|
Register | Sign In |
|
QuickSearch
Thread ▼ Details |
|
|
Author | Topic: "Best" evidence for evolution. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Reality also has more than two species and even mutable species.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
And it's important to remember how selection works. Any new mutations that are not so detrimental that they prevent that individual from reproducing can get passed on. So even partial changes that are not so serious that they keep the critter from reproducing are not selected against.
BUT Wait...there's more. Any mutations that confer an increased advantage in breeding or survival are selective passed on. That means the neutral or positive mutations can continue but the negative mutations are selectively removed. Mutations plus Selection guarantees that there will be new species over time.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: As long as you speak in abstract generalizations you can obscure the fact that it won't work. And yet the reality is that it does work. The Turtle moves.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Obviously that makes yhou feel better but it doesn't change the fact that you can't get from one species to another any other way, and there's no way to predict that you're going to get any kind of useful mutations.. Learn the basics Faith. I even explained them to you above but I will repeat yet again.
quote: From Message 256 The beauty is that mutations do happen and selection tosses the ones that are really so detrimental it keeps the critter from reproducing but keeps the ones that are neutral or beneficial. It really does guarantee that there must be new species over time. Really Faith, try to learn the basics and throw all the truly silly stuff like Creationism and the Flood and the Christianity you market away.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
|
When life starts as single cell or less organisms there is initially only one direction it can go, towards increased complexity. But once there are more complex critters there are three directions, more complex, less complex and same complexity.
Basics Faith. Learn the basics you have been taught over the last nineteen years here at EvC.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Getting even ONE change that could conceivably be useful seems mathematically impossible to me but I'm no mathematician, so "impossible" is just "impossible" to me. Once again, learn the very basics Faith. Mutations happen. We can find mutations in every living critter. Selection happens. We can see selection happening in real time. And it's important to remember how selection works. Any new mutations that are not so detrimental that they prevent that individual from reproducing can get passed on. So even partial changes that are not so serious that they keep the critter from reproducing are not selected against. BUT Wait...there's more. Any mutations that confer an increased advantage in breeding or survival are selective passed on. That means the neutral or positive mutations can continue but the negative mutations are selectively removed. Mutations plus Selection guarantees that there will be new species over time.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Give us a sequence of mutations and selections that could get us from a reptile to a mammal, or just a reptilian organ to a mammalian organ. The generalities are just a way to hide the fact that it's impossible. No Faith; those generalities show that it is not impossible but rather inevitable. Does mutation happen Faith?
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: They mean nothing if there is no way to even imagine how you could get genetically from one to the other. But once again, reality shows you are simply wrong. Not only can I imagine it, I described the model, method, process, procedure and mechanism involved.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: I'm sorry, but trial and error of mutatiobns is obviouslyu the only possible way evolution could ever occur and it's impossible and that's the end of that. You keep saying stuff like that but never provide any evidence or even reasoning of why it should be correct. Time for you to actually defend your assertion.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Plus modern humans have only been around for a couple hundred thousand years so just a blink out of the likely four billion years there has been life on the Earth. In addition we have modified the variation trends in environmental conditions to the extent we are reducing the variability in the selection process.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
By Faith's definition all mammalia are the same species.
Works for me. Edited by jar, : fix subtitle
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: It COULD be mostly a problem of disagreement since this is a paradigm clash at root, one model opposing another, but such a clash usually also involves redefinition of terms and therefore a lot of misunderstanding. But you do not have a model Faith and have NEVER been able to present your model, method, mechanism, process or procedure while the conventional approach as developed by Creationist does have model, method, mechanism, process and procedure. Edited by jar, : fix sub-title
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Here I'll try again. Life was originally created in separate Kinds, each of which is designed to form hundreds of wonderful variations when isolated into separate populations which brings about new combinations of traits that cause each new subspecies to differ from all the others. During the Flood the enormous genetic variability that each was created with was severely bottlenecked, but at that time there was still an enormous amount of genetic variability in every individual so that the bottleneck only reduced the heterozygosity in each genome to a very limited extent, allowing for the great number of wonderful variations on all the creatures we see today, including all the races of humanity. I believe we have something like 7% heterozygosity left in the human population and probably some comparable percentage in other species, but at the time of the Flood it must have been much greater, 80%?: 50%? The Fall had brought death and disease into the world which had previously not existed, though all creatures nevertheless lived for hundreds of years up until the Flood when the changes in the environment brought about by that event, and the genetic bottleneck of each creature, contributed to the decreasing longevity and health we see in the genealogies of the scripture. It seems you have no idea what a model, method, mechanism, process or procedure is Faith. What you posted is nothing but a perversion of what is written in the Bible stories, poor dogma from your cult at best. Now maybe you will try again to present model, method, mechanism, process and procedure.
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: I'm sure with time a truly scientific model could be made of that information. For now it really is a sufficient model for the realities of how life came to be and how it varies. As you say, someday a model might be presented by the new Creationists but we already have the model, method, mechanism, process and procedure that was created with the original creationists; it's called Evolution and change over time. For now though you have no model, method, mechanism, process or procedure; period!
|
|||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 425 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Problem is YOUR model is a total fantasy. Yes, we understand you wish that were true; however the current model is supported by evidence from many different techniques and lines of inquiry and has been confirmed by reality and actual observation for well over a century now. What is your model, method, mechanism, process or procedure Faith?
|
|
|
Do Nothing Button
Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved
Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024