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Author | Topic: Anti-theist | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I can't find what you quoted in the post you quoted, so I don't know what you said that was supposedly a "joke".
ringo writes:
First off, it was meant to be a joke directed at you. You and GDR postulate a puny god who can't do this and can't understand that. We humans create things that are deliberately stronger than us and smarter than us. Phat writes:
I can't understand why YOU can't understand that "allowing" evil when you can prevent it is the same as DOING evil. And I don't know why you would joke about that.
At how you can't understand a God who "allows evil". Phat writes:
I have answered that many times. You really should read my posts. Second of all, if you can imagine a God stronger and smarter than you, and if you claim that YOUR Faith was every bit as strong---stronger even than MY faith, why did you dump Jesus? I dumped the character Jesus BECAUSE he's just a character. He never existed. He never died. He never rose from the dead. He is certainly NOT alive today. The theology you have made up around him is inconsistent and irrational nonsense. On the other hand, YOU have dumped his message.
Phat writes:
I thought I knew Jesus, just like you think you know Jesus. I was told that I could know Jesus just like you have been told that you can know Jesus. But it's a lie.
And if you were Christian...Mennonite or whatever...you would have known Jesus. Phat writes:
Not even if Jesus explicitly said that it was an ironclad rule that you MUST follow or else? And isn't it convenient that you decide you don't have to do anything hard?
I don't see something in the Good Book (no longer dusty, I wiped it clean with a sanitizing towelette) as an ironclad rule that I MUST follow or else. Phat writes:
First of all, "challenging Jesus" would be a very stupid thing to do. Second, you certainly DO mock the idea of giving up everything and trusting him.
You claim that I mock Jesus. Challenging Him is NOT mocking Him. Phat writes:
You're a slave to right-wing politics and right-wing theology.
Again, I'm a Son...NOT a Slave. Phat writes:
All faith is authoritarian. Why else would your handlers tell yo to avoid skepticism and doubt?
I think that your Faith was so authoritarian... Phat writes:
Just like YOU are afraid to THINK yourself out of it.
... that you were afraid--at first--to talk yourself out of it. Phat writes:
No. Critical thought is never secure. The whole point of critical thought is to avoid carved-in-stone secure ideas.
Once you did, you left in peace secure in your new knowledge of facts and critical thought... Phat writes:
What's sad about getting rid of a false idea?
...yet sad to wave away Jesus as some human-created mythos. Phat writes:
Because then you'd have to face the dreaded reality.
I would NEVER do such a thing. Phat writes:
A life without regrets is an empty life.
Perhaps I don't listen to Him as strongly as you once did, but I have no regrets. Phat writes:
The apologist has lost that argument many times in this forum.
The apologist would argue that evil had to be part of the option of true free will. Phat writes:
Why shouldn't intelligence lead where it leads?
Im in favor of intelligence and feel that it should *not* lead to abandoning ones faith.... Phat writes:
And yet you're afraid to doubt your faith and your made-up Jesus.
ringo writes:
OK, I agree. It is ALWAYS healthy to question and doubt. It is NEVER healthy to slavishly follow "what sounds good" even if it comes from the Almighty William Lane Craig. Phat writes:
I don't know what that means.
If an oddly shaped alian body were ever found, you all would jump on that belief simply due to the facts of scientific enquiry and evidence. Phat writes:
It is convenient that the Bible is wrong so many times just on the first page. You don't have to read much of it - but the more you do read, the more you find that's wrong.
Heck, dwise1 gave up after reading Genesis!! Phat writes:
You didn't give up on the Bible until the New testament. You made up your own Jesus to replace the one who expects you to DO things.
I would have given up too! Phat writes:
That's like saying you don't resent mothers feeding their babies. What on earth would give you the right to resent it?
