Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 59 (9170 total)
2 online now:
Newest Member: Neptune7
Upcoming Birthdays: Percy
Happy Birthday: ameliajack
Post Volume: Total: 917,267 Year: 4,524/9,624 Month: 299/1,096 Week: 4/119 Day: 4/22 Hour: 0/0


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   Absence of Evidence
Stile
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


(5)
Message 31 of 39 (905458)
01-27-2023 9:21 AM
Reply to: Message 27 by Phat
01-26-2023 2:44 PM


Re: Can I Get A Witness?
Phat writes:
I know. I was never schooled in the disciplines of evidenced responses and/or footnotes.
Schooling helps, but isn't necessary by any means.
In fact, schooling can often leave out the greatest virtue required in order to make evidenced responses:
You need to accept that it's okay to be wrong
If you don't think it's okay to be wrong... you won't be "looking for the truth" - you'll be looking for "something you can back up with anything that could get people to think the way you want them to think."
And that's not "evidenced" - that's manipulation.
Evidence and "being wrong" go hand-in-hand.
That's how progress is made - corrections (learning) on previously held methods (being wrong.)

This message is a reply to:
 Message 27 by Phat, posted 01-26-2023 2:44 PM Phat has not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


(5)
Message 32 of 39 (905459)
01-27-2023 9:39 AM
Reply to: Message 29 by Tangle
01-26-2023 3:15 PM


Re: Can I Get A Witness?
I actually found a free course online.
quote:
Hello and welcome to META101x - a free online introductory course about Philosophical and Critical Thinking.
Thinking well is important. This course is a celebration and exploration of our ability to think and hence to philosophize. We look at how thinking in certain ways allows us to frame and approach some of the biggest questions that can be asked - questions about how we can know about the world and ourselves, how we can understand identity and change, and even what it means to be thinking in the first place.
The course lasts 1 month. I start today.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 29 by Tangle, posted 01-26-2023 3:15 PM Tangle has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 33 by Taq, posted 01-27-2023 11:01 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10119
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 33 of 39 (905462)
01-27-2023 11:01 AM
Reply to: Message 32 by Phat
01-27-2023 9:39 AM


Re: Can I Get A Witness?
Phat writes:
The course lasts 1 month. I start today.
I'm skeptical.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 32 by Phat, posted 01-27-2023 9:39 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Stile
Member (Idle past 95 days)
Posts: 4295
From: Ontario, Canada
Joined: 12-02-2004


(2)
Message 34 of 39 (905470)
01-27-2023 12:24 PM
Reply to: Message 1 by Tangle
01-15-2023 12:51 PM


Tangle writes:
Personally, I find the lack of evidence for an interventionist god where we should find such evidence - such as payer works, miracles happen, god changes the bread and wine into his body and blood at the eucharist, god loves me etc - actually is evidence founded on absence.
Yup.
Well, that and the philosophically unchallengeable Eric The God-Eating Penguin
quote:
God can't exist because of Eric The God-Eating Magic Penguin. Since Eric is God-Eating by definition, he has no choice but to eat God. So, if God exists, He automatically ceases to exist as a result of being eaten. Unless you can prove that Eric doesn't exist, God doesn't exist. Even if you can prove that Eric doesn't exist, that same proof will also be applicable to God. There are only two possibilities - either you can prove that Eric doesn't exist or you can't - in both cases it logically follows that God doesn't exist.
--Mark

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1 by Tangle, posted 01-15-2023 12:51 PM Tangle has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 463 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 35 of 39 (905471)
01-27-2023 12:30 PM
Reply to: Message 9 by Phat
01-26-2023 7:37 AM


Re: Evidence Of The Absurd
Phat writes:
Not everyone has had the experiences that kept believers believing, however.
Your word on that is not reliable. You deny those of us who HAVE had the same experiences as you. You use the No True Scotsman fallacy.
Phat writes:
... there seems to be little explanation of why so few believers join the "ex-christian" peanut gallery.
Are you kidding? MOST of the peanut gallery are ex-believers. As you have been told many times, our society tends to start us out as believers.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 9 by Phat, posted 01-26-2023 7:37 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 36 by Phat, posted 01-27-2023 3:06 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Phat
Member
Posts: 18383
From: Denver,Colorado USA
Joined: 12-30-2003


Message 36 of 39 (905473)
01-27-2023 3:06 PM
Reply to: Message 35 by ringo
01-27-2023 12:30 PM


Getting Back On Topic
I started my course. I am now in Module One.
quote:
MODULE 1: What part of 'know' don't you understand?
The search for knowledge is one of the defining characteristics of human beings. Here philosophers and scientists talk about the difference between belief and knowledge and the importance of doubt in the process of creating new knowledge.
I'm determined to finish this course(at least the free version) even though I must admit it gives me mild anxiety. The lessons sound like the peanut gallery already took it!
I'm putting my Book Nook reading aside for a month in order to focus on the course.

The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” - Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You (1894).
When both religious and non-religious people reach the same conclusions then you know religion isn't the reason.--Percy
Democrats should not be the only party. Respect the two-party system. -Phat, in December 2022
We see Monsters where Science shows us Windmills.~Phat, remixed

This message is a reply to:
 Message 35 by ringo, posted 01-27-2023 12:30 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 37 by Taq, posted 01-27-2023 4:11 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied
 Message 38 by Tangle, posted 01-27-2023 4:30 PM Phat has not replied
 Message 39 by Adminnemooseus, posted 01-28-2023 3:16 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Taq
Member
Posts: 10119
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.9


(2)
Message 37 of 39 (905474)
01-27-2023 4:11 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Phat
01-27-2023 3:06 PM


Re: Getting Back On Topic
Phat writes:
I'm determined to finish this course(at least the free version) even though I must admit it gives me mild anxiety. The lessons sound like the peanut gallery already took it!
If we use driving as an analogy for skepticism, then yes, we already have years of experience behind the wheel. It looks like you are signing up for driver's ed.
The vast majority of atheists are skeptics at heart, and the one of the first people we became skeptical while on that path was ourselves. Most of us think it is more important to not be wrong than it is to be right. That requires some self reflection and doubt, something that isn't as common amongst believers.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Phat, posted 01-27-2023 3:06 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Tangle
Member
Posts: 9524
From: UK
Joined: 10-07-2011
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 38 of 39 (905475)
01-27-2023 4:30 PM
Reply to: Message 36 by Phat
01-27-2023 3:06 PM


Re: Getting Back On Topic
Well good luck luck with it Phat.

Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London. Olen Suomi Soy Barcelona. I am Ukraine.

"Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.
Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved."
- Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.


This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Phat, posted 01-27-2023 3:06 PM Phat has not replied

  
Adminnemooseus
Administrator
Posts: 3976
Joined: 09-26-2002


(1)
Message 39 of 39 (905483)
01-28-2023 3:16 AM
Reply to: Message 36 by Phat
01-27-2023 3:06 PM


Re: Getting Back On Topic
Your "Getting Back On Topic" message seems to be totally off/non-topic.
In skimming all your messages in this topic so far, I've at best detected a trace of the topic.
I suggest you stay out of this topic, unless you can contribute something that clearly connects to the message 1 content.
Adminnemooseus

Or something like that©.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 36 by Phat, posted 01-27-2023 3:06 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024