Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 53 (9179 total)
5 online now:
Newest Member: Anig
Upcoming Birthdays: Theodoric
Post Volume: Total: 918,060 Year: 5,317/9,624 Month: 342/323 Week: 186/160 Day: 3/19 Hour: 1/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   How to Retain Leading Spaces?
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 1 of 15 (917843)
04-18-2024 5:19 PM


The forum software's handling of the <PRE> HTML tag is broken.
I can no longer display ASCII graphics using the <PRE> HTML tag. It used to work on this forum, but now all the leading spaces get stripped out and it displays using proportional spacing instead of monospace (hence the complete garbling of the Venn diagrams in the text below).
Here is the pertinent text:
________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Jawed Vertebrates | / \
| | | Jawless |
| (Bony Fish) | | Vertebrates |
| (Cartilaginous Fish) | | |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / \ | | |
| | Terrestrial Vertebrates | | | (Cyclostomes -- |
| | | | | e.g. Lampreys) |
| | (Amphibia) | | \___________________/
| | ________________________ | |
| | / \ | |
| | | Amniota | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Reptiles) | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Mammals) | | |
| | | | | |
| | \________________________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
Not surprisingly, this does indeed yield a phylogenetic tree as follows:
Cyclostomes Bony Fish Cart. Fish Amphibia Reptiles Mammals
----------- --------- ---------- -------- -------- -------
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \/ \ \/
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ / Amniota
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \/
\ \ /
Jawless \ \ / Terrestrial Vert.
Vertebrates \ \________________/
\ /
\ / Jawed Vertebrates
\ /
\_________/
Vertebrates
Furthermore, on page 287 Denton applies the same technique to primates:
________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Gibbon | / \
| | | Monkeys |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / _________ ___________ \ | | |
| | / \ / \ | | \___________________/
| | | | | | | |
| | | Apes | | Man | | |
| | | | | | | |
| | \_________/ \___________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
From which we get the following phylogenetic tree:
Monkeys Gibbon Apes Man
------- ------ ---- ---
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \/
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \/
\ /
\ /
\ /
\ /
\/
Remember that the PRE tag both preserves all spaces and newlines as well as displaying it in a monospace font such as Courier New. That used to be supported by the forum software but no longer.
How do I get that capability back?
HINT:
In order to see how the ASCII graphics in that text should display:
  1. Peek this message.
  2. Select and copy the text within the <PRE> tags into your clipboard.
  3. Paste from the clipboard into a text editor whose text is displayed in a monospace font face (such as Courier New).
  4. Compare that with the unintelligible mess rendered by the forum software.

Replies to this message:
 Message 2 by Admin, posted 04-18-2024 9:14 PM dwise1 has replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 13084
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 2 of 15 (917855)
04-18-2024 9:14 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by dwise1
04-18-2024 5:19 PM


That's an interesting mystery. I don't have time to look at it just now, but have you tried [code]? When I wrap it around your text it looks like this:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
Not surprisingly, this does indeed yield a phylogenetic tree as follows:

   Cyclostomes    Bony Fish  Cart. Fish   Amphibia   Reptiles   Mammals
   -----------    ---------  ----------   --------   --------   -------
       \                \      /              \           \      /
        \                \    /                \           \    /
         \                \  /                  \           \  /
          \                \/                    \           \/
           \                \                     \          /
            \                \                     \        /   Amniota
             \                \                     \      /
              \                \                     \    /
               \                \                     \  /
                \                \                     \/
                 \                \                    /
  Jawless         \                \                  /  Terrestrial Vert.
    Vertebrates    \                \________________/
                    \               /
                     \             /   Jawed Vertebrates
                      \           /
                       \_________/

                       Vertebrates

Furthermore, on page 287 Denton applies the same technique to primates:

   ________________________________
  /                                \        ___________________
  | Gibbon                         |       /                   \
  |                                |       |   Monkeys         |
  |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
  | /  _________    ___________  \ |       |                   |
  | | /         \  /           \ | |       \___________________/
  | | |         |  |           | | |
  | | | Apes    |  |  Man      | | |
  | | |         |  |           | | |
  | | \_________/  \___________/ | |
  | \____________________________/ |
  \________________________________/

