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Author Topic:   Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..."
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2682 of 2926 (904588)
01-02-2023 10:55 AM
Reply to: Message 2677 by Kleinman
12-31-2022 1:36 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
It doesn't matter whether I'm ready for that or not.
Of course it matters. Nobody is going to waste time trying to explain complex concepts to somebody with no more intelligence than a chicken.
There are two types of creationist - the liars and the dupes. The liars will ignore the science because they can't address it. The dupes won't understand it.
The liars are not necessarily ignorant but their strategy is to keep the dupes ignorant. Education, information, etc. are not the friend of the creationists.
It's hard to tell whether you are a liar or a dupe. You may be as ignorant as you pretend to be or you may be lying about how ignorant you are. Either way, you will not learn anything from us unless you are willing to learn.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2677 by Kleinman, posted 12-31-2022 1:36 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2683 by Kleinman, posted 01-02-2023 4:38 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2684 of 2926 (904623)
01-03-2023 11:05 AM
Reply to: Message 2683 by Kleinman
01-02-2023 4:38 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
It matters only in your fake cowboy mind.
It matters in everybody's mind. You have not been able to convince anybody here that you know what you're talking about. You have not been able to convince any scientist anywhere that you know what you're talking about.
Kleinman writes:
So, if you knew the reason that drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail, you would explain it right now.
There's no need to explain it on this forum because everybody already understands it but you. And there's no point in trying to explain it to you because you don't have the necessary background in biology and mathematics to understand it.
Learn something. Then you might be able to understand the explanations.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2683 by Kleinman, posted 01-02-2023 4:38 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2685 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 11:47 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2686 of 2926 (904628)
01-03-2023 12:00 PM
Reply to: Message 2685 by Kleinman
01-03-2023 11:47 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
Now the fake cowboy thinks he knows what is in everyone's mind.
I can read what everybody posts.
Kleinman writes:
In the meantime, keep on with your mathematically irrational fairytales.
You're the one who doesn't understand that A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C. THAT is mathematics. The gibberish that you puke out is not.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2685 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 11:47 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2687 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 12:28 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2688 of 2926 (904631)
01-03-2023 12:37 PM
Reply to: Message 2687 by Kleinman
01-03-2023 12:28 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
Now the fake cowboy thinks that everything is written on this forum.
I said in Message 2684, "You have not been able to convince anybody here that you know what you're talking about."
That IS about this forum.
Kleinman writes:
That is why he won't explain how drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
You said in Message 147, "I like teaching biologists the physics and mathematics of biological evolution." Yet you keep demanding that WE explain things to YOU.
Since you like teaching so much, explain to us why A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2687 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 12:28 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2689 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 12:57 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2692 of 2926 (904646)
01-04-2023 10:56 AM
Reply to: Message 2689 by Kleinman
01-03-2023 12:57 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
Who on this forum explained the Kishony and Lenski experiments?
You're asking the wrong question. Who HASN'T pointed out that YOUR so-called "explanation" is bogus?
Kleinman writes:
I have, slow fake cowpoke.
No you have not. You haven't even READ the post that you're supposedly parrot-squawking to.
I SAID - and you QUOTED:
quote:
explain to us why A → B and A → C are not the same as B → C
It's nothing to do with thermodynamics. It's simple mathematics.
Kleinman writes:
And I have explained your mathematics. It is DU → MB.
That is not an "explanation". It's a childish retort.
EXPLAIN it. Show HOW they are not the same.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2689 by Kleinman, posted 01-03-2023 12:57 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2693 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 11:19 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2694 of 2926 (904651)
01-04-2023 12:10 PM
Reply to: Message 2693 by Kleinman
01-04-2023 11:19 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
The faux cowboy still hasn't explained why he is DU → MB.
You said you like to teach.
Teach.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2693 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 11:19 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2695 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 12:28 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2696 of 2926 (904654)
01-04-2023 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 2695 by Kleinman
01-04-2023 12:28 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
What do you want to learn?
I have told you many times. I want to know why you are STILL wrong about reptiles evolving into birds. Nobody says that. I want to know why you are STILL wrong about fish evolving into mammals. Nobody days that. I want to know why you never answer when I ask you that.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2695 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 12:28 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2697 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 12:46 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 2698 of 2926 (904669)
01-04-2023 7:26 PM
Reply to: Message 2697 by Kleinman
01-04-2023 12:46 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
So the ersatz cowboy does not want to learn how descent with modification works....
You asked what I wanted ti learn and I told you. Why are you ducking the issue?

