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Author Topic:   Rebuttal To Creationists - "Since We Can't Directly Observe Evolution..."
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 781 of 2932 (900179)
10-24-2022 2:16 PM
Reply to: Message 777 by Tanypteryx
10-24-2022 1:07 PM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Tanypteryx:

Tany gives his physical and mathematical explanation of biological evolution. Any other novices, laymen, or biologists want to give it a shot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 777 by Tanypteryx, posted 10-24-2022 1:07 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 782 by AZPaul3, posted 10-24-2022 2:54 PM Kleinman has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8564
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 782 of 2932 (900180)
10-24-2022 2:54 PM
Reply to: Message 781 by Kleinman
10-24-2022 2:16 PM


Kleinman The Troll.
Now you're trolling.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 781 by Kleinman, posted 10-24-2022 2:16 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 783 by Kleinman, posted 10-24-2022 3:00 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 783 of 2932 (900181)
10-24-2022 3:00 PM
Reply to: Message 782 by AZPaul3
10-24-2022 2:54 PM


Re: Kleinman The Troll.
AZPaul3:
Now you're trolling.
And here's AZPaul3's attempt at giving his physical and mathematical explanation of biological evolution. Any other novices, laymen, or biologists want to give it a shot.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 782 by AZPaul3, posted 10-24-2022 2:54 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 104 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 784 of 2932 (900183)
10-24-2022 3:15 PM
Reply to: Message 775 by ringo
10-24-2022 1:03 PM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
I do understand that every time i buy a lottery ticket, my chances of winning are the same.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 775 by ringo, posted 10-24-2022 1:03 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 785 by Kleinman, posted 10-24-2022 4:17 PM Dredge has replied
 Message 796 by ringo, posted 10-25-2022 11:49 AM Dredge has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 785 of 2932 (900184)
10-24-2022 4:17 PM
Reply to: Message 784 by Dredge
10-24-2022 3:15 PM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Dredge:
I do understand that every time i buy a lottery ticket, my chances of winning are the same.
ringo wants me to teach you introductory probability theory when it is ringo that needs to learn that subject. He's the one that believes that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals. That's what happens when biologists think they understand mathematics by taking a survey of mathematics course and barely passing that course.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 784 by Dredge, posted 10-24-2022 3:15 PM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 787 by Dredge, posted 10-25-2022 12:57 AM Kleinman has replied
 Message 797 by ringo, posted 10-25-2022 11:51 AM Kleinman has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9205
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 786 of 2932 (900186)
10-24-2022 5:49 PM
Reply to: Message 779 by ringo
10-24-2022 1:18 PM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
My corollary to this is. And I will trip you.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 779 by ringo, posted 10-24-2022 1:18 PM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 104 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 787 of 2932 (900203)
10-25-2022 12:57 AM
Reply to: Message 785 by Kleinman
10-24-2022 4:17 PM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Kleinman writes:
ringo wants me to teach you introductory probability theory when it is ringo that needs to learn that subject.
Poor ringo seems to think that the probability of winning the lottery once is equal to the probability of the same person winning the lottery 1000 times in a row. Little wonder he thinks the scientific impossibility of abiogenesis by natural means is statistically inevitable.
Atheists fantasies are kinda embarrassing.
He's the one that believes that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals.
More embarrassing atheist fantasies.
That's what happens when biologists think they understand mathematics by taking a survey of mathematics course and barely passing that course.
Why should evolutionary scientists bother with mathematics when they can invent fairy tales about what happened millions of years ago and pass them off as facts?
The atheistic cult of Darwinism thrives on dreaming up bedtime stories about the ancient past.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 785 by Kleinman, posted 10-24-2022 4:17 PM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 788 by AZPaul3, posted 10-25-2022 2:57 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 789 by Kleinman, posted 10-25-2022 8:57 AM Dredge has replied
 Message 798 by ringo, posted 10-25-2022 11:59 AM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8564
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


Message 788 of 2932 (900205)
10-25-2022 2:57 AM
Reply to: Message 787 by Dredge
10-25-2022 12:57 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Atheists fantasies are kinda embarrassing.
What is embarrassing is you trying to swim in the wake of your mathematically muddled mentor. But you are a believer in fantasies (weak mind) so adopting his bullshit is easy for you.
Why should evolutionary scientists bother with mathematics when they can invent fairy tales about what happened millions of years ago and pass them off as facts?
You mean like your bible that was pulled from the asses of priests and charlatans 3500 years ago? No, science is not like that at all. Scientists have reality to work from.
You and your mathematically muddled mentor are quite the pair. Birds of a feather mind flocking in fantasy time.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 787 by Dredge, posted 10-25-2022 12:57 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 790 by Kleinman, posted 10-25-2022 9:00 AM AZPaul3 has not replied
 Message 791 by Dredge, posted 10-25-2022 9:06 AM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 789 of 2932 (900214)
10-25-2022 8:57 AM
Reply to: Message 787 by Dredge
10-25-2022 12:57 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Kleinman:
ringo wants me to teach you introductory probability theory when it is ringo that needs to learn that subject.
Dredge:
Poor ringo seems to think that the probability of winning the lottery once is equal to the probability of the same person winning the lottery 1000 times in a row. Little wonder he thinks the scientific impossibility of abiogenesis by natural means is statistically inevitable.

ringo thinks he is being clever. There is a thing called the gambler's fallacy. Suppose the probability of winning any of the 1000 lotteries is 1 in a million. In that case, the probability of winning the first lottery will be the same as winning any of the other 999 lotteries, ie., 1 in a million. It is the joint probability, the probability of winning more than 1 lottery, that changes. These novices and laymen do the same to you with your claim of negative probabilities. I understand what you are saying, the probability of abiogenesis is so low, it might as well be a negative probability which is impossible. These nitpickers can't come up with a mathematically coherent explanation for abiogenesis or universal common descent, so this is how they try to argue whatever point they have in their imagination.
Dredge:
Atheists fantasies are kinda embarrassing.
It's worse than that, it is harmful. They fail to correctly explain how antimicrobial drug resistance evolves and why cancer treatments fail.
Kleinman:
He's the one that believes that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals.
Dredge:
More embarrassing atheist fantasies.

