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Author | Topic: Coffee House Musings on Creationist Topic Proposals | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5
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Sludge writes: That was a miscarriage of justice. Well, it stopped a group of religious fanatics from trying to indoctrinate other people's children.
Sludge writes: It will be overturned one day Nothing would surprise me as the U.S. is corrupted and turned into a shithole country, but as far as i know there are no appeals of the decision working their way through the court system at this time.
Sludge writes: The truth cannot be suppressed forever. This is probably correct. What truth are you talking about, and if it's be suppressed how do you know about it?Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9202 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 3.4 |
You have no idea how courts work in the US do you.
What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence. -Christopher Hitchens Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
Percy writes:
1.
Yes, you're absolutely right, scientifically we can't prove it.
Believe it or not, I am not a scientist, but it's my understanding that there's is a big difference between (a) a scientist claiming to "know" how such-and-such works, and (b) a scientist proposing a theory for how such-and-such works. (a) carries the burden of truth. I imagine that if a scientist publicly claims to "know" something, he is expected to prove to his peers that his claimed knowledge is in fact, true ... lest he be accused of intellectual fraud.(b) on the other hand, does not carry the burden of truth. If a scientist proposes a theory, he is not expected to prove to his peers that it's true. 2.If a scientist claims to "know" how evolution works, he must prove that he knows how evolution works in (a) real-time (the present), and (b) the past (the history of life as revealed by the fossil record). You admit that "scientifically we can't prove" that scientists know what process produced the changes evident in the fossil record. It follows therefore that since no scientist can satisfy (b), no scientist can claim to "know" how evolution works.
Scientifically we can't prove anything and never have.
That being so, how can a scientist claim to "know" how evolution works even in real-time if he can't prove anything?
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
Tanypteryx writes:
Like I said, a miscarriage of justice. Well, it stopped a group of religious fanatics from trying to indoctrinate other people's children. A sad day for truth, to be sure.
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
Sludge writes: A sad day for truth What truth?Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
Dredge writes:
providing an example of how the theory that all life on earth shares a common ancestor has contribted to the treatment of disease.AZPaul3 writes:
Tell me, good sir, is it
Because all life, as described and supported in the ToE, is of the same chemistry. That gives us a big insight into how and why disease, whether pathogenic or genetic, happens and may be treated.
(a) the genetic similarties between humans and other animals that have proven useful in medicine, or is it (b) the explanation for why those similarities exist (universal common ancestry) that has proven useful in medicine? It is my fervent hope that, upon reflection, you will come to the conclusion that it is (a) that has proven useful in medicine, and that that utility is indepedent of (b), which is actually useless and irrelevant.
You really are dumb
I completely agree.
God that has to suck.
It does ... but against all odds, I 've somehow managed to survive all these years.
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
The truth of divine creation.
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
Theodoric writes:
It's possible that your assessment contains an element of truth.
have no idea how courts work in the US do you.
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
There's no truth without supporting evidence.
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5
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It's the genetic similarities due to universal common ancestry between humans and other animals that have proven useful in medicine.
Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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Dredge Member (Idle past 104 days) Posts: 2850 From: Australia Joined: |
Tanypteryx writes:
If you take "due to universal common ancestry" out of that sentence, you are left with ... It's the genetic similarities due to universal common ancestry between humans and other animals that have proven useful in medicine. "It's the genetic similarities between humans and other animals that have proven useful in medicine." The "due to universal common ancestry" is irrelevant. Medicine doesn't need to know what produced the genetic similarities to make use of them.
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5 |
Sludge writes: The "due to universal common ancestry" is irrelevant. Medicine doesn't need to know what produced the genetic similarities to make use of them. Well, medicine DOES know about universal common ancestry and the more you know the more likely you will be able to find models for human health issues. You can pray for miracles all you want but I will go with medical science every time. Knowledge keeps increasing, but ignorance and stupidity lead nowhere good.Edited by Tanypteryx, . Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5952 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7
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... , but ignorance and stupidity lead nowhere. That is not true. And history is filled with examples of where ignorance and stupidity do lead. The short list includes famine and death. For example, Lysenkoism:
quote Most other treatments have referred to crop failures and famine due to Lysenkoism. Add to that medical examples, like a national authority advising that, since bleach kills the COVID virus, we should inject bleach into our bodies. And ignorance and stupidity related to vaccination leading to the reemergence of very serious diseases that had been eradicated (eg, polio showing up in New York City wastewater, meaning that it is circulating within the population).
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Tanypteryx Member Posts: 4451 From: Oregon, USA Joined: Member Rating: 5.5
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dwise1 writes: ... , but ignorance and stupidity lead nowhere.
That is not true. And history is filled with examples of where ignorance and stupidity do lead. The short list includes famine and death. Yeah, I should have said "but ignorance and stupidity lead nowhere good. Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned! What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq
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dwise1 Member Posts: 5952 Joined: Member Rating: 5.7
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My creation/evolution website includes two quotes regarding creationists, the first one being Sun Tzu's "Know your enemy and know yourself ... ".
The other is from my memory of an NPR interview with a Mississippi governor in the 80's or 90's. In support of his efforts at educational reform, he said (quoting from memory):
quote And yet they keep trying ignorance, over and over again.
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