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Author Topic:   Testing The Christian Apologists
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9341
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.4


Message 901 of 1086 (904968)
01-13-2023 11:43 AM
Reply to: Message 900 by ringo
01-13-2023 10:57 AM


Re: Gishing It Out With Ringo
I am always impressed when christofascists ignore their claims of their skydaddy's omniscience and omnipotence when it suits them.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 900 by ringo, posted 01-13-2023 10:57 AM ringo has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 904 by Phat, posted 01-13-2023 3:16 PM Theodoric has replied

  
NosyNed
Member
Posts: 9006
From: Canada
Joined: 04-04-2003


Message 902 of 1086 (904979)
01-13-2023 3:08 PM
Reply to: Message 896 by Phat
01-13-2023 8:51 AM


responsibility
Are you forgetting (or denying) that God has omniscience and knows all that will happen?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 896 by Phat, posted 01-13-2023 8:51 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 903 by Phat, posted 01-13-2023 3:14 PM NosyNed has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18419
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 903 of 1086 (904982)
01-13-2023 3:14 PM
Reply to: Message 902 by NosyNed
01-13-2023 3:08 PM


Re: responsibility
Not at all. I was making a tongue-in-cheek comment that really accentuates the fact that God is never unaware of our behaviors. There is no place to hide.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 902 by NosyNed, posted 01-13-2023 3:08 PM NosyNed has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18419
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 904 of 1086 (904984)
01-13-2023 3:16 PM
Reply to: Message 901 by Theodoric
01-13-2023 11:43 AM


Re: Gishing It Out With Ringo
Theo aka Ego writes:
I am always impressed when christofascists ignore their claims of their skydaddy's omniscience and omnipotence when it suits them.
Christofascists??
Can you define your new word for us? Whats good for the goose(step) is good for the gander!

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 901 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2023 11:43 AM Theodoric has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 905 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2023 3:19 PM Phat has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9341
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 2.4


(1)
Message 905 of 1086 (904985)
01-13-2023 3:19 PM
Reply to: Message 904 by Phat
01-13-2023 3:16 PM


Re: Gishing It Out With Ringo
I think you are capable of using google. Here is a hint. It has a wiki entry.
Unlike you, I know what words mean.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 904 by Phat, posted 01-13-2023 3:16 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 906 by Phat, posted 01-13-2023 3:49 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18419
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 906 of 1086 (904986)
01-13-2023 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 905 by Theodoric
01-13-2023 3:19 PM


Trading Words With Theo
I think you are capable of using google. Here is a hint. It has a wiki entry.
Actually, the Urban Dictionary entry hit the proverbial nail on the head!
Urban Dictionary writes:
Evangelical, semi-theocratical movement or temperment of Americans who stand against abortion, sexual education, homosexuality, science, anti-Zionism, and the separation of church and state.
Origins: In the mid-2000s, the Bush administration refined its broadly titled "War on Terror" campaign to the "Fight Against Islamofascism." This transfered the stigma of the 9/11 attacks and that carried by our enemies in the Middle East from tactics (e.g., terrorism) to policies (e.g., a Muslim caliphate). Since politically-active Evangelicals seek to at least partially theocratize America, the term "Christofascism" appeared to take advantage of the Republican rhetorical realignment.
One uses the term perjoratively when calling someone else a Christofascist. It inherently accuses its object of disloyalty to democracy; it attempts to evoke the feelings of hostility towards Middle Eastern terrorists and transfer them to Evangelicals.
When discussed generally, Christofascism is a bold label for political Evangelism but does not sling as much mud as the former usage.
Andrew: I believe that America was chosen to be God's nation, and that the Framers intended for there to be no separation of church and state.
James: Like every other Christofascist, Andrew, you want to replace our Constitution with the Bible.
Moderator: Jennifer, I know that you are working on behalf of the Socialist candidate, but I'm wondering what you expect will be the ground effort that Evangelical Republicans make this year on behalf of the Republican candidate's campaign?
Jennifer: The important thing to remember about Christofascism is that they only participate in party politics when they believe it will advance their specific agenda. If the Republican candidate only campaigns on the economy and national security, the Christofascists will not go the extra mile in terms of campaign support that they tend to go when the nominee talks about abortion, public prayer, and gay marriage.
I can't be that bad!

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 905 by Theodoric, posted 01-13-2023 3:19 PM Theodoric has not replied

  
Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 381 days)
Posts: 1676
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 907 of 1086 (907040)
02-18-2023 2:11 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Phat
10-19-2019 4:35 PM


"The first Christian Apologist that I want to present is Frank Turek."
Only a blind believer or uneducated person will think a homophobic, misogynous and mass murdering God is a good source of morals.
Science has already proven beyond a doubt that we instinctively know good from evil when born and default to good by default as the best survival strategy.
Regards
DL

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Phat, posted 10-19-2019 4:35 PM Phat has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 908 by AZPaul3, posted 02-18-2023 3:11 PM Greatest I am has replied
 Message 909 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:14 AM Greatest I am has not replied
 Message 910 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:14 AM Greatest I am has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8611
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.2


(1)
Message 908 of 1086 (907052)
02-18-2023 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 907 by Greatest I am
02-18-2023 2:11 PM


