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Author | Topic: Believe in UFOs? This editorial's for you! | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
jar Member (Idle past 160 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: The testimony of millions means nothing of course. It only means that millions of people claim to believe what they believe. It means nothing more.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1765 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
There are probably millions of people who believe you are a human being, but we know that means only that they believe what they believe, nothing more, and that they could be wrong and you're really a gerbil..
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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jar Member (Idle past 160 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Correct unless there is additional evidence to support their belief.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8711 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.0 |
The testimony of millions means nothing of course. Of course not. Popularity means nothing. The testimony of millions believe your version of a god is fake. Do you accept that? Then stop using popularity as an argument when you know it means nothing.
... people have seen something real that isn't explainable by anything normal or natural... You are saying that people have seen things that are inexplicable. You do know what inexplicable means, right? Unidentified means not known, it does not mean alien. Inexplicable means not known, it does not mean supernatural. Unidentified and inexplicable are not evidence of alien or supernatural no matter how many people may believe. They give no reason to believe one fantasy over another. Which means all such fantasies are equally invalid. Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1765 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Actually let's stick to those who claim to have experienced or witnessed such phenomena, how many I don't know but at least hundreds of thousands. That's not about popularity of an idea.
"Not explained by anything normal or natural" does not mean'inexplicable'" except in the most mundane sense. Hyro's video was very convincing that a number of men on a ship and in the air witnessed what were definitely real phenomena, as their instruments even said so, that acted like no physical object ever seen before, and it went on for some time. Many witnesses to a phenomenon not explainable by usual means but definitely real. They were told not to talk about it but later had permission to talk and considered it a huge relief that they could now testify to having seen something that was undoubtedly real that had no normal or natural explanation. They don't even claim to know what it was, just that it was real and didn't fit anything known. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1765 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Um, testimony that a god is a fake isn't testimony, it's blind bias. Testimony to its reality, on the other hand, is usually based on a variety of evidences, despite Phat/Thug's acceptance of the idea there is no evidence.
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jar Member (Idle past 160 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Faith writes: Testimony to its reality, on the other hand, is usually based on a variety of evidences, despite Phat/Thug's acceptance of the idea there is no evidence. Then bring the evidence and place it where it can be examined and tested.
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2497 Joined: |
quote: Scripture references, please. ("after the Fall")
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8711 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.0
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a number of men on a ship and in the air witnessed what were definitely real phenomena, as their instruments even said so, that acted like no physical object ever seen before, and it went on for some time. Many witnesses to a phenomenon not explainable by usual means but definitely real. No one is saying the experiences were not real. That is what the USAF was finally admitting. The occurrences were real. But no one knows what they were seeing. No one can say what the objects were. They do not know if they were seeing falling space junk, pareidolia or Ezekiel's wheel. Again, unidentified does not mean alien, and inexplicable does not mean supernatural, no matter how hard one wishes it were so.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8711 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.0 |
testimony that a god is a fake isn't testimony Testimony is no more than statement. You say your god is real. I say your god is fantasy. My testimony carries much more weight than yours because, like your friend Wrightstone above, you are a known proven nutjob with a history of religious nutjobbery while I am both brilliant and sane.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2497 Joined: |
Just days ago:
UFO investigations expert claims group could have physical evidence to make 'some sort of definitive conclusion' | Fox News Elizondo has been making a powerful case against dogma, in recent months. (older story, not the one from a few days ago)
quote: Carl Sagan said that in every age and culture, there are those who see beyond the prejudices of their day, and faithfully record the facts of an event. (It was in the context of Sagan covering a Middle Age written record of the moon turning color from a possible middle age impact, thanks to a monastic religious community of witnesses who might have been inclined to record fanciful details due to false notions of their day) Dogma is indeed getting in the way of proper analysis. (Faith says the sightings are from demons flying on brooms, and many others are saying everything can be fully explained by reflections of the clouds showing up on a person's reading glasses)
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LamarkNewAge Member Posts: 2497 Joined: |
The part about it not being "us":
quote: But headlines like these might give another impression:
quote: The "us" seems to be America's military pilots and their superiors.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1765 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No one is saying the experiences were not real. That is what the USAF was finally admitting. The occurrences were real. But no one knows what they were seeing. No one can say what the objects were. They do not know if they were seeing falling space junk, pareidolia or Ezekiel's wheel. They certainly do knjow that they were not any of those things. They were real objects, and their instruments registered their physical existence, but objects not behaving like anything they'd ever encountered before. They would recognize falling space junk, nobody ventured to give an opinioin what they were so they weren't paredolia, and Ezekiel's wheels were a vision. Whatever these were, they registered as physical objects, were witnessed by many, persisted over enough time to establish their reality, and behaved like no other known objects.
Again, unidentified does not mean alien, and inexplicable does not mean supernatural, no matter how hard one wishes it were so. Since nobody in this case has suggested any such thing your objection is just plain weird. Some kind of mental problem perhaps.
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Faith ![]() Suspended Member (Idle past 1765 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I say your testimony to a nongod is just a mental aberration of your own, whereas testimony to the existence of a god is based on various kinds of evidence.
AbE: Chris Pinto's film on the American Founders makes it clear that the "Reason" that replaced religion in the Enlightenment context was purely biased opinion. Reason told them virgins didn't get pregnant, that people don't rise from the dead etc. These normal cases are interpreted to be the only possibility, exceptions couldn't possibly occur, God is simply denied so miraculous powers are denied. Therefore it never happened. So much for Reason. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8711 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.0 |
They would recognize falling space junk, Would they? I agree that in most cases they should but can anyone say for certain it was not? No.
Since nobody in this case has suggested any such thing ... Lots of folks are interpreting these instances as ET. That's why there is such titillation in the UFO community. They see this announcement as the USAF admitting there are aliens. And you, yourself, said in a number of messages upstream here that they weren't aliens but were supernatural demons. That does not mean I do not have some weird mental problem but it certainly does mean that people are interpreting "unidentified" as "alien" and, you, specifically, interpreted "inexplicable" as "supernatural." So, again, no, unidentified does not mean alien no matter what the UFO weenies care to believe and inexplicable does not mean supernatural no matter what the devil is whispering in your left ear.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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