|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
Thread ▼ Details |
|
Thread Info
|
|
|
Author | Topic: Choosing a faith | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Read Job.
Richard Carrier is a hack sent by satan .... Phat writes:
Duh. When you get on an airplane, don't you want the pilot to have credentials? But of course, you will always believe the guy with academic credentials over any believer.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You pick another one of satans minions....quote:If there was a Satan, and if he had minions, they would be believers. Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You're not agreeing. I said that the minions would BE believers. Or at least fake believers like you.
I agree that many of the minionswould feast as parasites upon believers but not exclusively. Phat writes:
The church does a fine job of discrediting itself. No Satan needed.
Satan knows he needs to discredit the church and what better way than from within? Phat writes:
I asked you to look at the Book of Job. Satan is God's minion.
Satan also knows that all he needs to do with the secukar world is to dekude them into thinking that all progressive ideas are good ones. Phat writes:
The devil is in your head. The devil is in the details.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Tell it to Columbus. Humans are far from ready to venture outside our world and explore.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
Phat writes:
Sure it does. I even mentioned Santa Claus. You grew up to reject Santa Claus. I grew up to reject God for the same reasons.
Growing up does not mean rejecting the belief as if it is a made up fantasy. Phat writes:
How does finding excuses for childish beliefs equate to growing up? Growing up means seeing God(and Jesus as more than simply characters in a book. You rejected the God in the book just like I did. The only difference is you made up another god to replace Him.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
By their fruits ye shall know them. If they don't pracice faith, they don't have faith. If they don't trust God to take care of them, without retirement plans, they have no faith in Him.
It is a fact that not everyone who professes faith possesses faith.
Phat writes:
That's what Jesus said. And that's what His real followers did. The disciples didn't follow Him in limousines.
Its likely that you would judge real Christians solely on their willingness to give everything up...houses, cars, and bank accounts included. Phat writes:
You can't make Him "more" than the character in the book by doing less.
I realize that Jesus set that standard, but what *you* don't realize is that Jesus is more than a lawgiving character in a book. Phat writes:
No He does not. He relates to each of us where we are. He sets the standard by which we are saved. If there was no standard, there would be no reason for judgement.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Witness statements are damn near worthless when they're brand new. And they deteriorate with age.
In matters of supernatural manifestations and healing, the only evidence that survives 2000 years is ongoing reports of witness statements. Phat writes:
You mean you wish they were preserved remarkably well. In fact, the "importance" of the story has no bearing on how well it is preserved. We know very well that eyewitness accounts of a murder are no more reliable than messages in a game of Telephone.
... I would argue that stories with this much importance are preserved remarkably well. Phat writes:
One step in a game of Telephone may be accurate. But the fact that you're talking about "copies of original manuscripts" shoots you in the foot. There are no original manuscripts - and we have no reason to think that the copies of copies are accurate copies. They had copies of original manuscripts in which the meaning changed so little as to be negligible.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
You misquoted me. I said, " The God of the Bible is most likely closer to reality than the God that YOU made up - but it still isn't very close to reality." Message 109 ringo writes:
Nonsense. They(the authors of scripture) made up a God that YOU don't want. Phat writes:
It doesn't make any difference how well you can read the Bible if you disregard what it says in favor of what you wish it said.
I can read a Bible as well as anybody... Phat writes:
You clearly DO have an axe to grind. Why else would you embrace the Bible when it says something you like and reject it when it says something you don't like?
... and have no ax to grind... Phat writes:
What makes you think the mythicists have an axe to grind?
... unlike the mythicists. Phat writes:
Again, you are NOT agreeing. You're still circling back to your misconception that Satan is the bad guy.
And as for Satan being God's minion, I will agree that he was the tempter... Phat writes:
So he's after the pretenders like you, to make you stop pretending and accept the truth. Satan's basic job according to Job is to make us tougher and separate the contenders from the pretenders.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Not at all. Did you think I was referring to absolute truth? I was referring to verifiable truth. Truth that is supported by evidence. (Incidentaly, the word "verify" comes from the Latin verus, which means "true". If it ain't verifiable, it ain't true.)
You are inconsistent in mentioning "the truth.". Phat writes:
Because it isn't. And you're a fine one to pretend to hold up the Bible as truth when you reject so much of what it says.
You don't acknowledge the Bible as truth... Phat writes:
But i don't say that. You can certainly challenge the parts that are blatantly NOT true, like the Flood and the Resurrection. You can use EVIDENCE to challenge them. But YOU challenge the (supposed) word of Jesus and you have no evidence whatsoever that He didn't say them. Your only reason for challenging His instructions is that you don't like them. And that's especially egregious, since you pretend to believe in Jesus. It's obvious that the "Jesus" you believe in is entirely made up to suit you.
... and then say that anyone who challenges it is making up their own story. Phat writes:
We have evidence for it. The only evidence we have for Jesus is the original story.
Why is the original storyline any better? Phat writes:
We're not talking about "modern interpretation". We're talking about your self-serving made-up-out-of-thin-air story that happens to have a character named Jesus in it. Since you're denying everything we know about the original Jesu, why do you even call your version "Jesus"? And why don't you ever answer that question? After all if Jesus and His Father were made up to begin with how are the original stories any. better than modern interpretation? Edited by ringo, : Spellinge Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
GDR writes:
Tell that to a teacher. They're going to continue asking the same questions until you come up with the right answer. You're trying to change the questions to fit your answers. So, if you don't want me to keep saying the same thing then don't keep asking the same questions.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
|
Phat writes:
That doesn't work. If the first cause doesn't need a cause, then there can be other things that don't need a cause. There is no basis for a "first cause", period.
There is an uncaused first cause. Phat writes:
Unless you can calculate a probability, it is not "improbable". In the beginning...intelligence. why is that so improbable? It's implausible.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
It isn't an assumption. It's a conclusion. That assumes, however, that human evidence eventually defines reality.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I know Jesus as well as I know Frodo. (But I don't dismiss the dusty old book and make up my own version of Frodo.)
And yet they don't know Jesus. Phat writes:
"Look before you leap," is a good idea.
They claim to be awaiting objective evidence before they would take a leap of Faith... Phat writes:
The convenient excuse is that there is no evidence because God wants us to have faith.
... but it appears to me that this is a convenient excuse. Phat writes:
I have asked you before and you don't answer: Who WOULD want an alien overlord? Human nature does not want what ringo describes as an alien overlord.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
No I do not. ringo even says that I am conservative precisely because I am mean and spiteful. I say you are conservative because you agree with the conservatives about everything. And you quote Trump to insult Joe Biden, Kamala Harris and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez. It may just be coincidence that you and the conservatives are both mean and spiteful.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
There isn't much difference between your Democrats and Republicans on private property rights.
I agree with the liberals about social security and unionism. I agree with the conservatives on private property rights... Phat writes:
As I have said to you before, there is no freedom without equality. As longs as slaves are not treated equally (e.g. the right to form unions) they are not free.
... and on freedom before equality. Phat writes:
Nobody does. I do NOT advocate a secular "church": of a government even if the evangelicals have dropped the ball in regard to social welfare. However, social welfare is the NUMBER ONE responsibility of society. And if the churches don't do it, the government HAS to.
Phat writes:
God's judgement is small consolation to people living on the streets when it's minus 20 Celsius.
Let God judge us... Phat writes:
There's that word "harpy" again. Do you even know what it means? ... rather than harpy liberals.Come all of you cowboys all over this land, I'll teach you the law of the Ranger's Command: To hold a six shooter, and never to run As long as there's bullets in both of your guns. -- Woody Guthrie
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024