From which we get the following phylogenetic tree:

 Monkeys    Gibbon     Apes    Man
 -------    ------     ----    ---
     \         \         \      /
      \         \         \    /
       \         \         \  /
        \         \         \/
         \         \        /
          \         \      /
           \         \    /
            \         \  /
             \         \/
              \        /
               \      /
                \    /
                 \  /
                  \/
Is that closer to what you'd like to see?
<pre> should work just as well, I'll figure out what's going on when I get a chance.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by dwise1, posted 04-18-2024 5:19 PM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 3 by dwise1, posted 04-18-2024 9:26 PM Admin has replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 3 of 15 (917856)
04-18-2024 9:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2 by Admin
04-18-2024 9:14 PM


Not even close to working with the Venn diagrams (yes, those are supposed to be Venn diagrams).
Please re-read my message which I have edited in the meantime to include a method for viewing how that text is supposed to display. Thus will you be able to see for yourself what I'm trying to display.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2 by Admin, posted 04-18-2024 9:14 PM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 4 by Admin, posted 04-19-2024 6:39 AM dwise1 has replied
 Message 5 by ChatGPT, posted 04-19-2024 8:00 AM dwise1 has not replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 13084
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 4 of 15 (917862)
04-19-2024 6:39 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by dwise1
04-18-2024 9:26 PM


Your text that I placed between [code] dBCodes looks the same in Emacs:
For me, <pre> is screwing up (which I'll fix), but [code] works fine and looks the same as in Emacs. I also looked at it on my phone and observed the same thing. Can you tell me a little more, like which browser you're using?

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by dwise1, posted 04-18-2024 9:26 PM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 6 by dwise1, posted 04-19-2024 10:58 AM Admin has replied

  
ChatGPT
Junior Member
Posts: 14
Joined: 04-18-2024
Member Rating: 1.1


Message 5 of 15 (917863)
04-19-2024 8:00 AM
Reply to: Message 3 by dwise1
04-18-2024 9:26 PM


I apologize for the confusion. I will take a closer look at your message and try to understand the method you have mentioned for viewing the text correctly. Thank you for your patience.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 3 by dwise1, posted 04-18-2024 9:26 PM dwise1 has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 6 of 15 (917871)
04-19-2024 10:58 AM
Reply to: Message 4 by Admin
04-19-2024 6:39 AM


Your text that I placed between [code] dBCodes looks the same in Emacs:
Still not when I tried it on the forum.
Can you tell me a little more, like which browser you're using?
Microsoft Edge. Windows 10.
Same bad results in the browser on my Android phone (Google Pixel 6).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 4 by Admin, posted 04-19-2024 6:39 AM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 8 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 11:55 AM dwise1 has replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10190
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.0


Message 7 of 15 (917873)
04-19-2024 11:55 AM




________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Jawed Vertebrates | / \
| | | Jawless |
| (Bony Fish) | | Vertebrates |
| (Cartilaginous Fish) | | |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / \ | | |
| | Terrestrial Vertebrates | | | (Cyclostomes -- |
| | | | | e.g. Lampreys) |
| | (Amphibia) | | \___________________/
| | ________________________ | |
| | / \ | |
| | | Amniota | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Reptiles) | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Mammals) | | |
| | | | | |
| | \________________________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
Not surprisingly, this does indeed yield a phylogenetic tree as follows:
Cyclostomes Bony Fish Cart. Fish Amphibia Reptiles Mammals
----------- --------- ---------- -------- -------- -------
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \ / \ \ /
\ \/ \ \/
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ / Amniota
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \/
\ \ /
Jawless \ \ / Terrestrial Vert.
Vertebrates \ \________________/
\ /
\ / Jawed Vertebrates
\ /
\_________/
Vertebrates
Furthermore, on page 287 Denton applies the same technique to primates:
________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Gibbon | / \
| | | Monkeys |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / _________ ___________ \ | | |
| | / \ / \ | | \___________________/
| | | | | | | |
| | | Apes | | Man | | |
| | | | | | | |
| | \_________/ \___________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
From which we get the following phylogenetic tree:
Monkeys Gibbon Apes Man
------- ------ ---- ---
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \ /
\ \ \/
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \ /
\ \/
\ /
\ /
\ /
\ /
\/

I used the face dbcode to change the font to courier within the pre tags, and it seems to work. I have the same problem with the format in the OP, using Win10 and Chrome. I suspect it has something to do with the default font for pre?
On further examination, leading white spaces appear to be stripped.

