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Author Topic:   The TRVE history of the Flood...
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 196 of 1352 (805415)
04-18-2017 12:28 PM
Reply to: Message 193 by Dr Adequate
04-18-2017 12:22 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Ah yes I do remember that you pointed out that some did think all the strata were caused by the Flood. Sorry. I keep remembering the ideas about one layer or another being the evidence, which I thought was generally accepted. Some DID and still do hold this false idea, however.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 193 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 12:22 PM Dr Adequate has not replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 197 of 1352 (805416)
04-18-2017 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Faith
04-18-2017 12:25 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Faith writes:
Of course the river is a clue. It's what's left of the huge deluge....
Rivers are the result of lots of little deluges and occasionally slightly bigger ones. We have rivers and we have deluges, so we know how these things work. What we do NOT have is any justification for extrapolating to one really really big deluge.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:25 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 199 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:41 PM ringo has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 198 of 1352 (805417)
04-18-2017 12:29 PM
Reply to: Message 195 by Dr Adequate
04-18-2017 12:25 PM


Re: On "opinions"
And now let us turn to your opinion that there were once living dinosaurs. How did you verify that, remind me?
Bones, dear, bones.
I think most of astronomy has been verified by space travel if nothing else. When there's a time machine that can travel to the past THEN we can talk verified -- or disproved -- dating methods.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 195 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 12:25 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 205 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 1:19 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 199 of 1352 (805418)
04-18-2017 12:41 PM
Reply to: Message 197 by ringo
04-18-2017 12:29 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
What we do NOT have is any justification for extrapolating to one really really big deluge.
Sure you do, tons of it. All those strata piled miles deep for starters, most of them so neatly distinguished from one another by straight flat contacts. And the amazing size of the Grand Canyon for another.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 197 by ringo, posted 04-18-2017 12:29 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 200 by ringo, posted 04-18-2017 12:47 PM Faith has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 200 of 1352 (805420)
04-18-2017 12:47 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by Faith
04-18-2017 12:41 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Faith writes:
All those strata piled miles deep for starters, most of them so neatly distinguished from one another by straight flat contacts.
Those straight flat contacts indicate that they were NOT deposited by a violent cataclysm. Violence would mix the layers.
The layers can be explained by the normal events that we see happening every day.
Faith writes:
And the amazing size of the Grand Canyon for another.
The amazing size of a tree suggests that it took a long time to get that big.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:41 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:10 PM ringo has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 201 of 1352 (805421)
04-18-2017 12:50 PM
Reply to: Message 187 by Faith
04-18-2017 11:59 AM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Those early geologists were far more honest and actually looked at the evidence as opposed to the dishonesty and willful ignorance found in Young Earth supporters and Creationists.
But the Bible itself refutes any nonsense that there actually was a Biblical Flood since it includes two different flood myths.
Faith writes:
And I'm getting AWFULLY tired of being called a liar based only on your different opinion of these things.
If it was simply a matter of opinion you might even be justified; but of course it is not. It is an issue of reality versus the myths found in the Bible.
Edited by jar, : fix floating quote box.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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 Message 187 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 11:59 AM Faith has not replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 202 of 1352 (805422)
04-18-2017 12:56 PM
Reply to: Message 191 by Faith
04-18-2017 12:07 PM


Re: On "opinions"
Faith writes:
Two biblical floods for instance is ...stupid...opinion.
There you go misrepresenting what has been said and supported by facts Faith. No one said there were two Biblical Floods (since there was not even one in reality) but rather that the Bible has two different flood myths. That is simply a fact as you have been shown.

My Sister's Website: Rose Hill Studios My Website: My Website

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 Message 191 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 203 of 1352 (805426)
04-18-2017 1:10 PM
Reply to: Message 200 by ringo
04-18-2017 12:47 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
I didn't say anything about violence. The strata have all the earmarks of following Walther's Law, the layering of different sediments by the rising of the oceans, which of course would describe the first phase of the Flood. Later when the Flood was at its height a different kind of deposition, precipitation out of standing water, would have taken over. There would have been some violence in the earliest phase no doubt, because of the forty days and nights of heavy rain and the consequent saturation of the land, but the layering would have occurred after that.
Walther's Law also describes SIMULTANEOUS layering, so that the idea that one layer succeeded another is false, except for the phase where precipitation was the cause of deposition. This has interesting implications for the idea that the layers represent successive Time Periods.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

