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Author | Topic: Anti-theist | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Jesus also said blessed are those who have *not* seen and have yet believed. What's your point?
You would likely be even worse than Thomas. Ringo: "Unless all of my friends and colleagues agree with the evidence you show me, I'll forever doubt." Or even worse:Ringo: "Unless the people who claim to be followers give everything up in order to follow you, I will have my doubts that anyone knows you." Edited by Phat, : added sentence "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7 |
Repeating ad infinitum. There is no evidence.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
OK so we can agree that there is no evidence. Now what?
(off to work...will respond later. )"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9076 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.7
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Do you actually understand what you post?
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8513 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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OK so we can agree that there is no evidence. Now what? Now you stop claiming that your god is real and affects this universe in any way.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
The point is that Jesus presented evidence. Jesus respected evidence. You do not.
Jesus also said blessed are those who have *not* seen and have yet believed. What's your point? Phat writes:
Again, it's not about being "better" or "worse" than Thomas. Read my lips: Jesus voluntarily presented evidence to the other disciples when Thomas was not there. Thomas doubted the disciples. He didn't doubt Jesus. When Thomas was present, Jesus AGAIN voluntarily presented evidence to him. NOBODY in the story believed without evidence.
You would likely be even worse than Thomas. Phat writes:
Forever doubting is a good thing. Always be skeptical, no matter how much evidence there is. One little piece of new evidence can change everything. Take Newtonian mechanics. ALL of the evidence supported it - until it didn't.
Ringo: "Unless all of my friends and colleagues agree with the evidence you show me, I'll forever doubt." Phat writes:
How is that worse? Or even worse:Ringo: "Unless the people who claim to be followers give everything up in order to follow you, I will have my doubts that anyone knows you." And it isn't just that I "have doubts" about anybody knowing God. I have a pretty solid conclusion that YOU don't."Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I've told this story before: When we were kids, I could demonstrate to my younger brother that [something] was not true and his response would be, "But I think it is." I could demonstrate six ways from Sunday that it was NOT true and his reponse would still be, "But I think it is." OK so we can agree that there is no evidence. Now what? That's you. Nothing can sway you. No facts, no logic, no reality. Your opinion trumps all."Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
You are right, but please use a different word than "trumps all". I dont like that word for some reason.
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
I used it deliberately. I almost capitalized it to emphasize the point. please use a different word than "trumps all". I dont like that word for some reason. (For somebody who claims not to like Trump, you sure agree with him a lot.)"Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
Its not Trump I agree with Its conservative platforms like continuing with oil and gas until we get green off the ground, which most experts say will take between 10 and 20 years. Its keeping the place running instead of making ourselves feel the pinch while China burns coal and goes full ahead. What we need to get a handle on is spending...Although I think it's too late for that. America is like an addict in regard to money. We won't ever quit spending.
"A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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ringo Member (Idle past 412 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
O come on. You should know better than that. If you agree with A and Trump agrees with A, then you agree with Trump. Its not Trump I agree with Its conservative platforms like continuing with oil and gas until we get green off the ground And it's pretty likely that what Trump agrees with is good for Trump, not you. As for the blah blah blah about spending, shove it."Oh no, They've gone and named my home St. Petersburg. What's going on? Where are all the friends I had? It's all wrong, I'm feeling lost like I just don't belong. Give me back, give me back my Leningrad." -- Leningrad Cowboys
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Percy Member Posts: 22392 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 5.3 |
Phat writes: Its not Trump I agree with, it's conservative platforms like continuing with oil and gas until we get green off the ground, which most experts say will take between 10 and 20 years. No one who's taken seriously is arguing for abandoning fossil fuels before alternatives are in place. Where conservatives and liberals differ is the degree to which government should play a role in encouraging the transition.
Its keeping the place running instead of making ourselves feel the pinch while China burns coal and goes full ahead. As new technologies are increasingly adopted they inevitably become cheaper. That's what happens with everything, from cars to rockets to computers. The price of solar is a fraction of what it was 30 years ago, same for wind, same for batteries. To the extent China stays married to fossil fuels they fall further behind. They also remain a major contributor to climate change while making the planet a dirtier place for everyone. --Percy
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8513 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.3
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We’ve heard this name a few times in various discussions around these parts. William Lane Craig is a popular religious nutcase always proposing elaborate schemes to justify Christianity as the only game in town. Phat is a fan, cites his stuff now and then. Others have used his words, his illogical sillygisms, as proof they need to rule the world. Quite popular with the Christians because, though his schtick is logically stupid, he presents it so well.
Well, turns out there are PHILISOPHICAL sins to be admitted by the great apologist. Surprising admissions of acceptance of his pascal's wager conversion as a teen sans any thought basis other than he was impressed by the message. Lots of philosophical heavy work in that one. And he wants to lower the bar more. Have to wonder if he recognizes he has admitted the emotional base from which his religion springs without any efficacy. His religion is purely emotional and nothing more. No still small voices, no epiphany. Just a scary story and pascal’s wager.
And he wants to lower the bar of efficacy, the level of feeble excuse and smoke and mirrors at which he wants people to believe, even further.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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Phat Member Posts: 18262 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.1 |
AZ whatever am I going to do with you? You not only adopted the mousey little Mr.Deity (Way Of The Mister indeed! ) but you now are questioning the mind of William Lane Craig! I suppose it is healthy to question and even doubt at times, but look at the fruit it has produced in your life! You are mad at all religious minds and souls.
When the economy goes berzerk, as it surely will within 5 years at the latest, and when food scarcity, wars and rumors of wars, and draconian politicians who want to indoctrinate children to understand their sexuality away from their parents become common (oh wait...it already has! ) you can rest assured that the culture war will have become mainstream. Hopefully, you and I can continue talking through all of thisforeknown chaos. Oh and by the way, I'm interested in this Paulogia fellow. I plan on watching a few of his episodes! "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " *** “…far from science having buried God, not only do the results of science point towards his existence, but the scientific enterprise itself is validated by his existence.”- Dr.John Lennox “A God without wrath brought men without sin into a Kingdom without judgment through the ministrations of a Christ without a Cross.” “The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of a doubt, what is laid before him.” — Leo Tolstoy, The Kingdom of God is Within You
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8513 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.3 |
The point you miss, Phat, is that for all these years of lectures and books, attempted proofs, (il)logical sillygisms for decades was all a sham. He has admitted that his religious views were purely emotional from the outset as he sees intellect having no part in what GDR might call "choosing a faith".
The first religious story he heard and, without any thought, he swallowed the obligatory hook, line, sinker. He may be a believer but he's been faking his story ever since. He has such a great presentation and personality and the show worked out for him with money, women, fame. Ok, so maybe, like Joel Osteen, Ray Comfort, others he's not so dumb. Just another corrupt charlatan fleecing his flock. Now, he's on to the schtick that if he can dumb down the intellectual requirements for belief, indeed eliminate them, the more, and easier, flock he'll have to fleece. He's been lying to you, Phat. Everything he has presented has not been for some higher purpose, but clumsily crafted for his traveling medicine show.
You are mad at all religious minds and souls. Not so much mad as exceptionally disappointed. Increasingly intolerant. The human species was supposed to be better than this by now but shitheads like Craig keep poisoning the human mind. And not for god but for profit.Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!
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