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Author Topic:   The Meaning Of The Trinity
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 966 of 1864 (903568)
12-13-2022 11:16 AM
Reply to: Message 965 by candle2
12-13-2022 8:09 AM


Re: Simplistically Speaking
candle2 writes:
Ringo, you can't teach me anything.
I'm well aware of that. Your inability to learn has been noted, and not just by me.
My replies to you are intended to prevent anybody else from falling for your nonsense. I don't hope to convince you that reality exists. (I don't believe in miracles.)
candle2 writes:
In any event, if you did not make such ignorant
statements there would be no reason to treat them
with sarcasm.
Feel free to point out my ignorance - with actual facts, not just empty accusations. I will continue to point out your ignorance.
candle2 writes:
Frostbite is all that Canada is good for.
If you had read my post (and feel free to check out the facts) you SHOULD have learned that Canada is also good for accepting refugees from American tyranny. Go ahead and try to refute anything I said.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 965 by candle2, posted 12-13-2022 8:09 AM candle2 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 967 by dwise1, posted 12-13-2022 12:33 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied
 Message 969 by candle2, posted 01-11-2023 12:11 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 970 of 1864 (904914)
01-11-2023 1:12 PM
Reply to: Message 969 by candle2
01-11-2023 12:11 PM


Re: Simplistically Speaking
candle2 writes:
Ringo, you can't teach me anything because it would
require a loss of knowledge and common sense on my
part in order for you and I to be on the same level.
I don't think it's possible for you to lose any knowledge or common sense. You're too firmly glued to what you think you know.
candle2 writes:
there is no natural way for life to begin on its own.
Of course there is. There is no UNnatural way for it to begin.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 969 by candle2, posted 01-11-2023 12:11 PM candle2 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 972 by candle2, posted 01-14-2023 8:55 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 976 of 1864 (905075)
01-16-2023 12:07 PM
Reply to: Message 972 by candle2
01-14-2023 8:55 AM


Re: Simplistically Speaking
candle2 writes:
Ringo, you say that original life began by natural
processes.

Where is your absolute proof of this.
1. Science doesn't deal in proof. It deals in evidence. And so do you, of course. When you drive through an intersection, you want evidence that another car is not going to hit you, so you look both ways.
2. Science doesn't deal in absolutes. And neither do you, of course. You don't stop at an intersection waiting for "absolute proof" that no car can possibly hit you. You go with the preponderance of evidence, the probability.
So stop being dishonest.
candle2 writes:
If you cannot provide absolute proof for your
assertion, then all you have is a belief.
Nope. Belief is for when there is NO evidence. For example. there is NO evidence of any UNnatural cause for life.
candle2 writes:
Beliefs are a dime a dozen.
Exactly. So YOUR belief is worth less than one cent.
candle2 writes:
And this one belief casts great doubt on anything that
you hold to be true.
I don't have a belief. I have evidence.
candle2 writes:
What is really sad is that you place so much faith...
I don't have any faith, i have evidence.
candle2 writes:
... in a
belief that goes against a time-proven law of nature...
Do you know anything about the so-called "laws of nature"? Did you know, for example that even what creationists call 'laws of nature" don't trump evidence?
candle2 writes:
... and that is simply that life cannot come from non life.
That "law' is just something that creationists made up. It has nothing to do with science. Scientific evidence shows no such thing. Hint: Life is made of chemicals. What magic do you think there is that makes some chemicals alive and other chemicals not alive?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 972 by candle2, posted 01-14-2023 8:55 AM candle2 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 982 by candle2, posted 01-18-2023 12:35 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 993 of 1864 (905169)
01-19-2023 11:32 AM
Reply to: Message 982 by candle2
01-18-2023 12:35 PM


