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Author | Topic: Violence in the Bible and the Quran | |||||||||||||||||||||||
Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Sorry I meant economic necessity in the sense of having to become a slave to pay off a debt. That was the common reason in ancient Israel and it is not at all the same kind of "economic necessity" you are talking about. There was no violence involved in becoming a slave to pay off a debt they had no other way to pay, and Mosaic Law put term limits to their servitude. Not really comparable to the slavery in the American South. You may be right that they justified it on the basis of the Bible but there is really little actual comparison between the situations.
Slavery caused by military conquest could be called violent, but then the whole thing involving military conquest is violent. And again this is really a different subject. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Yes, apparently there was a lot of such misuse of the Bible to justify slavery in the South. But it WAS a misuse. For one thing in the South it wasn't just slavery it was racism which had no part in the circumstances in ancient Israel. For another difference, people were stolen to be slaves in the South, often sold into slavery by their own people, and for yet another the Mosaic Law required the release of the slave after a given period of time.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Your "facts" are not facts.
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Stile Member Posts: 4295 From: Ontario, Canada Joined: |
Faith writes: Your "facts" are not facts. I do not understand how this statement makes any sense. Are you talking about these facts:
Because you've been instrumental in showing how each one is specifically a true fact. Again, the words you string together simply do not correspond to the objective reality around you. Please try again.
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ooh-child Member (Idle past 373 days) Posts: 242 Joined: |
And again this is really a different subject. Why? Check the title of this thread. Slavery as described biblically certainly reads as violent in many cases. And Southerners used these passages to justify their cruelty.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
Slavery is not the subject but if you insist on it: just as with the actual violence we are discussing, the historical biblical context does not give justification for it now, and Paul's recommendation to a Christian slave owner to release his Christian slave sets this new tone, which was the basis for Christian abolition of slavery in our time.
However, Muslims continue enslaving people to this day, although I have no idea if there is justification in their "holy" books as there is for murdering Jews and Christians and polytheists. And any other "infidel" who rejects Allah. Perhaps they don't need to bother with such niceties as a command from Allah to make slaves of people. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
You are SO confused, Or willfully obtuse. Your "facts" are not facts.
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Stile Member Posts: 4295 From: Ontario, Canada Joined: |
Faith writes: You are SO confused, Or willfully obtuse. Your "facts" are not facts. Can you explain why or how? Every time you say something doesn't exist or is wrong, I show you that the actual event does exist, or is right. It seems all you have is empty words.And I have is the ability to show parts of reality that prove these "facts" to be entirely factual. I don't understand how any reasonable person could possibly interpret them in any other way.But, please, expand your response and describe just how it is you interpret facts as "not facts."
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I explained it all at least three times. If that isn't enough for you that's your fault. It's quite clear. Your "facts" are not facts.
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ooh-child Member (Idle past 373 days) Posts: 242 Joined: |
So, in your eyes, slavery isn't actually violent. Good to know. I guess when Jesus talked about beating disobedient slaves that wasn't violent?
Luke 12:47 That servant who knows his master's will but does not get ready or follow his instructions will be beaten with many blows.
And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
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ringo Member (Idle past 441 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
To release his Christian slaves? Why wouldn't the Golden Rule apply to all slaves? ... Paul's recommendation to a Christian slave owner to release his Christian slave sets this new tone....And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Coragyps Member (Idle past 764 days) Posts: 5553 From: Snyder, Texas, USA Joined: |
As per the examples in Mosaic laws that gave completely different rules for Hebrew vs. Gentile slaves. Captives were permanent slaves, as I recall it.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
There was one slave involved, who was a Christian and with Paul at the time. Paul wrote to his owner, also a Christian whom he knew, to suggest that he set him free. It's there to be a model for whomever. They had both become Christians and Paul was a Christian leader.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I think the slave and his owner may both have been Greek, but I'd have to check. Slavery existed universally in those days.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1474 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
You'd rather he shot him?
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