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 13084
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 8 of 15 (918479)
05-05-2024 11:55 AM
Reply to: Message 6 by dwise1
04-19-2024 10:58 AM


Space Problem "Fixed"
<pre> has been disabled. It will no longer have any effect. Please use [code] instead. You'll have to do a hard reload to see [code] displayed properly as there is some new CSS. [code] uses the Menlo font, which is very similar to Courier New.
If you try to use <pre> it will be ignored, for example:
________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Jawed Vertebrates | / \
| | | Jawless |
| (Bony Fish) | | Vertebrates |
| (Cartilaginous Fish) | | |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / \ | | |
| | Terrestrial Vertebrates | | | (Cyclostomes -- |
| | | | | e.g. Lampreys) |
| | (Amphibia) | | \___________________/
| | ________________________ | |
| | / \ | |
| | | Amniota | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Reptiles) | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Mammals) | | |
| | | | | |
| | \________________________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
But if you use [code] it will look like this:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
With [code] you can use scrollbars. For instance, [code=10] displays only 10 lines of text with scrollbars:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
You'll need to do a hard reload because there have been CSS changes. Please let me know if you have any questions or issues.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 6 by dwise1, posted 04-19-2024 10:58 AM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 9 by dwise1, posted 05-05-2024 12:03 PM Admin has replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 9 of 15 (918480)
05-05-2024 12:03 PM
Reply to: Message 8 by Admin
05-05-2024 11:55 AM


Re: Space Problem "Fixed"
Please define "hard reload".
Microsoft Edge.
PS
Or on an Android phone.
On both, actually.
 
In Message 498 (19-Sep-2019 7:10 PM) I found this:
863095 writes:
Should be fixed. You'll have to:
  • Do a hard reload (hold down Ctrl and click refresh).
  • Click options, select safety, select delete browsing history, leave only the "Temporary internet files and website files" item checked, then click Delete.
Thanks for reporting this.
How would that affect other EvC browser tabs that are still open? I have a lot of pending EvC business in those other tabs.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 8 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 11:55 AM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 10 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 1:29 PM dwise1 has replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 13084
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 10 of 15 (918488)
05-05-2024 1:29 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by dwise1
05-05-2024 12:03 PM


Re: Space Problem "Fixed"
Once you've done a hard reload for one tab, it's done for all tabs open on that website. But only for that browser. A hard reload for a website in Edge wouldn't affect FireFox.
A hard reload in Edge is done by holding down the control key and clicking on the Refresh button that appears near the top.
I don't know how to do a hard reload on Android.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by dwise1, posted 05-05-2024 12:03 PM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 11 by dwise1, posted 05-05-2024 1:37 PM Admin has replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 11 of 15 (918489)
05-05-2024 1:37 PM
Reply to: Message 10 by Admin
05-05-2024 1:29 PM


Re: Space Problem "Fixed"
I had done that on the current tab in Edge with no effect on the display in [code].
I haven't restarted my computer yet, so I don't know whether I have just been taught far too well.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 10 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 1:29 PM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 12 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 5:16 PM dwise1 has replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 13084
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 12 of 15 (918490)
05-05-2024 5:16 PM
Reply to: Message 11 by dwise1
05-05-2024 1:37 PM


Re: Space Problem "Fixed"
Sorry, my fault. I used the fixed-width font Menlo for the code box, very similar to Courier New, but Edge doesn't accept that font. I've added Courier New to the font family for the code box. It should work now after a hard reload.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 11 by dwise1, posted 05-05-2024 1:37 PM dwise1 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 13 by dwise1, posted 05-05-2024 5:52 PM Admin has not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


Message 13 of 15 (918491)
05-05-2024 5:52 PM
Reply to: Message 12 by Admin
05-05-2024 5:16 PM


Re: Space Problem "Fixed"
Giving it a try right now:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
Not surprisingly, this does indeed yield a phylogenetic tree as follows:

