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Author Topic:   An Ether-Based Creation Model
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 523 of 589 (893446)
04-13-2022 12:27 PM
Reply to: Message 521 by Michael MD
04-13-2022 12:09 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
My Ether Model has such a major fundamental disconnect with currently-accepted physics that the two could never combine in the way you mention, i.e., into "a new model that would expand physics."
Well, that is not how science progresses. It's built on the knowledge we have already gained. There have to be clues that point to new phenomena and you have not presented any clues that even hint at ether. You have to explain things better than existing physics and so far you have not.
We have asked hundreds of questions but you give us the same sciency sounding words, but not a single coherent explanation.
Accepting an ether model like mine would necessitate almost a whole new library of work investigating and theorizing on etheric processes as the true forces underlying and underpinning quantum physics, a library section separate from the libraries now dealing with physics.
A whole new library, huh? Well you should get started on that with a paper published in a peer reviewed journal. The physics sections of libraries are full of papers documenting actual observations.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 521 by Michael MD, posted 04-13-2022 12:09 PM Michael MD has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 526 of 589 (893453)
04-14-2022 12:32 AM
Reply to: Message 525 by dwise1
04-13-2022 3:07 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
It makes no sense whatsoever (but then neither does anything else creationists come up with).
In this case what strikes as most bizarre is he completely misinterpreted some of my questions, in multiple tries.
Also when he stated my questions he reworded them. I guess that part doesn't matter, since his answers were all content free, meaningless, jargon. Not once has he employed any of the numerous suggestions on how to improve his model and his explanations.
This is why those rare few creationists that finally wake up to reality are so notable...because it hardly ever happens. I'm really glad I was so young when I realized the religion and magic had no answers to anything and certainly not anything important.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 525 by dwise1, posted 04-13-2022 3:07 PM dwise1 has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(2)
Message 530 of 589 (893686)
04-18-2022 11:56 AM
Reply to: Message 529 by ringo
04-18-2022 11:47 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
Learn something before you criticize the people who know.
I think that is pretty unlikely. He thinks magic aliens are sending him coded messages about ether.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 529 by ringo, posted 04-18-2022 11:47 AM ringo has seen this message but not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(2)
Message 532 of 589 (893857)
04-21-2022 12:51 PM
Reply to: Message 531 by Michael MD
04-21-2022 12:48 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
So basically, ether is magic aliens.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 531 by Michael MD, posted 04-21-2022 12:48 PM Michael MD has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 534 by Stile, posted 04-21-2022 12:56 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(2)
Message 535 of 589 (893860)
04-21-2022 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 534 by Stile
04-21-2022 12:56 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
Stile writes:
Tanypteryx writes:
So basically, ether is magic aliens.
Very skinny aliens.
They have negative fat.
Yep, the math should confirm that.
Finally, some real answers!

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 534 by Stile, posted 04-21-2022 12:56 PM Stile has seen this message but not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 539 of 589 (893925)
04-23-2022 3:53 PM
Reply to: Message 536 by Michael MD
04-23-2022 2:03 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
The important disconnects involve much more than that.
Can you explain this more fully please?
ABE:
I disagree with your implication that my Ether Model's perspectives and differences with respect to the currently accepted models of cosmology and physics is due to my "lack of understanding" the mainstream models.
I have to say that your descriptions and clarifications of "mainstream models" didn't increase, or even agree with, my understanding of mainstream models.
Edited by Tanypteryx, : No reason given.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 536 by Michael MD, posted 04-23-2022 2:03 PM Michael MD has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 541 of 589 (893956)
04-25-2022 12:40 PM
Reply to: Message 536 by Michael MD
04-23-2022 2:03 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
In my Model, on the other hand, the smallest units are referred to as (still more-rarified, than neutrinos, and undetectable for us) elemental ether units.
You need to come up with better names. "Elemental ether units" sucks as a name. I'm going to start using a more functional name: Etherors.
Just as no one wants to call electrons "electromagnetic force carrier units", so you should start using "etheror" for your basic imaginary and undetectable units.
If you don't come up with better names, no one is going to pay any attention to your model.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 536 by Michael MD, posted 04-23-2022 2:03 PM Michael MD has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 542 by jar, posted 04-25-2022 12:49 PM Tanypteryx has not replied
 Message 543 by AZPaul3, posted 04-25-2022 4:17 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


Message 544 of 589 (893959)
04-25-2022 4:55 PM
Reply to: Message 543 by AZPaul3
04-25-2022 4:17 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
Wait just a minute! Wasn't "Insanitite" the product name for Trump's scam where he was selling his brain cells for $20 each? Then it turned out he didn't have any detectable brain cells so the had to use frog brain cells and we all know what happened next. Hmmmm, or maybe that was the "uvbencondium" scam?
Tinyweenium. Ignoranfimal. Mentalphallium. Insanitite.
Anyway, all good names for Michael to consider!