Re: Simplistically Speaking
candle2 writes:
Ringo, you say that evolutionists do not deal with proof.
And, you are 100% right. There is no proof of evolution.
Science doesn't deal in proof, so there's no reason for science to have "proof" of evolution. Science also doesn't have "proof" of gravity. Ya know why? Because science doesn't deal in proof.
candle2 writes:
See, we agree.
Well, noi, we don't. You demanded proof for evolution, which means you don't know anything about science.
candle2 writes:
Evolutionists do not have evidence that creationists
don't have.
You have been lied to.
candle2 writes:
Everyone has access to the same evidence.
And you contradict yourself. How could they have "access" to the evidence if there was no evidence?
candle2 writes:
The interpretation is different.
And you don't understand what interpretation means.
Take the "Flood", for example. You CAN NOT interpret evidence of many small floods as evidence of one large flood. That isn't interpretation. That is fantasy.
candle2 writes:
In any event, evolutionists have faith, and nothing more,
that their views are right.
Nope. No faith. You have been lied to.
candle2 writes:
Judging by your posts and the evidence (be honest and
tell me how close I am) I say with 90% certainty that you
live in Canada.
I have said flat-out in many posts that I live in Canada. No miracle prognostication requitred.
candle2 writes:
80% certainty that you are female.
100% wrong.
candle2 writes:
85% certainty that you are between 75-80 years old.
100% wrong.
candle2 writes:
95% certainty that you believe in the existence of God...
100% wrong.
candle2 writes:
...but you try your best to deny this.
100% wrong. I don't try to deny the existence of God any more than you try to deny the existence of Quetzalcoatl.
candle2 writes:
Based on the available evidence how did I do.
Dismally. If you had actually looked at the "evidence available" (my 20,000 or so posts), you would have found most of the actual facts instead of making silly assumptions.
But you DON't look at the evidence. You only look up your ass, which is where your assumptions about evolution come from too.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 982 by candle2, posted 01-18-2023 12:35 PM candle2 has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 996 of 1864 (905178)
01-19-2023 12:01 PM
Reply to: Message 986 by Phat
01-18-2023 8:06 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
In another thread you even brought up Quatzechotal, for crying out loud!
No need to cry. What's wrong with Quetzalcoatl? Why can't Quetzalcoatl be another aspect of a multi-une god?
Phat writes:
You stubbornly clung to the fact that if the Creator allowed the "hole to be dug" by which people could fall into it, He was in fact evil.
Nothing "stubborn" about it. It's blindingly obvious. You never brought up a single coherent objection.
Phat writes:
So my basic belief, shared by Dr.Peter Kreeft, is that God initially only created the possibility of evil.
And your belief, along with Goober Kreeft, is still wrong. There is no difference between creating evil and creating the "possibility" of evil. Make an argument. Don't just repeat the same nonsense.
Phat writes:
ringo writes:
I'm willing to give up the experience of war, famine, genocide, etc.
Some would agree, others wouldnt.
Go ahead and name twenty people who are not willing to give up the experience of war, famine, genocide, etc. I maintain that the jury is definitely NOT out on that.
Phat writes:
You mouth off to God more than I do...
You deny Jesus.
Phat writes:
ringo writes:
Why couldn't God avoid creating evil by creating a world that didn't evolve?
Why not think about it for once?
I have thought about everything I talk about. That's why it's easy to rebut your so-called arguments.
Take your own advice.
Phat writes:
You claim that its all God fault according to Isaiah 45:7. In fact, here are several translations:
Disaster is evil. Calamity is evil. No difference after all.
Phat writes:
God takes full responsibility for all that Job has endured and nobody blames Satan.
That's what I keep telling you but you continue to pretend that Satan is the bad guy.
Phat writes:
You, on the other hand, have mentioned being Satans defense attorney!
And you contradict yourself AGAIN.
Phat writes:
The problem with the tree of knowledge is that people became more aware of themselves and less aware of God.
You're making that up. It says no such thing.
Phat writes:
Had they chosen the other tree ....
And it says nothing about choosing one tree or the other. They were forbidden from eating from ONE tree only.
Phat writes:
... they could have had Jesus...
Jesus didn't exist until thousands of years later.
Phat writes:
... but instead they chose the tree of self actualization.
Not "self-actualization". Knowledge of Good and Evil.
Phat writes:
And I like how you capitalize I AM. Did the snake teach you that?
He didn't need to. I know how to operate a keyboard.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 986 by Phat, posted 01-18-2023 8:06 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 998 of 1864 (905181)
01-19-2023 12:04 PM
Reply to: Message 992 by Phat
01-19-2023 10:49 AM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
God foreknew (in the parable) that humans would choose self actualization before they chose Jesus(Tree of Life)
What parable?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 992 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 10:49 AM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1000 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 12:07 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1002 of 1864 (905187)
01-19-2023 12:13 PM
Reply to: Message 1000 by Phat
01-19-2023 12:07 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
Genesis. The tree(s). The snake. The nakedness. Surely you know of this parable.
Since when is it a parable? You seem to think that Adam and Eve and the snake were real.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1000 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 12:07 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1015 of 1864 (905242)
01-20-2023 11:35 AM
Reply to: Message 1006 by Phat
01-19-2023 4:01 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
Are you seriously asking that question? For the same reason that we can't smoke pot at grandma's house.
I come from the olden days when you had to look over your shoulder when you smoked pot. I still look over my shoulder when I smell somebody else's pot.
But this is the 21st century. A lot of grandmas are smoking pot.
So how about an honest answer to the question?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1006 by Phat, posted 01-19-2023 4:01 PM Phat has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1016 by Phat, posted 01-20-2023 12:37 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1043 of 1864 (905292)
01-22-2023 1:29 PM
Reply to: Message 1016 by Phat
01-20-2023 12:37 PM


Re: Good & Evil In Heaven (hypothetically)
Phat writes:
You didn't get the analogy. When in the "house" of someone whom you know and respect, you will temper your own evil/willful/rebellious tendencies.
I did get the analogy. My response was that grandma is as likely as anybody else to smoke pot, what with her glaucoma and all, and she is more likely than many others to share it with you, in cookies, for example. It has nothing to do with "evil" or "willfulness" or "rebelliousness". It has everything to do with grandmas being grandmas, especially grandmas of a certain generation.
It was a bad analogy.
Phat writes:
... if you even made the grade to be accepted in Heaven...
I haven't applied. I don't like the nhe neighborhood.
Phat writes:
you would not be/do evil in Heaven.
Smoking pot is not 'doing evil". Bad analogy.
Phat writes:
The apologetics that I have adapted says that God initially allowed free will in Heaven, Lucifer chose it ... blah... blah... blah....
We know, we know. YAWN.
You can't even apologize for "your" own apologetics, so stop wasting our time with your endless repetition.
Phat writes:
All that is to say that God foreknew what we were likely to do.
Which makes Him responsible.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1016 by Phat, posted 01-20-2023 12:37 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1044 of 1864 (905293)
01-22-2023 1:32 PM
Reply to: Message 1018 by Phat
01-20-2023 2:45 PM