I dont resent you all having given up. Phat writes:
Sure. They're more like slaves than you are. And yet you keep agreeing with Trump. Additionally, you can make a case for the modern conservatives and their slavish devotion to Trump. They are more like slaves than the Christians are! ************* Thanks for the report on Faith. I always liked her (she reminds me of a real-life Faith I used to know) and I wish she would/could come back. You can tell her that I, for one, forgive her, though I suspect that her list of her "sins" against us would not align with mine. I think I always gave better (worse) than I got with her."Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Why would I blame something that doesn't exist? I don't blame the leprechauns either. I won't disagree except to say not to blame Jesus for my behavior. It is all on me. And I don't care about your behavior. It's your hatred of thinking that I don't like."Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Then do not make the assertions. If you claim something you should be able to back it with actual facts.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7
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What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
ringo writes: Its not so much where "it" leads....its where you follow. Jesus implored us to follow Him. You claim I have no problem challenging His edicts, which is true by the way...but I maintain that you took it to a whole nother level.
Why shouldn't intelligence lead where it leads? Phat writes:
I think that your Faith was so authoritarian that you were afraid--at first--to talk yourself out of it. Once you did, you left in peace secure in your new knowledge of facts and critical thought...yet sad to wave away Jesus as some human-created mythos.ringo writes: Yet you turn right around and say to me:
I dumped the character Jesus BECAUSE he's just a character. He never existed. He never died. He never rose from the dead. He is certainly NOT alive today. The theology you have made up around him is inconsistent and irrational nonsense.(...)Why would I blame something that doesn't exist? I don't blame the leprechauns either.(...)What's sad about getting rid of a false idea?ringo writes: No, I mock you for claiming it is the standard. I would estimate that less than 5% of self-proclaimed Christians do it. You never dared to do it. You thought yourself out of what you labled a fantasy. How convenient! And then turn up the pressure on me, hoping I will also deny that Jesus exists. First of all, "challenging Jesus" would be a very stupid thing to do. Second, you certainly DO mock the idea of giving up everything and trusting him. If Jesus existed, (which I believe He does) He would not limit Himself to a character in a book. And I can assure you I don't make Him up. How could I? It's like making up a Donald Trump who never tweets and who loves poor people.It's your standards that are the illogical idea. Try and defend that while not believing that Jesus ever existed! All you are defending is a book. "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Ben Shapiro tore her up in a debate. You all by and large applaud her but I'd go with Ben's wisdom over hers.
Capitalism vs. Socialism Debate | Ben Shapiro vs. Ana Kasparian"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7
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What the fuck does this have to do with my post? Please quit trolling. Crawl back under your rock. You demand to be treated with respect but show no respect to those with beliefs different than yours.
How about you don't respond unless you actually have something relevant and pertinent to say? That way you will never respond to anyone. What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8513 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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Well with shapiro being a dishonest debater and human asshole that makes her right.
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
This is the first I have heard of him being dishonest. Have you any specific examples?
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
You just resent the fact that I'm not a member of the choir you preach to.
I'll go quietly to my rock, now. "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8513 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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And recently. Such nonsense in a national debate.
There is more, if you care to look. He's a well known nutjob. You can't miss it. Somehow, Phat, I'm not surprised you like this gabby crazy showman. Ben Shapiro criticised for denouncing ‘lesbians on the moon’ as reason for Artemis 1 launch delaysStop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
He is skilled at talking fast, providing points to back up his argument, and persuading those on the fence while preaching to his own conservative choir. Liberals are frustrated that nobody that they send can "beat" him in a debate. At least that's my take.
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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kjsimons Member Posts: 821 From: Orlando,FL Joined: Member Rating: 6.7
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He is a fucking asshole with no redeeming factors. It appears you would defend Hitlter or Stalin at this point.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Not at all. I just dislike trolls and people not smart enough to make an actual argument.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Percy Member Posts: 22394 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.2
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You are way past the point in life when you should be taken in by the equivalent of used car salesmen. I was just looking at a summary of Shapiro's views. I didn't know he believes homosexuality should be classified as a mental illness.
--Percy
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