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Author Topic:   Creation
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 151 of 1482 (783096)
05-03-2016 12:17 PM
Reply to: Message 150 by NoNukes
05-03-2016 11:58 AM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
The biggest implication of practices like Gap theory for me is that it makes the authors look really silly and the ultimate inspiration for the stories look really stupid.
When you have to take pieces parts of stories out of context to support your position it makes little sense. If the Bible was inspired by God was God incapable of inspiring writing that does not require a patchwork quilt of pieces parts to support what the God wanted communicated?

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by NoNukes, posted 05-03-2016 11:58 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 163 by Faith, posted 05-05-2016 8:09 PM jar has replied

  
kbertsche
Member (Idle past 2131 days)
Posts: 1427
From: San Jose, CA, USA
Joined: 05-10-2007


(1)
Message 152 of 1482 (783100)
05-03-2016 12:34 PM
Reply to: Message 146 by NoNukes
05-03-2016 10:48 AM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
My first recommendation would be to find a good library where you can read Word Biblical Commentary or get it through interlibrary loan.
My second recommendation would be a series of lectures that Bruce Waltke gave at Western Seminary back in the 1970's. This was published both as a book, "Creation and Chaos", and as a series of five articles in Bibliotheca Sacra. Waltke disagrees with ICANT and me on verse 1; he takes verse 1 as a heading for the whole account, rather than as the first event in a series. But he does a good job of explaining the grammatical issues nonetheless.
I found three of Waltke's five articles on Professor Ted Hildebrandt's page at Gordon Conwell: https://faculty.gordon.edu/...A_GenesisGordonArticlesBib.htm. Unfortunately, parts 2 and 3 of the series are missing (maybe you can find them somewhere else with a web search). Note that though Waltke was strongly anti-evolution when he wrote these articles, he is now open to the idea of theistic evolution.
Hildebrandt has a number of other good articles on this page. I highly recommend Hummel and Hyers for the literary structure of the Creation account, Munday and Phillips for death of animals before the Fall, and Seely on the firmament. Faith might also be interested in E.J. Young's articles about the Days.
ABE: Waltke's Part 2 is available here: Welcome michaelsheiser.com - BlueHost.com
(I'm still looking for part 3).
Edited by kbertsche, : No reason given.
Edited by kbertsche, : No reason given.

"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." — Albert Einstein
I am very astonished that the scientific picture of the real world around me is very deficient. It gives us a lot of factual information, puts all of our experience in a magnificently consistent order, but it is ghastly silent about all and sundry that is really near to our heart, that really matters to us. It cannot tell us a word about red and blue, bitter and sweet, physical pain and physical delight; it knows nothing of beautiful and ugly, good or bad, God and eternity. Science sometimes pretends to answer questions in these domains, but the answers are very often so silly that we are not inclined to take them seriously. — Erwin Schroedinger

This message is a reply to:
 Message 146 by NoNukes, posted 05-03-2016 10:48 AM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 153 of 1482 (783107)
05-03-2016 3:23 PM
Reply to: Message 136 by ICANT
05-02-2016 10:49 PM