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 Message 200 by ringo, posted 04-18-2017 12:47 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 207 by ringo, posted 04-18-2017 1:21 PM Faith has replied
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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


(1)
Message 204 of 1352 (805427)
04-18-2017 1:14 PM
Reply to: Message 194 by Faith
04-18-2017 12:25 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Of course the river is a clue. It's what's left of the huge deluge ...
Faith. Do you know what a river is? Seriously, do you even know what a river is?
But the idea that that little river itself could have done that is so absurd that you really ought to laugh at yourself for the thought.
And yet people who unlike you have studied erosion think that this "little" river could easily have cut the canyon, and laugh at the thought of your magic flood.
Let's think about how "little" this river is, shall we? According to figures from the USGS, over the last century or so the flow through the Grand Canyon has averaged about 15000 cubic feet per second, let's convert that to 140 cubic meters per second, so 4.4 billion cubic meters per year. It may have fluctuated a bit over longer periods of time, but let's use that as our ballpark figure. Now the minimum age given by geologists for the Grand Canyon is about 6 million years, so in that time that would be 26 quadrillion cubic meters of water, or, to put it another way, seven times the volume of the Mediterranean Sea.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 194 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:25 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 206 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:20 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 205 of 1352 (805428)
04-18-2017 1:19 PM
Reply to: Message 198 by Faith
04-18-2017 12:29 PM


Re: On "opinions"
Bones, dear, bones.
So not by getting in your time machine and seeing any living dinosaurs?
Fine. And how do we verify the ages of the rocks? Isotopes, dear, isotopes.
I think most of astronomy has been verified by space travel if nothing else.
I specified stars. We haven't visited a single star.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 198 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 12:29 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 208 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:22 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 206 of 1352 (805430)
04-18-2017 1:20 PM
Reply to: Message 204 by Dr Adequate
04-18-2017 1:14 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
All funneled through the canyon at the current size of the river?
What about the enormous width of the canyon?
But none of this is relevant since the canyon was cut all at once at the end of the Flood about 4200 years ago, by probably half the amount of the Mediterranean Sea rushing into cracks, carrying broken up strata with it. Over the sides, too.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 204 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 1:14 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 210 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 1:27 PM Faith has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 412 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 207 of 1352 (805431)
04-18-2017 1:21 PM
Reply to: Message 203 by Faith
04-18-2017 1:10 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
Faith writes:
The strata have all the earmarks of following Walther's Law....
Does that include layers that are not sedimentary?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 203 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:10 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 209 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:23 PM ringo has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 208 of 1352 (805432)
04-18-2017 1:22 PM
Reply to: Message 205 by Dr Adequate
04-18-2017 1:19 PM


Re: On "opinions"
True, and maybe we'll find out all that is an illusion?
I don't claim I have to see living dinosaurs, the bones are good enough evidence for their existence in the past.
But there is nothing IN the past to verify your theory of the isotopes.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 205 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 1:19 PM Dr Adequate has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 214 by Dr Adequate, posted 04-18-2017 1:36 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 217 by NoNukes, posted 04-18-2017 2:40 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 209 of 1352 (805433)
04-18-2017 1:23 PM
Reply to: Message 207 by ringo
04-18-2017 1:21 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
No.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 207 by ringo, posted 04-18-2017 1:21 PM ringo has replied

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Dr Adequate
Member (Idle past 284 days)
Posts: 16113
Joined: 07-20-2006


Message 210 of 1352 (805434)
04-18-2017 1:27 PM
Reply to: Message 206 by Faith
04-18-2017 1:20 PM


Re: the idea of more than one biblical flood is what's silly, AND the date of course
All funneled through the canyon at the current size of the river?
As I say, it may have increased or decreased its rate of flow over time, but yeah, more or less.
What about the enormous width of the canyon?
What about it?
But none of this is relevant since the canyon was cut all at once at the end of the Flood about 4200 years ago, by probably half the amount of the Mediterranean Sea rushing into cracks, carrying broken up strata with it. Over the sides, too.
Rushing water wouldn't have caused meanders: these are only caused by leisurely water.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 206 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:20 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 213 by Faith, posted 04-18-2017 1:31 PM Dr Adequate has replied

  
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