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Author | Topic: "Best" evidence for evolution. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Sarah Bellum Member (Idle past 617 days) Posts: 826 Joined: |
Actually, falsifiability is very important in science. Say you have an idea that birds descended from dinosaurs. That idea is falsifiable. A lack of intermediate fossils, or intermediate fossils between birds and something other than dinosaurs, would be evidence for the incorrectness of the idea. Finding intermediate fossils is evidence of the correctness of the idea.
Your claim that Pangaea split up very quickly should have something similar to make it falsifiable, but you don't say what we should look for. Instead, every piece of evidence that shows it to be incorrect, such as the extensive sediments on the floor of the Atlantic, varying from deep near the coasts to shallow near the middle where new land is being formed, you answer with another outlandish statement, something about sedimentation happening extraordinarily fast in earlier years. If you keep "multiplying entities unnecessarily" you are not working with falsifiable ideas.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I'm very aware of the principle of falsifiability, and very aware that you are wrong about the falsifiability of dinosaurs to birds etc. Although it's probably not completely impossible, science about the distant past is just not falsifiable.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17825 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: Really ? Bird-like footprints were discovered in Triassic strata. If remains of the creature that made them were discovered it could prove that birds were not descended from dinosaurs.
quote: Plenty of it is. If radiometric dates turned out to completely disagree with the relative dates from earlier geology, radiometric dating methods would have been falsified.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9504 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.7 |
Faith writes: I'm very aware of the principle of falsifiability, and very aware that you are wrong about the falsifiability of dinosaurs to birds etc. Although it's probably not completely impossible, science about the distant past is just not falsifiable. Oh come on Faith how many times over the 18 years you've been posting here have you been told that finding a rabbit fossil in the Cambrian would falsify the ToE? Several thousand I'd say. It's not just a catch phrase, it means that the fossil record is organised by time and finding organisms out of place in time would totally destroy the theory. For example, if your flood had actually happened fossils would be scattered through the geological record randomly with respect to their age but non-randomly with respect to their size and density. That would falsify the ToE and would have been immediately obvious to the creationist geologists 200 years ago.Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1426 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Tell me where I'm wrong.
All species today are descendants of the created kinds -- cats, dogs, bears, etc. etc. Evolution only occurs via loss of genetic material Ergo the original created kinds had all the genes of all their descendants before they were lost Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yes that's right but overall it's too easy to rationalize away anything that doesn't fit when it's in the past where it can be reinterpreted instead of definitively identified as false.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
...the original created kinds had all the genes of all their descendants before they were lost Yes. and if you wonder how that could be, it's that they had a lot more heterozygosity then than after much evolution. That's the conclusion I came to, anyway, after wondering about it a long time. The Mendel square for skin color considered possible for Adam and Eve is an expression of how all that variety could exist in one genome, and i'm sure that's greatly simplified. See Message 463 Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1426 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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So I was right in Message 175
Thanksby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1466 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I don't think you were right in that earlier post, it didn't make any sense to me at all and still doesn't. But the post I answered seemed to be clear enough.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Sarah Bellum Member (Idle past 617 days) Posts: 826 Joined: |
You state that it's not falsifiable. Why? I've given you examples.
For example, a claim that the top of a mountain was once much lower, on the bottom of the sea in fact, before plate tectonics pushed it up into the sky is falsifiable. Just look for fossils of sea creatures in the rock, for example.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8529 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 5.1 |
Ahh, but with a majik flud to wave around ...
I hope you have a strong sense of humor because the answer to this might make you cry.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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PaulK Member Posts: 17825 Joined: Member Rating: 2.2 |
quote: Only for people with ridiculously low standards. For example Message 682
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ringo Member (Idle past 433 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Sarah Bellum writes:
That's standard creationist argument:
You state that it's not falsifiable. Why? I've given you examples.Step 1. "I'm going to prove A."
It also works for conservative politics:
Step 2. Step 3. "I have just proved A." Step 1. "I'm going to build a wall." Step 2. Step 3. "Look at the wall I built." All that are in Hell, choose it. -- CS Lewis That's just egregiously stupid. -- ringo
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1426 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
I don't think you were right in that earlier post, it didn't make any sense to me at all and still doesn't. But the post I answered seemed to be clear enough. To me they say the same thing:
Message 175: As I recall, Faith believes that all current species have devolved from a universal donor species that carried copies of all the genomes of the species in their Kind (clade) ... through the loss of all the non-today species genomes. Message 185: All species today are descendants of the created kinds -- cats, dogs, bears, etc. etc. Evolution only occurs via loss of genetic material Ergo the original created kinds had all the genes of all their descendants before they were lost What do you see that is different? Curious.by our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1426 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
For example, a claim that the top of a mountain was once much lower, on the bottom of the sea in fact, before plate tectonics pushed it up into the sky is falsifiable. Just look for fossils of sea creatures in the rock, for example. See discussion on Trilobites, Mountains and Marine Deposits - Evidence of a flood? Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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