Re: Chronology?
Point out in the message where I said the Seth of Genesis 4:26 would have to die before the heavens and the earth were created.
Below is exactly what you said in the message I responded to. As best as I can tell, it claims that it makes no difference regarding a Seth as described in 4:26 because such a person would have died during the creation of the heavens and earth in 1:1 if 4:26 was as it appears to me. We can quibble about whether that means Seth died during or prior to the resulting void and empty earth described in Genesis 1:2 But in either event the alleged scenario does not seem to leave a way for Seth or Enos to have any descendants who became the ancestors of Isaac or Jacob and even forward from that point.
If you have a point, I'd appreciate if you get to it. Your quibbling about words and phrasing that do not resolve the issue would be fine if they were accompanied by an addressing of the issues. But that never seems to happen. I strongly suspect I would be better of reading other explanations that waiting for you to respond. If your view differs significantly from Gap theory, I suspect I will never understand it because getting you to answer questions is too painful and you appear to be the only source for whatever it is you believe.
ICANT writes:
I plainly stated that it did not make any difference whether they were inserts or not that if the man formed from the dust of the ground had a son named Seth he would have died in the day the heavens and the earth was created.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 136 by ICANT, posted 05-02-2016 10:49 PM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 154 of 1482 (783179)
05-04-2016 12:51 AM
Reply to: Message 150 by NoNukes
05-03-2016 11:58 AM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Hi NONukes
NoNukes writes:
I will continue to look because I want to understand Gap theology. But so far it appears that simply having an open mind does not yield acceptance of your position. Got anything else?
You are missing a big point and that is that I do not believe in a gap between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2.
Since God is eternal I believe there was an eternal day (light period). This eternal light period was interrupted by the darkness at Genesis 1:2 when God created darkness. At the close of the era of mankind that eternal light period will resume.
quote:
Revelation 22:5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.
Somewhere in that eternal light period defined "In the beginning"
God created the universe and the earth. There was duration during that eternal light period just no way to measure it.
quote:
Revelation 22:5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.
God provides the light in the eternal light period, not the sun or any other method.
1. God created the heavens and the earth in an eternal light period.
2. God gave the history of the light period He created the heavens and the earth in. Beginning at Genesis 2:4.
3. God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed the breath of life into that form and he became a living being. Genesis 2:7.
4. God planted a garden eastward in Eden. Genesis 2:8
5. God made trees to grow. Genesis 2:9
6. God had a river come out of Eden and divide into four rivers to water the land. Genesis 2:10
7. God took the man and placed the man in the garden to dress it. Genesis 2:15
8. God gave the man a command that he could eat from all the trees except the one in the midst of the garden. Genesis 2:16, 17.
9. God gave the consequences of death the day he ate of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Genesis 2:17
10. God formed the beasts and fowl out of the ground. Genesis 2:19
11. God cloned a woman from a bone from the man. Genesis 2:22
12. The woman was deceived and ate of the forbidden fruit. She gave to her husband and he ate also.
13. God kicked the man out of the garden. Genesis 3:23
14. The man and woman had two sons. Genesis 4:1, 2
15. The boys grew and when they came to worship God Abel apparently did what God had instructed them to do, but Cain did it his way which God did not accept. Genesis 4:3-5
16. Cain killed Abel the first recorded death on planet earth. Genesis 4:8
17. Cain had a son who he named Enoch and build a city and named it after his son. Genesis 4:17
18. In Genesis 4:18 there are 5 generations mentioned.
19. In Genesis 4:20 we have an 8th generation mention when you add the first man and Cain.
20. In Genesis 4:23 Lamech tells his wives he had killed a young man, the second recorded death on planet earth.
21. Then we have Genesis 4:25, 26 after 8 generations pop on the scene totally out of place in the story.
All these things took place in the eternal light period that had not ended at this point in duration.
If you notice there was only 2 deaths recorded.
There is no age given for anyone in these verses.
All these people perished in whatever happened that caused the condition found in Genesis 1:2.
NoNukes writes:
I have also attempted to discuss interpretations of Jeremiah 4:23-26 with you,
quote:
Jeremiah 4:23 I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.
4:24 I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly.
4:25 I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled.
4:26 I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the LORD, and by his fierce anger.
4:27 For thus hath the LORD said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end.
4:28 For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black; because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it.
Jeremiah saw the earth without form and void, there was no birds, no man, and the heavens were black. The only time that condition has ever existed was in Genesis 1:2
When you apply occams razor it would be reasonable to attribute what Jeremiah
saw to be what had existed already especially since he spoke in the past.
You on the other hand mentioned you thought this was future.
The next time God pours out His wrath on earth it will melt with fervent heat. 2 Peter 3:10-12.
NoNukes writes:
Beyond that, is it not true that Gap theorist rely on Hebrew and not English with some of those verses you cited? For example, "God created the earth not in vain"
Words do not change their meaning because a translator chooses to use a different word to represent a specific word.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 150 by NoNukes, posted 05-03-2016 11:58 AM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 155 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 3:32 PM ICANT has replied
 Message 173 by herebedragons, posted 05-06-2016 8:55 AM ICANT has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 155 of 1482 (783249)
05-04-2016 3:32 PM
Reply to: Message 154 by ICANT
05-04-2016 12:51 AM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Jeremiah saw the earth without form and void, there was no birds, no man, and the heavens were black. The only time that condition has ever existed was in Genesis 1:2
But given that Jeremiah was providing a warning about the future, the fact such condition did not currently exist would not be that surprising, would it? I note that my complaint about not looking at the verses surrounding 4:23-4:26 resulted in you printing a couple more verses, but then not taking into account their content.
Why do I need to ask the same questions and then complain about the same lack of response over and over? Why do you even bother responding without answering the question, or at least telling me why the question is invalid?
I am just giving you an opportunity to preach, right?