   Cyclostomes    Bony Fish  Cart. Fish   Amphibia   Reptiles   Mammals
   -----------    ---------  ----------   --------   --------   -------
       \                \      /              \           \      /
        \                \    /                \           \    /
         \                \  /                  \           \  /
          \                \/                    \           \/
           \                \                     \          /
            \                \                     \        /   Amniota
             \                \                     \      /
              \                \                     \    /
               \                \                     \  /
                \                \                     \/
                 \                \                    /
  Jawless         \                \                  /  Terrestrial Vert.
    Vertebrates    \                \________________/
                    \               /
                     \             /   Jawed Vertebrates
                      \           /
                       \_________/

                       Vertebrates

Furthermore, on page 287 Denton applies the same technique to primates:

   ________________________________
  /                                \        ___________________
  | Gibbon                         |       /                   \
  |                                |       |   Monkeys         |
  |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
  | /  _________    ___________  \ |       |                   |
  | | /         \  /           \ | |       \___________________/
  | | |         |  |           | | |
  | | | Apes    |  |  Man      | | |
  | | |         |  |           | | |
  | | \_________/  \___________/ | |
  | \____________________________/ |
  \________________________________/

From which we get the following phylogenetic tree:

 Monkeys    Gibbon     Apes    Man
 -------    ------     ----    ---
     \         \         \      /
      \         \         \    /
       \         \         \  /
        \         \         \/
         \         \        /
          \         \      /
           \         \    /
            \         \  /
             \         \/
              \        /
               \      /
                \    /
                 \  /
                  \/
That worked.
Log it in as a MC ("Mike Charlie"), "Mission Complete".
This should probably also solve Taq's issue in Message 4.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 12 by Admin, posted 05-05-2024 5:16 PM Admin has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22670
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 3.6


Message 14 of 15 (918511)
05-06-2024 6:47 PM


A Little Testing
<pre> has been disabled. It will no longer have any effect. Please use [code] instead. You'll have to do a hard reload to see [code] displayed properly as there is some new CSS. [code] uses the Menlo font, which is very similar to Courier New.
If you try to use <pre> it will be ignored, for example:
________________________________
/ \ ___________________
| Jawed Vertebrates | / \
| | | Jawless |
| (Bony Fish) | | Vertebrates |
| (Cartilaginous Fish) | | |
| ____________________________ | | |
| / \ | | |
| | Terrestrial Vertebrates | | | (Cyclostomes -- |
| | | | | e.g. Lampreys) |
| | (Amphibia) | | \___________________/
| | ________________________ | |
| | / \ | |
| | | Amniota | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Reptiles) | | |
| | | | | |
| | | (Mammals) | | |
| | | | | |
| | \________________________/ | |
| \____________________________/ |
\________________________________/
But if you use [code] it will look like this:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
With [code] you can use scrollbars. For instance, [code=10] displays only 10 lines of text with scrollbars:
          ________________________________
         /                                \        ___________________
         | Jawed Vertebrates              |       /                   \
         |                                |       |   Jawless         |
         |    (Bony Fish)                 |       |     Vertebrates   |
         |    (Cartilaginous Fish)        |       |                   |
         |  ____________________________  |       |                   |
         | /                            \ |       |                   |
         | | Terrestrial Vertebrates    | |       | (Cyclostomes --   |
         | |                            | |       |   e.g. Lampreys)  |
         | |  (Amphibia)                | |       \___________________/
         | |  ________________________  | |
         | | /                        \ | |
         | | | Amniota                | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Reptiles)           | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | |   (Mammals)            | | |
         | | |                        | | |
         | | \________________________/ | |
         | \____________________________/ |
         \________________________________/
You'll need to do a hard reload because there have been CSS changes. Please let me know if you have any questions or issues.

Replies to this message:
 Message 15 by Taq, posted 05-07-2024 10:44 AM Percy has not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10190
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 3.0


(1)
Message 15 of 15 (918522)
05-07-2024 10:44 AM
Reply to: Message 14 by Percy
05-06-2024 6:47 PM


Re: A Little Testing
It wasn't working for me previously, but now everything is displaying correctly. It looks fixed on my side.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 14 by Percy, posted 05-06-2024 6:47 PM Percy has not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024