Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 53 (9179 total)
4 online now:
Newest Member: Anig
Post Volume: Total: 918,042 Year: 5,299/9,624 Month: 324/323 Week: 168/160 Day: 4/38 Hour: 0/3


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   The Power of the New Intelligent Design...
jar
Member
Posts: 34115
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.1


(1)
Message 151 of 1197 (891866)
02-15-2022 8:17 AM
Reply to: Message 148 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 12:59 AM


You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
You were lucky enough to find your way here and there are lots of us willing to help you learn the basics of TOE, Christianity, Reality, the mechanics of thinking and even how you might be able to challenge the TOE.
But not unless you decide to stop being willfully ignorant.
Throw intelligent design away.
Throw your god away.
Ask questions.
Right now you are simply a pitiful example of the very worst of the Christian Cult of Ignorance and Deceit.
Edited by jar, : applin spallin

My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 12:59 AM MrIntelligentDesign has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:50 PM jar has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8610
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 152 of 1197 (891867)
02-15-2022 4:44 PM
Reply to: Message 148 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 12:59 AM


Got Any ID?
MrID said:
You really do not know the ToE well...
AZPaul3 said:
But you obviously do, so, please tell us all how ToE works.
NO! I change my mind! I don’t want to know about the ToE. I don’t care what you think of the ToE.
I want to know about your new ID v 2. You got any ID? Show me your ID.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 148 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 12:59 AM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 153 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-15-2022 6:59 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4553
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.0


Message 153 of 1197 (891868)
02-15-2022 6:59 PM
Reply to: Message 152 by AZPaul3
02-15-2022 4:44 PM


Re: Got Any ID?
Must be busy getting all those papers submitted to science journals for publication...

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 152 by AZPaul3, posted 02-15-2022 4:44 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 154 by AZPaul3, posted 02-15-2022 7:08 PM Tanypteryx has replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8610
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 154 of 1197 (891869)
02-15-2022 7:08 PM
Reply to: Message 153 by Tanypteryx
02-15-2022 6:59 PM


Re: Got Any ID?
Well, it's not fair to not share. If he wanted to be friendly he would share. I am disappointed. Bitterly disappointed. Yep.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 153 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-15-2022 6:59 PM Tanypteryx has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-15-2022 7:11 PM AZPaul3 has not replied
 Message 157 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:51 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4553
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.0


Message 155 of 1197 (891870)
02-15-2022 7:11 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by AZPaul3
02-15-2022 7:08 PM


Re: Got Any ID?
Yep, bitterly disappointed.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by AZPaul3, posted 02-15-2022 7:08 PM AZPaul3 has not replied

  
MrIntelligentDesign
Member (Idle past 414 days)
Posts: 248
Joined: 09-21-2015


Message 156 of 1197 (891871)
02-15-2022 8:50 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by jar
02-15-2022 8:17 AM


Re: You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
Look, the biological world and living organisms are in front of us.. we see them everyday, that is the reality. You do not need ToE to explain biology. You just need reality to explain reality.
ToE is not the reality.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by jar, posted 02-15-2022 8:17 AM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-15-2022 10:59 PM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied
 Message 159 by PaulK, posted 02-16-2022 5:18 AM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied
 Message 160 by jar, posted 02-16-2022 7:34 AM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied
 Message 165 by dwise1, posted 02-16-2022 3:49 PM MrIntelligentDesign has replied

  
MrIntelligentDesign
Member (Idle past 414 days)
Posts: 248
Joined: 09-21-2015


Message 157 of 1197 (891872)
02-15-2022 8:51 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by AZPaul3
02-15-2022 7:08 PM


Re: Got Any ID?
I told you that AFTERR they rejected me, since I will uploading the article all possible free access journals...

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by AZPaul3, posted 02-15-2022 7:08 PM AZPaul3 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 161 by AZPaul3, posted 02-16-2022 7:50 AM MrIntelligentDesign has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4553
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.0


Message 158 of 1197 (891873)
02-15-2022 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 8:50 PM


Re: You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
Biology is the Theory of Evolution.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:50 PM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied

  
PaulK
Member
Posts: 17848
Joined: 01-10-2003
Member Rating: 3.5


Message 159 of 1197 (891874)
02-16-2022 5:18 AM
Reply to: Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 8:50 PM


Re: You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
quote:
Look, the biological world and living organisms are in front of us.. we see them everyday, that is the reality. You do not need ToE to explain biology. You just need reality to explain reality.
Which is why your mental illness defeats you.
In reality you don’t understand what you’re talking about. You’re not doing science. Your “papers” are nonsense that won’t get published in any respectable journal.
That you can think otherwise just shows that you need psychiatric help. So you can get back to reality.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:50 PM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied

  
jar
Member
Posts: 34115
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004
Member Rating: 3.1


Message 160 of 1197 (891875)
02-16-2022 7:34 AM
Reply to: Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 8:50 PM


Re: You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
Good, maybe you understand the very first lesson.
The MAP is not the territory.
True reality is all around us but not the explanation of how such critters came to exist.
The TOE is the map that explains how the reality came to exist.

