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Author | Topic: What Benefits Are Only Available Through God? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8564 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 4.7
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We have no evidence that they suffer for eternity. quote: The God I worship is not petty and vindicative...He has no need to enforce the rules He supposedly made...He is quite able to wipe them off the books. Yet she cannot provide anything less evil than a bloodthirsty evolution in a violent universe for her favorite monkey? Not much use as a god is she.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Yet she cannot provide anything less evil than a bloodthirsty evolution in a violent universe for her favorite monkey? Not much use as a god is she.
First of all, "She" owes you nothing. Not squat. While you may thus claim that "she' is of little use, you can, of course, claim that she is a figment of your imagination, to begin with, and thus have a handy copout. If you honestly conclude that there is no GOD, God, or god (jars favorite terminology) the fact remains that GOD may still exist and likely differs from anything that you, I, or Stan Lee can imagine. The Biblical authors seem to suggest that they have the Deity defined, but critics will argue that this idea is far from probable. You are of course free to believe as you like, but might I suggest that if you are wrong, you will be faced with the same idea that I am faced with(A God who exists and who is unlike anything that I ever would or could have imagined) at which point we both are basically at the Deities mercy. You may argue that such a scenario is extremely unlikely while I may argue that it is within a reasonable realm of probability and that I, in fact, will believe. The basic fact is that humanity has never actually traveled beyond this dust speck on which we live and have postulated the truths of a vast universe based only on our maths and our data. Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Phat writes: If you honestly conclude that there is no GOD, God, or god (jars favorite terminology) the fact remains that GOD may still exist and likely differs from anything that you, I, or Stan Lee can imagine. Again Phat, there is ample and irrefutable evidence that Gods and gods exist. They are ubiquitous and well documented. They are all also demonstrably ALL human creations. There is NO evidence that any GOD or GODs exist.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Welcome back!
Yes, I realize this. There is no way to prove that GOD exists. I am attempting to explain the construct to AZPaul3. Remember the construct that you taught me? How did you word it? Something along the lines of IF GOD exists, GOD exists regardless of anyones belief that GOD does not exist....Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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jar Member (Idle past 423 days) Posts: 34026 From: Texas!! Joined:
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You always seem to neglect the second part of the construct.
If GOD does not exist then GOD does not exist regardless of anyone's belief that GOD does exist. And the topic is also still "What Benefits Are Only Available Through God? " and the answer is still "There is no evidence of any benefits only available through God."
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
jar writes: The fact that there is no evidence does not negate the possibility. And the topic is also still "What Benefits Are Only Available Through God? " and the answer is still "There is no evidence of any benefits only available through God."Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Phat writes: The fact that there is no evidence does not negate the possibility. If no evidence has been found where evidence should be found, that generally rules out the hypothesis. Why do you think there is no evidence?Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
Worst copout ever. The leprechauns want you to have faith in them. Bigfoot wants you to have faith in him. Did it ever occur to you that there may be a reason that there is no evidence that God Himself allowed happening for precisely the reason of testing the human heart?Izquierdo.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
The evidence for eternal suffering comes from the same source as the evidence for Jesus. You're cherry-picking to patch together your made-up God. We have no evidence that they suffer for eternity.Izquierdo.
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AZPaul3 Member Posts: 8564 From: Phoenix Joined: Member Rating: 4.7 |
The fact that there is no evidence does not negate the possibility. By the same math using the same weights the same can be said of any human conjuring. Flying Spaghetti Monster, Invisible Pink Unicorn (MTABTOIHF)*, Great Green Arkleseizure, Aphrodite, Cthulhu. Since this universe doesn't seem to show these human conjectures as having any reality we can assign the same possibility and legitimacy to each. Vanishingly small so as to be non-existent. And with no discernible, demonstrable, effect or attributes from these entities on anything in our universe we can assign a utility of zero. They are worthless to us. "Possibility" only requires a wishful glance and means nothing. Evidence, even the lack thereof, requires fact and is everything. * May There Always Be Tasty Oats In Her Feedbag Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.Eschew obfuscation. Habituate elucidation.
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
And yet I was led to believe. It was not from cultural brainwashing, though that admittedly softened the beach. It was from God Himself. Granted I cannot prove this...
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
ringo writes: Ask the question of why it is important to me that you entertain the possibility? We can go down that rabbit trail if you want. You're cherry-picking to patch together your made-up God.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
ringo writes: And yet they don't. Why is God as I understand Him any different? The leprechauns want you to have faith in them. Bigfoot wants you to have faith in him.
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Phat Member Posts: 18348 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
Why do you think there is no evidence? What possible evidence could there be, apart from the believers themselves? Assuming that we have a spark in us that others lack. Of course, critics will label it as kool-aid.
If no evidence has been found where evidence should be found, that generally rules out the hypothesis. So tell me where evidence should be found. Edited by Thugpreacha, : No reason given.Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. ~RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." ~Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
Subjectivism may very well undermine Christianity.In the same way that "allowing people to choose what they want to be when they grow up" undermines communism.~Stile
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Tangle Member Posts: 9514 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 4.8 |
Phat writes: It was not from cultural brainwashing Of course it was, that's why you believe in Jesus not Mohamed. Nobody becomes a Christian unless they've heard of Christ. Why is that?Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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