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Author | Topic: Any practical use for Universal Common Ancestor? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
JonF Member (Idle past 418 days) Posts: 6174 Joined: |
Yeah, there is that. But the thread is still based on a viewpoint he's explicitly rejected.
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Theodoric Member Posts: 9489 From: Northwest, WI, USA Joined: Member Rating: 6.1 |
This thread should have been closed long ago, when it became obvious that he only started it to troll and spout religious inanities.
This thread is truly Bonfire of the Inanities. Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts "God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness. If your viewpoint has merits and facts to back it up why would you have to lie?
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1655 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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But that is not really what I'm saying. My point is that the genome can only make the creature it belongs to, so THEREFORE to get something entirely different which the ToE says is possible, at least over millions of years, the genome itself has to change and that is ... ... exactly what actually happens. The genome evolves as the species evolves, it is not fixed and immutable as you seem to think. It's that simple. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1655 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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1. Er, please be advised that one lucky find is hardly statistically significant. ... except that it confirms the prediction made by the Theory of Evolution.
2. Fossils indicate that some kind of "evolution" has occurred over billions of years, but fossils tell us ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about what caused that "evolution". ... except that each fossil currently valides the ToE when it fits into the temporal/spatial matrix and the explanation provided by the ToE for getting from one spcies to another via known mechanisms of evolution. Means, motive and opportunity:
3. Tikaalik and "evolution" can be explained by my "aliens did it" theory. Which is just another way of saying "god-did-it" while ignoring the weight of evidence that ccurrently onfirms that the ToE provides a complete explanation of the fossil record, including the constraints of the ToE. Neither aliens nor "progressive creation" provide as complete an explanation of all facets of the evidence. Curious that aliens and gods only created evidence that completely mimics what the process of evolution would produce and only what the ToE predicts would occur. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1655 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
Well we know he was an ape because we are too, but we also know that unlike, say, a chimp, he was also Homo. So he was human, though not of the same species as us. My guess is that his DNA is going to be pretty close but not exact. Because obviously if it was exact, he'd be H. sapiens, not H. habilis. We already know of differences between Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalis as currently sequenced. We also have some evidence of Denisovian DNA and some of the other Homo species. So we can compare the degree of differences with those of chimps and see what the evidence shows. IIRC this was done a year ago or two ago. The result I remember was that a triangle representing the degrees of differences was formed with the three sides being:
Where (1) showed lesser degree of differences than either (2) or (3) and that (2) and (3) were approximately of equal degree. This fits with ToE nested hierarchy predictions. Perhaps someone can dig up the old posts on this (Moose?) We can then introduce real numbers into this discussion with Faith and see how far she can take it. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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RAZD Member (Idle past 1655 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined:
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Dredge writes: Tanypteryx writes: An ad hominem attack is not science. Well, I already know that you believe a lot of bullshit Well, you have not presented any science, so I was just describing what you have presented so far. Telling the truth is not an ad hominem ... just a statement of fact. Enjoyby our ability to understand Rebel☮American☆Zen☯Deist ... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ... to share. Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)
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Taq Member Posts: 10296 Joined: Member Rating: 7.1
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Dredge writes:
That's one possible explanation . but one that can't be tested and confirmed.
It can be confirmed by both the pattern of physical differences and similarities and the same for genetic differences and similarities. We find a correlation between the nested hierarchies in both sets of data which confirms the mechanisms of vertical inheritance and random mutations.
All things considered the evidence can be best explained by genetic engineering performed by aliens. Why would aliens produce a nested hierarchy? You need to explain this.
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vimesey Member (Idle past 323 days) Posts: 1398 From: Birmingham, England Joined:
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Why would aliens produce a nested hierarchy? It was Slartibartfast pissing around after he got bored with fjords ;-)Could there be any greater conceit, than for someone to believe that the universe has to be simple enough for them to be able to understand it ?
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edge Member (Idle past 1956 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined:
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Oh, I don't know about that. I'm enjoying this thread. This kid's hilarious.
Yes, the entertainment factor should not be minimized. But we should understand that we are being trolled. No need for umbrage.
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Dredge Member Posts: 2855 From: Australia Joined: |
Stile writes:
Try again . you conveniently ignored that part of my question that says "antibiotic resistance". Explain why it's necessary to accept that all life on earth shares a common ancestor in order to understand antibiotic resistance.
I thought you were asking about UCA in applied biology?What part of applied biology involves evolving blind fish? So - of course I won't answer this question, this question has nothing to do with what we're talking about (UCA and applied biology.) Unless you're about to share the blind-fish-creation studies in applied biology? Therefore - according to me, any YECs (or any non-YECs, even) developing medicine without the idea of UCA behind them - wouldn't be any good at it - they would be known for being "useless" in developing drugs and vaccines.
It's easy to make a stupid, baseless claim; it's not so easy to back it up with a sane explanation or evidence . but have a go.
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Dredge Member Posts: 2855 From: Australia Joined: |
edge writes:
I don't recall saying that "Ediacaran-type of fauna could not be precursors to the Cambrian ones." However, I do recall saying there is no evidence of evolutionary links between Ediacaran life-forms and the animals that appear in the Cambrian. And an explanation of why the Edicaran-type of fauna could not be precursors to the Cambrian ones. Edited by Dredge, : No reason given.
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Dredge Member Posts: 2855 From: Australia Joined: |
Tanypteryx writes:
No, that's incorrect. I said nothing about believing in aliens - in fact, I definitely don't believe in aliens. I said aliens performing genetic engineering is the best scientific explanation for the fossil record. I also said that science can't explain the fossil record. Right, says a guy who believes aliens in a fictional book called the bible put people on the Earth 6000 years ago. Edited by Dredge, : No reason given.
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edge Member (Idle past 1956 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined: |
I don't recall saying that "Ediacaran-type of fauna could not be precursors to the Cambrian ones." However, I do recall saying there is no evidence of evolutionary links between Ediacaran life-forms and the animals that appear in the Cambrian.
Well, to most scientists in the field, the pattern in which the Ediacaran fauna fall is a line of evidence for them being precursors to the Cambrian fauna. The geochemical changes also support the transition from soft-bodies to more durable carbonate skeletons at the same time. This may not be good enough for you, but until there is evidence for something better, that's what I'm going with. Your opinion is noted, but somehow, I don't think it is sincere and you certainly haven't come up with even the remotest evidence for alien genetic engineers.
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Dredge Member Posts: 2855 From: Australia Joined: |
Tanypteryx writes:
Very funny.
Why do you think there should be links between sponges, worms, jelly-fish and fish?
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edge Member (Idle past 1956 days) Posts: 4696 From: Colorado, USA Joined: |
...I definitely don't believe in aliens. ... I said aliens ... is the best scientific explanation
In some remote corner of an intellectually benighted galaxy, this makes sense.
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