My Website: My Website

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:50 PM MrIntelligentDesign has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8610
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 161 of 1197 (891876)
02-16-2022 7:50 AM
Reply to: Message 157 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 8:51 PM


Got No ID
You poor demented fool. You are not going to get published ... by anyone ... ever. Which is fine by me since you keep us entertained.
Dance, squeaky toy. Sing your one-note montra about how smart you are and dance for us.

Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:51 PM MrIntelligentDesign has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-16-2022 10:59 AM AZPaul3 has not replied
 Message 167 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-16-2022 6:00 PM AZPaul3 has replied

  
Tanypteryx
Member
Posts: 4553
From: Oregon, USA
Joined: 08-27-2006
Member Rating: 4.0


(1)
Message 162 of 1197 (891877)
02-16-2022 10:59 AM
Reply to: Message 161 by AZPaul3
02-16-2022 7:50 AM


Re: Got No ID
The bottom of the barrel is much worse than we thought.

What if Eleanor Roosevelt had wings? -- Monty Python

One important characteristic of a theory is that is has survived repeated attempts to falsify it. Contrary to your understanding, all available evidence confirms it. --Subbie

If evolution is shown to be false, it will be at the hands of things that are true, not made up. --percy

The reason that we have the scientific method is because common sense isn't reliable. -- Taq


This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by AZPaul3, posted 02-16-2022 7:50 AM AZPaul3 has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 163 by nwr, posted 02-16-2022 1:00 PM Tanypteryx has not replied

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6434
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 4.6


(1)
Message 163 of 1197 (891878)
02-16-2022 1:00 PM
Reply to: Message 162 by Tanypteryx
02-16-2022 10:59 AM


Re: Got No ID
The bottom of the barrel is much worse than we thought.
Clearly, you are an optimist.
There is no bottom.

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 162 by Tanypteryx, posted 02-16-2022 10:59 AM Tanypteryx has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 164 by dwise1, posted 02-16-2022 2:20 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


(5)
Message 164 of 1197 (891879)
02-16-2022 2:20 PM
Reply to: Message 163 by nwr
02-16-2022 1:00 PM


Re: Got No ID
There is no bottom.
In military humor there was a list of quotes from British naval officer fitness reports (fitreps, the officer version of enlisted evals). One memorable one that repeatedly comes to mind in my encounters with creationists:
quote:
Since my last report he has reached rock bottom, and has started to dig.
 

Just for fun, a few more from that list:
  • His men would follow him anywhere, but only out of curiosity.
  • This Officer is really not so much of a has-been, but more of a definitely won't-be.
  • When she opens her mouth, it seems that this is only to change whichever foot was previously in there.
  • He has carried out each and every one of his duties to his entire satisfaction.
  • He would be out of his depth in a car park puddle.
  • This Officer reminds me very much of a gyroscope - always spinning around at a frantic pace, but not really going anywhere.
  • This young lady has delusions of adequacy.
  • When he joined my ship, this Officer was something of a granny; since then he has aged considerably.
  • She sets low personal standards and then consistently fails to achieve them.
  • This Officer should go far - and the sooner he starts, the better.
  • This man is depriving a village somewhere of an idiot.
Carry out the Plan of the Day! Dismissed!
 

This message is a reply to:
 Message 163 by nwr, posted 02-16-2022 1:00 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
dwise1
Member
Posts: 5982
Joined: 05-02-2006
Member Rating: 2.4


(4)
Message 165 of 1197 (891881)
02-16-2022 3:49 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign
02-15-2022 8:50 PM