There are confusing science with science fiction.
Kleinman:
That's what happens when biologists think they understand mathematics by taking a survey of mathematics course and barely passing that course.
Dredge:
Why should evolutionary scientists bother with mathematics when they can invent fairy tales about what happened millions of years ago and pass them off as facts?

It's not just mathematics, experimental evidence of biological evolution contradicts their belief system. There was a time when they thought that the evolution of antimicrobial drug resistance was proof of universal common descent. Now they don't want to talk about the subject.
Dredge:
The atheistic cult of Darwinism thrives on dreaming up bedtime stories about the ancient past.
Darwin did get two important things right. He understood that two important aspects of biological evolution are biological competition and descent with modification. The error is in grossly over-extrapolating these two physical processes into universal common descent. It requires being able to do the math to know this is an error. Biologists don't know how to do this math correctly (except for Taq who now knows, but he has left the building).

This message is a reply to:
 Message 787 by Dredge, posted 10-25-2022 12:57 AM Dredge has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 800 by ringo, posted 10-25-2022 12:12 PM Kleinman has not replied
 Message 821 by Dredge, posted 10-26-2022 12:28 AM Kleinman has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 790 of 2932 (900215)
10-25-2022 9:00 AM
Reply to: Message 788 by AZPaul3
10-25-2022 2:57 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Dredge:
Atheists fantasies are kinda embarrassing.
AZPaul3:
What is embarrassing is you trying to swim in the wake of your mathematically muddled mentor. But you are a believer in fantasies (weak mind) so adopting his bullshit is easy for you.

So, when is AZPaul3 going to explain to us the Kishony, Lenski, and Desai biological evolutionary experiments? Let's see if you can clarify this subjet for us.
Dredge:
Why should evolutionary scientists bother with mathematics when they can invent fairy tales about what happened millions of years ago and pass them off as facts?
AZPaul3:
You mean like your bible that was pulled from the asses of priests and charlatans 3500 years ago? No, science is not like that at all. Scientists have reality to work from.

You and your mathematically muddled mentor are quite the pair. Birds of a feather mind flocking in fantasy time.

Says AZPaul3 who is so good at seeing the evil in others but can't see his own evil. Do you know that the Bible says we are all evil and we all deserve hell?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 788 by AZPaul3, posted 10-25-2022 2:57 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Dredge
Member (Idle past 104 days)
Posts: 2850
From: Australia
Joined: 09-06-2016


Message 791 of 2932 (900216)
10-25-2022 9:06 AM
Reply to: Message 788 by AZPaul3
10-25-2022 2:57 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
AZPaul3 writes:
weak mind
Well, I have stated many times on this forum that I have a fragile, eggshell mind. Nevertheless, the Holy Spirit has convinced me the truth of the Catholic Church ... the truth you have yet to discover.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 788 by AZPaul3, posted 10-25-2022 2:57 AM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 792 by AZPaul3, posted 10-25-2022 9:35 AM Dredge has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8564
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 792 of 2932 (900217)
10-25-2022 9:35 AM
Reply to: Message 791 by Dredge
10-25-2022 9:06 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
What holy spirit? Where is this thing? What's it made of?
This is one of those meat-cracker delusions of your religious mind, isn't it.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 791 by Dredge, posted 10-25-2022 9:06 AM Dredge has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 793 by Kleinman, posted 10-25-2022 9:52 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 793 of 2932 (900219)
10-25-2022 9:52 AM
Reply to: Message 792 by AZPaul3
10-25-2022 9:35 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
AZPaul3:
What holy spirit? Where is this thing? What's it made of?

This is one of those meat-cracker delusions of the religious mind, isn't it.
Didn't they teach you about being born again in your catechism? But somehow, you find believing that reptiles evolve into birds and fish evolve into mammals is real.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 792 by AZPaul3, posted 10-25-2022 9:35 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 794 by Theodoric, posted 10-25-2022 10:26 AM Kleinman has replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9205
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.4


(1)
Message 794 of 2932 (900221)
10-25-2022 10:26 AM
Reply to: Message 793 by Kleinman
10-25-2022 9:52 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Says the man that believes in magic.

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts

"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?


This message is a reply to:
 Message 793 by Kleinman, posted 10-25-2022 9:52 AM Kleinman has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 795 by Kleinman, posted 10-25-2022 10:38 AM Theodoric has not replied

  
Kleinman
Member (Idle past 366 days)
Posts: 2142
From: United States
Joined: 10-06-2016


Message 795 of 2932 (900222)
10-25-2022 10:38 AM
Reply to: Message 794 by Theodoric
10-25-2022 10:26 AM


Re: Kleinman does not think mutations can be passed down to descendants
Theodoric:
Says the man that believes in magic.
People do magic, just watch a few Penn and Teller "Fool Us" shows. I don't deal in magic, I deal in hard mathematical science such as giving the correct mathematical explanation of descent with modification which is verified by the experimental evidence of the Kishony and Lenski biological evolutionary experiments. This mathematical explanation of descent with modification is also verified by every other empirical example of biological evolution. Let's see if you can dismiss it with an empirical example that behaves differently.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 794 by Theodoric, posted 10-25-2022 10:26 AM Theodoric has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 801 by ringo, posted 10-25-2022 12:17 PM Kleinman has not replied

  
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