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Author | Topic: Faith vs Science | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
And science is not. It's collective.
Faith is often personal.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
It would be better if the word "evidence" was not used at all in such matters. Since even Bible believers can't agree on what it says, it is far from "evident."
Granted I believe that the Bible itself is evidence in regards to matters of belief and personal philosophy.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Existence is a poor form of evidence. Fingerprints exist but they're not very useful as evidence unless you can figure out what they mean - e.g. that George was at the crime scene. If you can't agree on what the words mean, they're not very useful support.
The words themselves are evident though. They are evidently there.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
So, for the umpteenth time, why is it that so many people claim to be "transformed" but only others who claim to be transformed can see the transformation?
If you believe in your heart that Jesus was raised from the Dead and confess it with your mouth you will be saved. Its just that simple. As for any critics, I have seen people transformed by simply doing just that.| My evidence is based on the transformation in others which I saw.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
I'm saying it doesn't happen. ...the fact is that if someone-anyone-is transformed than everyone can see the change and the difference---not just Christians. It's the same as Christians claiming that the good works come automatically when you're "saved". They don't. More often than not, the only transformation is a lot of new excuses for not doing the works. We need to transform ourselves, not rely on some alien entity to do it for us.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
So why are a bunch of Bronze Age sheep herders more brilliant?
Science is NOT the origen, nor is Stephen Hawking anywhere near brilliant enough to come up with a hypothesis that explains origin.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
They imagined God and had faith in their imaginations.
The Goat Herders were not so vain as to rely on their own imagination nor intelligence. By Faith they knew God.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
That's only your vain imagination.
Quite simply I am attempting to show that when men imagined something, it was usually their own vain imagination. There were times, however, where their imagination was of God...chiefly because it was His creative Spirit...His imagination rather than the limited vain imagination of fallible humans.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
Vain hope in vain imagination.
You may be right. I hope not, however.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
Believers are passionate about their sourceS, plural. There's the Bible, the Qur'an, the Vedas, etc. How do you compare one source with another if you throw science out the window?
Believers are passionate about their source....
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Davidjay writes:
So how do you test creationism?
True faith and true science is when you try and test out theories and find out if they work.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
That doesn't answer the question. How do you compare one source with another if you throw science out the window?
Because "science" is not the only way that we make choices.Not everything in life is evident.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Davidjay writes:
Yes. Answer the question: HOW do you test creationism? Must I rewrite everything for you. List the experiments done and the results.
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Davidjay writes:
Then answer my question: How do you test creationism? List the experiments done and the results.
I like to answer questions rather than duck and hode from them like evolutionists do
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ringo Member (Idle past 438 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Faith writes:
Fiction is not evidence. Nobody is calling James Bond a liar. He's a fictional character making fictional statements, like Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, etc.
You have to call all the witnesses liars to reject the evidence given.
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