming the constellation of virgo, and I thought of visiting you, there I would be, before I could say to the constellation, 'I dub thee the constellation of st Paul'. So yes, how fast your brain works wouldn't matter much.

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You can carry on with all this stuff if you want. What I'm suggesting is that you have to handle an old earth in your 6,000 year old universe. If you can't then you don't need to both with all this wild eyed speculation.

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Good. Soon as I'm sure no one can get back up and fight, I'll accept their surrender and concentrate on just the one front I am itching to punch out, so to speak. You know, it takes a lot of effort to fight all over the place. Get it down to one front, and I'll predict a fairly quick end to the battle.

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I think that all psychic claims to date are false

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Your thinking is noted, number two.

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Care to elaborate what possesed you to come to this conclusion?

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The observable fact that time now exists. The extreme veiw that we sailed out of a speck, when you add too much time to the equation. The scientific speculations of creation science people who postulate that the speed of light has changed a lot. The fact that the world's population largely thinks there is an unseen world. The chatter of cosmologists who have many things they don't actually really understand still. Ancient documentation that leads in that direction. And prophetic visions some have of a new heaven and earth coming. The fact that we don't know it all. The cosmic 'verified by witnesses' happenings in history, that require more than what cosmologists can explain. Missing so called matter, and other things that would indicate a possible flaw in current assumptions. And I could go on.
I guess, in closing, I might ask you, where you think your bang speck came from before it grew into a speck, was it always just there?

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Damn! I wish that I'd thought to do that last week before I drove all the way to south Arkansas!

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Try if you like, but don't get your poor mind in too big a tizzy. Even our limited present science, and common sense should tell you we are still in the physical universe. You are not in a other universe now at least in body.
Get a motel 6 and wait a little longer till you notice you're dead, or the heaven'd departing as a scroll. Then give it another shot. If it still don't work, report for training, and thay might hone your skills.

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If you want your ideas accepted as science, work out the math

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That should be easy, instead of going billions of light years, or millions, or even hundreds of light years out, we're already here, it's all around us.

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Oh, lots of scientists are investigating the possibilites of an infinite number of parallel universes

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Aha, it is science. They won't find another physical universe though. And, they can't detect the spiritual one directly yet.

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But the speculation and the math are scientific, because they are not trying to deny existing scientific findngs without any evidence and the math is consistent ... we just don't know if the math corresponds to anything real.

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So these scientists who have math that does not even correspond to anything real are just fine in your books. By the way, which scientific findings is the spiritual world denying? Since you can't even see it yet, is it invisible math corresponding to nothing, that is denying it?

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Why is your thinking that you see something more direct than our detection of dark matter by its effects?

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Well, if we are sure it is dark, then fine. Are these effects that help you see the dark side, for sure coming from what you think they are?

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If the Star of Bethlehem was actually the throne of the Almighty then there's no scientific explanation;

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There are scientists in the other dimension, you know. I bet that there are great scientific laws, and principles at work in the throne propulsion system. Just because someone can't see it in the physical box they are in doesn't mean it isn't science.

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To be scientific, you need to find something that is essentially universally accepted as having occurred,

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Do you think the not universally accepted big bang speck is science? Do you think bacteria turning into Marilyn Monroe, over time is universally accepted science? What about Hawkings mind bending plunge into the depths of theory way way way beyond reason is univesally accepted? Yet, the star that guided wise men of science hundreds of miles is less accepted as having occured?

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that is not explainable by other simpler hypotheses.

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My merging universe seems simple than some 'speck-ulations'

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Eta Carinae is by far the most appropriate person to evaluate your calimes, and he's made it clear what he thinks of your ideas.

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Oh, it's a boy! Thanks, I thought it was sort of like Etna. Maybe mr speck has more brains than manners. He was rude in his dork calling, and most other posts. Typical high priest of evolution.