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 543 by AZPaul3, posted 04-25-2022 4:17 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 561 of 589 (894169)
05-04-2022 2:20 PM
Reply to: Message 559 by Michael MD
05-04-2022 10:21 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
In my Model, light beams from a star traverse space differently from how physics now views it. In my Model, the primary process occurs in the ether matrix, as elemental ether units, when they "feel" another similarly-patterned zone through the ether, transmit a patterned impulse, through a mechanism of vibratory contact, unit-to-unit. The ether units do not move in the inertial sense. Quantum units are generated as part of such an etheric process. If light beams are involved, this generates quantum photons all along the pathway of the light beam. Here again, inertial motion is not involved.
You speak so authoritatively here about something that has never been detected and without any supporting evidence. "Light beams" is a term I had not noticed physicists using when they talk about the properties of light.
Can you explain the emission and absorption lines in electromagnetic spectrums?
Can you explain how photons of different wavelengths are emitted?
Are "quantum photons" different from other photons?
Gravity, in my model, involves "nearly quantum," or etheroidal, units which "leak" from inside a quantally-structured body, through its "relatively permeable" (to sub-quantum sized units), themselves quantum-sized, units making up the outer surface, into the space between it and another body. -This partially quantizes the space between the bodies, partially converting that space into something a bit more similar to the interiors of the bodies.
Another authoritative statement, but no experimental supporting evidence.
Do you think mass curves spacetime?
Do you even think there is such a thing as spacetime?
Can you use your ether model to calculate the orbits of planets around a star based on their mass and velocity?

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 559 by Michael MD, posted 05-04-2022 10:21 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 562 by Michael MD, posted 05-07-2022 7:16 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 564 of 589 (894243)
05-07-2022 8:03 PM
Reply to: Message 562 by Michael MD
05-07-2022 7:16 PM


Re: Powerful Stuff
In brief, I'll just say that you continue to post criticisms that are based on quantum theory,
Specifically, could you say which criticisms you're talking about?
Are you saying my questions are criticisms?
Are you saying that emission and absorption lines in electromagnetic spectrums are not real phenomena?
Or that photons don't have different wavelengths?
Do you have a scientific definition of a light beam?
If you cannot explain things better than quantum physics does, then your model is flawed.
and its assumptions, especially the key assumption that there is no ether,
This is incorrect. Quantum theory does not make any assumptions about whether ether exists or not. It doesn't say anything about ether period. If it's an assumption, it's a completely unexpressed one.
I'm not able to answer all your questions in detail right now, due to time constraints.
There's no rush, but lets just be clear here. You didn't attempt to answer my questions at all.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 562 by Michael MD, posted 05-07-2022 7:16 PM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 565 by Michael MD, posted 05-13-2022 9:16 AM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(5)
Message 566 of 589 (894369)
05-13-2022 7:53 PM
Reply to: Message 565 by Michael MD
05-13-2022 9:16 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
Then, when an etheroidal unit reaches the size- scale of a quantum unit, it can start operating as patrt of the quantum dynamics system, which operates differently.
OK, so we can continue to use physics as if the ether is imaginary and has no effect.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 565 by Michael MD, posted 05-13-2022 9:16 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 567 by Michael MD, posted 06-22-2022 9:10 AM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 570 of 589 (895339)
06-22-2022 5:21 PM
Reply to: Message 567 by Michael MD
06-22-2022 9:10 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
You sure have a lot of specific knowledge about something that is completely undetected, while not showing any details, like calculations, that would demonstrate this is anything other than your imaginary fantasy.
my Model makes sense.
You are the only one who thinks so.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 567 by Michael MD, posted 06-22-2022 9:10 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 571 by Michael MD, posted 06-24-2022 9:16 AM Tanypteryx has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 573 of 589 (895378)
06-24-2022 11:58 AM
Reply to: Message 571 by Michael MD
06-24-2022 9:16 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
I have no idea what you mean by wide ranging and it only seems logical to you.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 571 by Michael MD, posted 06-24-2022 9:16 AM Michael MD has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 580 of 589 (895410)
06-26-2022 11:10 AM
Reply to: Message 578 by Michael MD
06-26-2022 10:23 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
It would not be fair to argue with my Model based on the present assumption of the consensus that the standard Model is established factual reality, which I suspect underlays the criticism.
I can't speak for others, but my criticism is your complete lack of any supporting evidence. You speak in specifics about something that remains undetected.
There is no "fairness" involved in science. Present evidence if you want to convince your critics.
The only way to pointedly argue against my Model would be to cite specific points I made, and point out internal inconsistencies or internal fallacies in logic.
Somewhere up-thread you implied that you got you "model" from some kind of coded messages from aliens, without any supporting evidence, and you expect us to take you seriously?
There are still many mysteries and unknowns in physics, but you have not attempted to demonstrate how your model would contribute an improved understanding of any of them.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 578 by Michael MD, posted 06-26-2022 10:23 AM Michael MD has not replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4344
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 5.9


(1)
Message 584 of 589 (895437)
06-27-2022 12:42 PM
Reply to: Message 575 by Michael MD
06-26-2022 3:42 AM


Re: Powerful Stuff
Where else is there a detailed scientific model ranging from first cause through creation to our present world?
Well, that sure isn't what we see in your ether "model." You have presented nothing scientific or detailed.
Where we do find detailed scientific evidence and reasoning is in physics textbooks and university courses in quantum physics, particle physics, astrophysics, thermodynamics and numerous other scientific courses.
We know so much about physics that we can write thick, heavy textbooks on all the different branches of physics.
The Ether Model within this Thread deserves serious consideration as an alternative to standard physics theory.
"Deserves serious consideration as an alternative to standard physics theory", seriously? You have not demonstrated a single flaw in standard physics theory, or presented any alternatives.
Vaguely, talking about "first causal jiggly units" and thinking it challenges all of physics or even a teeny, tiny part of physics, is just plain silly.

Stop Tzar Vladimir the Condemned!

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 575 by Michael MD, posted 06-26-2022 3:42 AM Michael MD has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 585 by Michael MD, posted 06-30-2022 9:04 AM Tanypteryx has replied

  
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