Science has already proven beyond a doubt that we instinctively know good from evil when born and default to good by default as the best survival strategy.
No. Science has "proven" beyond a doubt that morality is mostly locally acculturated and that any personality component of a genetic nature spans a spectrum but is usually too weak to overcome the moral dictates of society during childhood. Some kids seem naturally softies while others aren't so nice. Society layers over and dominates that nature.
BTW, a philosophy thing ... science cannot prove.
Science collects and assesses the evidence and creates models of the reality revealed. We have a greater or lesser degree of confidence in the models we develop. The more the model matches the reality we see the more confidence we have in the model to predict future (reveal past) events accurately. Further, that confidence level is always tentative, as in forever open to modification pending any future data yet to be discovered.
Examples would be we have an enormous amount of confidence (evidence and predictive models) for both big bang and evolution. No one has presented any kind of different model (religion, tea leaves, pet theory) with the sheer number and quality of data points in evidence of each. These are some of the strongest and most evidenced models of reality we have ever developed. We still do not say they are proven.
In the popular vernacular we can accept "prove" as a shorthand for the actuality.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 907 by Greatest I am, posted 02-18-2023 2:11 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 911 by Greatest I am, posted 02-19-2023 9:16 AM AZPaul3 has not replied
 Message 912 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:18 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 909 of 1086 (907119)
02-19-2023 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 907 by Greatest I am
02-18-2023 2:11 PM


qs=Greatest-I-Ain't]homophobic, misogynous [/qs] Homophobia is a virtue and naturally wholesome (like fruit and vegetables and honey).
If you're not homophobic, you are almost certainly suffering from some kind of cerebral deformity or injury ... or are maybe suffering from a dose of demonic possession.
As for being what you erroneously call "misogynous", sexism is an inevitable and unavoidable result of biology and the natural order.
Why do atheists support so many unnatural pathologies? What's wrong with them? Are they retarded?
a good source of morals.
If this life is all there is, morality is meaningless ... although some atheist heroes preach "morality" in an attempt to assert their perceived superiority.
Science has already proven beyond a doubt that we instinctively know good from evil when born
In that case, what went wrong with atheists? They must have been born with a genetic deformity that produced the evil of atheism. Perhaps their God-gene was deleted thru a mutation ... what jolly bad luck!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 907 by Greatest I am, posted 02-18-2023 2:11 PM Greatest I am has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 910 of 1086 (907120)
02-19-2023 9:14 AM
Reply to: Message 907 by Greatest I am
02-18-2023 2:11 PM


GreatestIAin't writes:
homophobic, misogynous
Homophobia is a virtue and naturally wholesome (like fruit and vegetables and honey).
If you're not homophobic, you are almost certainly suffering from some kind of cerebral deformity or injury ... or are maybe suffering from a dose of demonic possession.
As for being what you erroneously call "misogynous", sexism is an inevitable and unavoidable result of biology and the natural order.
Why do atheists support so many unnatural pathologies? What's wrong with them? Are they retarded?
a good source of morals.
If this life is all there is, morality is meaningless ... although some atheist heroes preach "morality" in an attempt to assert their perceived superiority.
Science has already proven beyond a doubt that we instinctively know good from evil when born
In that case, what went wrong with atheists? They must have been born with a genetic deformity that produced the evil of atheism. Perhaps their God-gene was deleted thru a mutation ... what jolly bad luck!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 907 by Greatest I am, posted 02-18-2023 2:11 PM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 913 by Greatest I am, posted 02-19-2023 9:25 AM Dredge has replied

  
Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 381 days)
Posts: 1676
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 911 of 1086 (907121)
02-19-2023 9:16 AM
Reply to: Message 908 by AZPaul3
02-18-2023 3:11 PM


Yes they have proven that we instinctively know good and evil.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8LIb22-5Lwg
Regards
DL

This message is a reply to:
 Message 908 by AZPaul3, posted 02-18-2023 3:11 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 912 of 1086 (907122)
02-19-2023 9:18 AM
Reply to: Message 908 by AZPaul3
02-18-2023 3:11 PM


APauling666 writes:
BTW, a philosophy thing ... science cannot prove.
Haven't you heard? Science can't prove anything.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 908 by AZPaul3, posted 02-18-2023 3:11 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 916 by AZPaul3, posted 02-19-2023 12:12 PM Dredge has not replied

  
Greatest I am
Member (Idle past 381 days)
Posts: 1676
Joined: 01-24-2007


Message 913 of 1086 (907123)
02-19-2023 9:25 AM
Reply to: Message 910 by Dredge
02-19-2023 9:14 AM


I am not an atheist. I am a Gnostic Christian.
Stats show that where there is less religiosity, there is more law abidance and peace.
The more religion, the less peaceful and law abiding.
Given what you put, it is likely due to better moral minds in atheists than yours.
Regardless, you are too far into stupidity for me to bother arguing with you.
Regards
DL

This message is a reply to:
 Message 910 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:14 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 914 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:31 AM Greatest I am has replied
 Message 915 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 9:35 AM Greatest I am has not replied
 Message 917 by Dredge, posted 02-19-2023 1:33 PM Greatest I am has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 914 of 1086 (907125)
02-19-2023 9:31 AM
Reply to: Message 913 by Greatest I am
02-19-2023 9:25 AM


Grapest writes:
Stats show that where there is less religiosity, there is more law abidance and peace.

The more religion, the less peaceful and law abiding.
All you have to do now, Grapest, is produce the "Stats" you mentioned. Can't wait to see them!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 913 by Greatest I am, posted 02-19-2023 9:25 AM Greatest I am has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 922 by Greatest I am, posted 02-20-2023 12:40 PM Dredge has replied

  
Dredge
Member
Posts: 2852
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 915 of 1086 (907127)
02-19-2023 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 913 by Greatest I am
02-19-2023 9:25 AM


Greatpest writes:
Regardless, you are too far into stupidity for me to bother arguing with you.
What a pity, Greatpest ... I was hoping you could enlighten this idiot with your superior Gnostic wisdom and knowledge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 913 by Greatest I am, posted 02-19-2023 9:25 AM Greatest I am has not replied

  
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