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Author | Topic: Gun Control III | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3971 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 7.1
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Percy posted a new message - "Supreme Court Wrong on Second Amendment" at the "Police Shootings" topic. I think that better belongs in this topic. Quoting it all:
Percy writes: In 2008 the Supreme Court disconnected the right to bear arms from service in a militia, ruling that there was a right to own guns for any lawful purpose. One of the arguments for the majority, written by Antonin Scalia, related to the phrase bear arms:
quote: But Scalia was wrong, as explained in detail in Antonin Scalia was wrong about the meaning of ‘bear arms’. In new databases for the period, such uses of the term "are not just rare they’re almost nonexistent." There were, of course, other arguments in the ruling, but the definition of bear arms seems fundamental. If Scalia were correct that it was used primarily outside a military context, then his reasoning to separate "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State" from "the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" would make sense. But he had his facts backwards and so his argument does not hold water. The term bear arms was used in military contexts in the 18th century, and the right of the people described in the Second Amendment was specific to militias. Since government militias are non-existent today, there can be no constitutional right of the people to keep and bear arms. --Percy We've also very recently had another Texas school located mass shooting. Not me, but perhaps someone else might want to post something here on that. Moose
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
I wouldn't go that far. If the father has contravened the law - they would likely look the other way in most cases if it was known the son was leaving the State. Given what the son did, however, the people who operate the law may decide that they won't look the other way. "The people who operate the law" are subject to oversight. I will never say that there cannot be a prosecution, and I certainly cannot say that no jury would convict. But any conviction that resulted would be on very flimsy grounds. In my opinion, such a conviction would be against the weight of the law. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith No it is based on math I studied in sixth grade, just plain old addition, substraction and multiplication. -- ICANT
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
I wouldn't go that far. If the father has contravened the law - they would likely look the other way in most cases if it was known the son was leaving the State. Given what the son did, however, the people who operate the law may decide that they won't look the other way. "The people who operate the law" are subject to oversight. I will never say that there cannot be a prosecution, and I certainly cannot say that no jury would convict. But any conviction that holds Dad responsible for the murders that resulted would be on very flimsy grounds. In my opinion, such a conviction would be against the weight of the law. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith No it is based on math I studied in sixth grade, just plain old addition, substraction and multiplication. -- ICANT
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Percy Member Posts: 22947 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
Thanks - I realized later I posted to the wrong thread.
--Percy
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Minnemooseus Member Posts: 3971 From: Duluth, Minnesota, U.S. (West end of Lake Superior) Joined: Member Rating: 7.1 |
10 People Killed In Santa Fe High School Shooting Near Houston : The Two-Way : NPR
quote: Something to get it in the record here. I think a big part of the problem is trickle down stupidity in the Trump era. Moose
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Modulous Member (Idle past 239 days) Posts: 7801 From: Manchester, UK Joined: |
But any conviction that holds Dad responsible for the murders that resulted would be on very flimsy grounds. In my opinion, such a conviction would be against the weight of the law. Agreed. But I'm talking about holding him responsible for breaking the laws surrounding prohibited firearm distribution - which if true, would be fair game and be on pretty solid grounds. Appeals processes through the courts are an uphill battle even when a person has a great case - the alternative would be in the form of a governor's pardon. Rauner doesn't have a reputation that would suggest success can be relied on there.
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Percy Member Posts: 22947 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
ABC news today reports Toddler, 2, dies of self-inflicted gunshot with parents not home:
quote: This tragic event again raises the question that if firearms in the home should be kept in one lockbox and ammunition in another, of what possible use is a firearm for defense? It also reminds us that guns do far more harm than good, primarily to those who favor them most. --Percy
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Capt Stormfield Member Posts: 429 From: Vancouver Island Joined:
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It also reminds us that guns do far more harm than good... Percy, Percy, Percy, you still don't understand. The problem is that there aren't enough guns. If the toddler's left hand had had a gun, he would have been able shoot his right hand before it killed him. This really isn't all that complicated...
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NoNukes Inactive Member
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f the toddler's left hand had had a gun, he would have been able shoot his right hand before it killed him. This is just silly. What was needed was a good toddler with a gun. Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, the wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me, I lift my lamp beside the golden door! We got a thousand points of light for the homeless man. We've got a kinder, gentler, machine gun hand. Neil Young, Rockin' in the Free World. Worrying about the "browning of America" is not racism. -- Faith I hate you all, you hate me -- Faith No it is based on math I studied in sixth grade, just plain old addition, substraction and multiplication. -- ICANT
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Capt Stormfield Member Posts: 429 From: Vancouver Island Joined:
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I stand on the clear exhortation of Matthew 5:29* - "If thy right hand draw down on thee, shoot it off."
*(Revised Fly-Over Version)
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Percy Member Posts: 22947 From: New Hampshire Joined: Member Rating: 6.9 |
Today's news reports from Utah: Stray Bullet Kills Teen. Zackary Kempke was riding in the back seat of his family's car when he was struck in the head and killed instantly by a bullet fired by another family engaged in target shooting from several hundred feet away. No charges have been filed at this time.
This reminds me of an incident from maybe 15 years ago where a hunter fired at a deer and missed, striking and killing a housewife hanging wash out on the line. No charges were filed. Guns are too dangerous to be in the hands of the general public. Those who do own guns should only be permitted to fire them at approved, regulated and inspected firing ranges. Hunting ground borders should never be within shooting distance of a non-hunting related structure/house/business, or hiking/biking/snowmobile trails, etc. --Percy
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ringo Member (Idle past 666 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Percy writes:
Reminds me of a newspaper article some years back: A school in Los Angeles, I think, was considering building a wall around its playground to keep stray bullets out. Just goes to show there's a solution to every problem. This reminds me of an incident from maybe 15 years ago where a hunter fired at a deer and missed, striking and killing a housewife hanging wash out on the line.And our geese will blot out the sun.
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Tangle Member Posts: 9580 From: UK Joined: Member Rating: 6.6
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Walls can sort out pretty much any problem. Just ask a Berliner.
Je suis Charlie. Je suis Ahmed. Je suis Juif. Je suis Parisien. I am Mancunian. I am Brum. I am London.I am Finland. Soy Barcelona "Life, don't talk to me about life" - Marvin the Paranoid Android "Science adjusts it's views based on what's observed.Faith is the denial of observation so that Belief can be preserved." - Tim Minchin, in his beat poem, Storm.
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jar Member (Idle past 93 days) Posts: 34140 From: Texas!! Joined: |
Today I'll be openly carrying an FEG PJK-9 which is a clone of the Browning High Power and made in Hungary. IIRC I bought this in the mid 1980s. It will have a 10 round magazine plus one round in the chamber and carried "Cocked & Locked". I will also have two 13 round magazines for it.
My backup handgun will be a Smith & Wesson Double Action model 4 that was likely made in 1903. It's a 5 round top break revolver with an auto eject feature. I'll have two speed loaders for it with an additional 5 rounds each.
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Phat Member Posts: 18649 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 4.3 |
So you carry two handguns fully loaded? What do you expect to encounter?
Chance as a real force is a myth. It has no basis in reality and no place in scientific inquiry. For science and philosophy to continue to advance in knowledge, chance must be demythologized once and for all. —RC Sproul "A lie can travel half way around the world while the truth is putting on its shoes." —Mark Twain " ~"If that's not sufficient for you go soak your head."~Faith You can "get answers" by watching the ducks. That doesn't mean the answers are coming from them.~Ringo
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