Re: You actually still have a chance to cure your ignorance.
Casting more pearls before swine (meaning you, but since you're obviously a Christian I have no doubt that you cannot recognize that reference since you will not have actually read the Bible), but lurkers may benefit from these pearls even though you never will.
Look, the biological world and living organisms are in front of us.. we see them everyday, that is the reality. You do not need ToE to explain biology. You just need reality to explain reality.
Since you have displayed no understanding of science, plus learn something and realize that the purpose and goal of science is to study the physical universe (AKA "reality") and to discover how it works. That means that when a scientist observes something, his first question will be "How does that work?"
In contrast, "Intelligent Design" (ID) doesn't care how reality works (nor even what reality is), but rather seeks to subvert reality to be subordinate to their religious misconceptions. We see that in their basic argument of [voice=dull_IDiot]"Duh, this is really complex; I can't figure how it happened so God must'a dun it!"[/voice] The problem for ID is that "god-did-it" answers nothing and even serves to stop science from seeking answers (refer to the topic here, So Just How is ID's Supernatural-based Science Supposed to Work? (SUM. MESSAGES ONLY)).
Amateur geologist J. Richard Wakefield expressed it very well in two articles in which he examined Robert Gentry's bogus polonium-halo claims. He went to the sites where Gentry had obtained his samples and found that Gentry had grossly misrepresented those formations. At first Gentry agreed to work with him, but then quickly backed out as the truth started to come out.
Wakefield concluded one article ("Gentry's Tiny Mystery -- Unsupported by Geology" by J. Richard Wakefield, Creation/Evolution Issue XXII, Winter 1987-1988, pp 31-32) with:
quote:
Gentry's case depends upon his halos remaining a mystery. Once a naturalistic explanation is discovered, his claim of a supernatural origin is washed up. So he will not give aid or support to suggestions that might resolve the mystery. Science works toward an increase in knowledge; creationism depends upon a lack of it. Science promotes the open-ended search; creationism supports giving up and looking no further. It is clear which method Gentry advocates.
In another article which I must quote from memory, Wakefield's conclusion included:
quote:
When a scientist encounters a mystery, he must do everything he can to solve that mystery. When a creationist encounters a mystery, he equates it with God and so must do everything he can to keep it a mystery.
That describes ID completely.
 
For example, what about the question of how biology works?
A basic definition of evolution that I've adopted is that it's the cumulative consequences of what happens when life does what life naturally does, especially what happens to generations of populations of individuals as they survive, reproduce offspring who are very similar to them yet different, then those offspring mature and survive (or don't), etc, etc, etc. That in its most basic minimalist form is what evolution works with.
ID's basis is "God did it". Doesn't deal with how life actually works, nor with reality itself. Just "goddidit".
ToE is not the reality.
The Theory of Evolution is the best explanation that we have of everything that we see in biology. In contrast, ID explains nothing about biology.
So which is the better explanation? Something that actually offers an explanation or something that can never explain anything?
Now, why should an explanation of biology have any importance? Basically, it's in the difference between knowledge and understanding. Knowledge is nothing but a dry list of facts that you must memorize but which tells you nothing about those facts. Understanding is realizing what all those dry facts have to do with each other and with so much else.
Our first stop in that question is the very famous quote from an article by Theodosius Dobzhansky, Nothing in Biology Makes Sense Except in the Light of Evolution (American Biology Teacher 35:125-129 (March 1973), p. 129) -- (quoted here a bit more fully than usual):
quote:
Seen in the light of evolution, biology is, perhaps, intellectually the most satisfying and inspiring science. Without that light, it becomes a pile of sundry facts -- some of them interesting or curious, but making no meaningful picture as a whole. . . . Does the evolutionary doctrine clash with religious faith? It does not. It is a blunder to mistake the Holy Scriptures for elementary textbooks of astronomy, geology, biology, and anthropology. Only if symbols are construed to mean what they are not intended to mean can there arise imaginary, insoluble conflicts. As pointed out above, the blunder leads to blasphemy: the Creator is accused of systematic deceitfulness."
In the family I had built, our love of science was based in understanding it and how it worked, a love that we passed on to my sons who also grew up loving science. In contrast, my nephew's experience with science was solely memorizing disassociated facts that made no sense, so he grew up hating science. Many people have similar love-vs-hate relationships with history depending on whether they learned history with the motivations involved or solely as a list of dry and very dusty names and dates.
Decades ago, I attended a talk by Dr. Eugenie Scott, then-Executive Director of the National Center for Science Education (NCSE). In her talk, she told a story from her personal experience as a Physical Anthropology professor (entirely from memory and placing her in the third person):
quote:
Surprisingly, many biology departments do not teach evolution to their undergraduates -- maybe they're saving that for grad school. So her physical anthropology class would include biology seniors who needed one more science class to meet their general ed requirements and they figured her class would be an "easy A". Poor fools! For one thing, she most definitely taught evolution in her class.
That meant that these biology majors were learning about evolution for the first time. As the semester progressed, she would watch these bio majors for that "aha!" look to show up on their faces as they would suddenly realize, "So that's why ... ". Up to that point, they had had to memorize biological facts with no idea why it was that way. Now they understood why.
Dr. Scott had presented that story to illustrate the truth of Theodosius Dobzhansky's statement that nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution.
 
Now to really blow MrID's mind: ToE is not reality, but rather it explains reality. That is what a theory does: it explains something.
ID explains nothing. If you have any evidence or actual arguments to refute that, then do please present it. Any of it.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-15-2022 8:50 PM MrIntelligentDesign has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 166 by MrIntelligentDesign, posted 02-16-2022 5:58 PM dwise1 has replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024