Re: Apologetics whew!
Phat writes:
At least you cant readily google a rebuttal to mine.
Don't need to. I can rebut your apologetics off the top of my head any day of the week and twice on Sundays.
Phat writes:
You have to actually make up your own response.
You have it backwards, as usual. being able to express it it my (our) own words is a thousand times better than having to google it. You google till the cows come home but you don't understand what you google.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1018 by Phat, posted 01-20-2023 2:45 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1045 of 1864 (905294)
01-22-2023 1:35 PM
Reply to: Message 1020 by Phat
01-21-2023 1:53 AM


Re: Good & Evil In Heaven (hypothetically)
Phat writes:
Lets go to scrip:
Psalms 24:1 writes:

ESV-The earth is the LORD’s and the fullness thereof, the world and those who dwell therein, for he has founded it upon the seas and established it upon the rivers.
Most commentaries suggest that though the earth was the Lords, the world was/is of Satan.
It's funny how you quote scripture actually saying flat out that "The earth is the LORD’s" and then you handwave it away saying that most commentaries disagree.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1020 by Phat, posted 01-21-2023 1:53 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 1047 by Theodoric, posted 01-22-2023 1:45 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(3)
Message 1046 of 1864 (905295)
01-22-2023 1:45 PM
Reply to: Message 1021 by Phat
01-21-2023 2:14 AM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
If a Landlord rents out apartments in an apartment house that he happens to own, he cannot legally have a say as to what specific behaviors his tenants can do.
He most certainly can. My lease specifies no smoking (tobacco and/or pot). Quiet must be maintained from 10 PM to 8 AM. The laundry room may only be used from 9 AM to 9 PM. I can't even put a nail in the wall to hang a picture. The landlord is legally entitled to make those rules for the greater good of the residents at large.
Phat writes:
IF, however, we are talking about the Landlords's personal home, he darn well can enforce any and every type of behavior within that environment.
Wrong again. The only thing he can enforce is occupancy. If he doesn't like a guest's behavior, he can ask the guest to leave. His right to remove the unwanted guest forcibly is also circumscribed.
Phat writes:
The earth is more like a rental property. Heaven is more like a personal and private residence.
Even if you were right about landlord/host rights, which you are not, you're just making that up. You're trying to reverse-engineer your theology to fit your misconceived notiions.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1021 by Phat, posted 01-21-2023 2:14 AM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1048 of 1864 (905297)
01-22-2023 1:49 PM
Reply to: Message 1029 by Phat
01-21-2023 12:02 PM


Re: The Limitations Of Good And Evil Behaviors
Phat writes:
That's like asking me why the sky isn't green
You should be able to answer that. It isn't a difficult question. You could google it.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1029 by Phat, posted 01-21-2023 12:02 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 1049 of 1864 (905298)
01-22-2023 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 1032 by Phat
01-21-2023 1:03 PM


Re: From an Illiterate to an Elitist
Phat writes:
l...he does not believe a word of the apologetic narrative regarding the stories and parables of the holy scriptures.
And you don't understand a word of the apologetics that you worship.
Phat writes:
... do you have any idea (or concern) about what scares me?
Your own fantasies scare you. (Now I'll read on in your post and see if I was right.)
Phat writes:
What scares me is the vision of a one world social democratic order...where religion is publicly outlawed and secular humanist values are required (a mandatory requirement all in the name of protecting the people from religious radicals.)
Yup, your fantasy. All in your addled mind. Not a vestage of reality.
Phat writes:
I see it happening easily within 25 years.
Easy prediction, since you won't live long enough to be proven wrong.
Phat writes:
Is it ever possible for a two party system to see eye to eye?
I don't know why you're so enamored with a two-party system. Most of the mature democracies in the world have multiple parties. In Canada, we have five parties in Parliament.
A system limited to two parties is necessarily polarizing.
Phat writes:
conservative leaning Bible thumpers
You're not "conservative-leaning". You fell off the edge long ago.
And you're not a "Bible-thumper". You're a Bible-trasher.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1032 by Phat, posted 01-21-2023 1:03 PM Phat has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 434 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 1050 of 1864 (905299)
01-22-2023 2:10 PM
Reply to: Message 1042 by candle2
01-22-2023 1:14 PM


Re: Simplistically Speaking
candle2 writes:
I believe Him with all my heart.
And yet you don't give Him credit for thinking.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 1042 by candle2, posted 01-22-2023 1:14 PM candle2 has not replied

  
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