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2697 by Kleinman, posted 01-04-2023 12:46 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2699 by Kleinman, posted 01-05-2023 10:00 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 2700 of 2926 (904689)
01-05-2023 10:54 AM
Reply to: Message 2699 by Kleinman
01-05-2023 10:00 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
The fake cowboy wants to learn about his fantasies. The fake cowboy can't deal with reality.
Not fantasies at all. Reality. YOUR own statements. I said I want to learn why YOU think birds evolved from reptiles and why YOU think mammals evolved from fish. No scientist ever told you that, so I want to learn why you think that.
You said you like to teach.
Teach.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2699 by Kleinman, posted 01-05-2023 10:00 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2701 by Kleinman, posted 01-05-2023 1:21 PM ringo has replied
 Message 2702 by AZPaul3, posted 01-05-2023 3:26 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2711 of 2926 (904726)
01-06-2023 11:03 AM
Reply to: Message 2701 by Kleinman
01-05-2023 1:21 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
ringo, the fake cowboy, will now explain his fantasy of how reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals...
That's YOUR fantasy. Nobody but YOU has suggested that. I have tried to point out to you the mathematical error YOU are making but you refuse to tell us where you came up with such an idea.
If you like to teach, TEACH. Tell us where you got the idea that ANYBODY thinks reptiles evolved into birds and fish evolved into mammals.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2701 by Kleinman, posted 01-05-2023 1:21 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2715 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 11:52 AM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(2)
Message 2712 of 2926 (904727)
01-06-2023 11:11 AM
Reply to: Message 2705 by Kleinman
01-05-2023 5:42 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
CAUTION: The listed papers above are considered to be dangerous to those who believe that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals.

The reader is advised it will cause your bubble to burst.
NOBODY believes that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals, except YOU. So your "papers" are dangerous to nobody but you.
Your fantasy about antimicrobial drugs resistance are the same as your fantasies about birds and mammals - worthless.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2705 by Kleinman, posted 01-05-2023 5:42 PM Kleinman has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2717 of 2926 (904739)
01-06-2023 12:02 PM
Reply to: Message 2715 by Kleinman
01-06-2023 11:52 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
He is related to fecal bacteria but not descended from fecal bacteria.
If you understand that, why don't you understand that you are related to your cousin but you are not descended from your cousin? Why don't you understand that mammals are related to fish but they are not descended from fish?
Kleinman writes:
So tell us pea shooter, which bacteria are you descended from?
You're misunderstanding AGAIN. I am descended from my ANCESTORS, not my relatives. You need to learn the difference between descent and relationship.
Kleinman writes:
Just because you believe you are related to fecal bacteria ....
Related to, yes. Descended from, no.
Kleinman writes:
... doesn't mean you know how drug resistance evolves....
Since YOU can't understand the difference between related and descended, YOI don't know enough about evolution to say anything on the subject.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2715 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 11:52 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2719 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 12:30 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2718 of 2926 (904740)
01-06-2023 12:05 PM
Reply to: Message 2716 by Kleinman
01-06-2023 11:59 AM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
... I support my claims with experimental evidence....
You haven't supported your claim about fish evolving into mammals AT ALL. You run away from the issue. You have never been able to show where anybody but YOU has ever made such a claim.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2716 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 11:59 AM Kleinman has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 2720 of 2926 (904742)
01-06-2023 12:40 PM
Reply to: Message 2719 by Kleinman
01-06-2023 12:30 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
If you want to believe you are related to fecal bacteria, go for it.
It isn't a matter of "wanting to believe. It's a matter of accepting reality.
Kleinman writes:
So you don't know which bacteria you are descended from, you are only related to them.
I keep telling you, relatedness and descent are diffrent. You are not descended from ANY of your cousins.
Kleinman writes:
Maybe you descended from a fungus
No. Again, that is a relative, not an ancestor. You really should learn some basic concepts before you try to talk about evolution.
Kleinman writes:
Maybe you descended from a retrovirus?
Relative, not ancestor. You really should learn some basic concepts before you try to talk about evolution.
Kleinman writes:
At least I don't flush my relatives down the toilet.
There's no room in there with you.
Kleinman writes:
I wonder what that selection pressure was that evolved a bacteria into a fake cowboy.
You're in way over your head.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2719 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 12:30 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2721 by dwise1, posted 01-06-2023 12:55 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied
 Message 2722 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 1:45 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


(1)
Message 2738 of 2926 (904779)
01-07-2023 10:52 AM
Reply to: Message 2722 by Kleinman
01-06-2023 1:45 PM


Re: Forewarned.
Kleinman writes:
ringo writes:
keep telling you, relatedness and descent are diffrent. You are not descended from ANY of your cousins.
So you are not related to your parents?
It's becoming clear why you are so confused about biology and mathematics. You have no reading comprehension.
Yes, I am related to my parents AND I am descended from my parents. But I am NOT descended from my cousins - I am only related to them. Descent implies relatedness but relatedness does not imply descent. That's another mathematical principle that you do not understand.
Kleinman writes:
Now I get it.
No. You don't.
Kleinman writes:
Did your parents appear in the primordial soup?
Time is another concept that is beyond you.

Come all of you cowboys all over this land,
I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command:
To hold a six shooter, and never to run
As long as there's bullets in both of your guns.
-- Woody Guthrie

This message is a reply to:
 Message 2722 by Kleinman, posted 01-06-2023 1:45 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 2740 by Kleinman, posted 01-07-2023 5:20 PM ringo has replied

  
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