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 154 by ICANT, posted 05-04-2016 12:51 AM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 156 by ICANT, posted 05-04-2016 5:13 PM NoNukes has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 156 of 1482 (783261)
05-04-2016 5:13 PM
Reply to: Message 155 by NoNukes
05-04-2016 3:32 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Hi NoNukes
NoNukes writes:
I am just giving you an opportunity to preach, right?
Seems like you are the one doing the preaching.
I think there were a few other things in the message you replied too.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 155 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 3:32 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 157 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 5:30 PM ICANT has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 157 of 1482 (783264)
05-04-2016 5:30 PM
Reply to: Message 156 by ICANT
05-04-2016 5:13 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
I think there were a few other things in the message you replied too.
Surely you are not complaining about portions of your message not being addressed? Not you, ICANT. Yeah, I did see where you said 'Occam's Razor' as if that was some kind of answer. Please cite Occam's Razor and tell me how that means you win.
For the purposes of this discussion my interests in understanding the rationale for your interpretation of Genesis, and how that interpretation stacks up to what is actually written. I am not pushing any alternative view other than as a probe against that interpretation.
If you are not interested in helping me with that, so be it. This is your thread. But I thought my questions were on topic. If they aren't then I can stop asking them here. I'll pursue my interest elsewhere.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 156 by ICANT, posted 05-04-2016 5:13 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 158 by ICANT, posted 05-04-2016 8:49 PM NoNukes has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 158 of 1482 (783304)
05-04-2016 8:49 PM
Reply to: Message 157 by NoNukes
05-04-2016 5:30 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Hi NoNukes
NoNukes writes:
For the purposes of this discussion my interests in understanding the rationale for your interpretation of Genesis, and how that interpretation stacks up to what is actually written.
If that is actually what you are interested in then why not take what I wrote in Message 154 and go line by line and tell me where I am mis-understanding what is written.
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 157 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 5:30 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 159 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 9:32 PM ICANT has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 159 of 1482 (783317)
05-04-2016 9:32 PM
Reply to: Message 158 by ICANT
05-04-2016 8:49 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
If that is actually what you are interested in then why not take what I wrote in Message 154 and go line by line and tell me where I am mis-understanding what is written.
I have been exceedingly clear about where I find your reply lacking. I'm not going to play the 'tell me where the math I learned in sixth grade is wrong" game again. I have found plenty of sources that discuss Jeremiah 4:23-4:26 and other verses from several perspectives and which discuss the implication for the ruin-reconstruction hypothesis. If you choose to address those issues with the group, I'll see it when you get to it. If not, then I just won't get your take on it.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 158 by ICANT, posted 05-04-2016 8:49 PM ICANT has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 160 by ICANT, posted 05-05-2016 12:23 PM NoNukes has replied

  
ICANT
Member
Posts: 6769
From: SSC
Joined: 03-12-2007
Member Rating: 1.5


Message 160 of 1482 (783434)
05-05-2016 12:23 PM
Reply to: Message 159 by NoNukes
05-04-2016 9:32 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Hi NoNukes
In Message 99 you said:
quote:
Perhaps you don't believe Jeremiah when he claimed that his description was of things to come and not of things past. Or perhaps there is even more of the Bible that supposedly took place on the Genesis 1:1 earth than just those parts you have mentioned so far. Or perhaps your argument is breaking under its own weight.
I see no such claim by Jeremiah.
In Message 111you said:
quote:
I take it that you have no response to my question about the context of Jeremiah and elected to just go with your standard evasion.
What question are you referring too in Message 99?
I see no question mark or question to answer.
I did provide more of the Bible that took place in Genesis 1:1 in Message 107
Message 111
quote:
Seriously, ICANT. Did I not explain in my post exactly how I understand what you meant? There is no description in Genesis 1:1, but there is one in Genesis 1:2. Hence you probably meant the latter. Just because I understand your argument does not mean that it is worth the paper it is printed on. I take it that you have no response to my question about the context of Jeremiah and elected to just go with your standard evasion.
So in this message you are saying that the description in Jeremiah fits Genesis 1:2 and not Genesis 1:1.
Then you refer to a question you say you have asked me.
Message 155
NoNukes writes:
But given that Jeremiah was providing a warning about the future, the fact such condition did not currently exist would not be that surprising, would it? I note that my complaint about not looking at the verses surrounding 4:23-4:26 resulted in you printing a couple more verses, but then not taking into account their content.
Why do I need to ask the same questions and then complain about the same lack of response over and over? Why do you even bother responding without answering the question, or at least telling me why the question is invalid?
I am just giving you an opportunity to preach, right?
You did finally ask a question based upon your assertion that Jeremiah was talking about a future event?
It is your claim of a future event and not the claim of Jeremiah.
But no the conditions Jeremiah saw would not exist in his lifetime nor has it existed in the future of his lifetime
But the things Jeremiah mentioned had already existed in past time.
Could you shed some light on when those events will take place?
Your second question "Why do I need to ask the same questions and then complain about the same lack of response over and over?"
I can not answer a question you have not asked as I am not a mind reader.
Your third question "Why do you even bother responding without answering the question, or at least telling me why the question is invalid? ".
When there is no question there can be no answer to a question.
NoNukes writes:
I have been exceedingly clear about where I find your reply lacking.
You have not been remotely clear about anything other than your disdane for God's Word.
Do you have any questions hiding somewhere that I have not answered?
God Bless,

"John 5:39 (KJS) Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 159 by NoNukes, posted 05-04-2016 9:32 PM NoNukes has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 161 by NoNukes, posted 05-05-2016 4:30 PM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 161 of 1482 (783488)
05-05-2016 4:30 PM
Reply to: Message 160 by ICANT
05-05-2016 12:23 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
You have not been remotely clear about anything other than your disdane for God's Word.
Really? Not sharing or adopting your personal interpretation of Genesis is disdain for God's Word?
I have told you in detail exactly what it is you say that I fail to find convincing. In particular, I have told you that your application of Occam's razor appears to be bogus and that most people interpret Jeremiah to be warning of the future. Your response was that since Jeremiah was in the past, then Occam's razor suggests he must be talking about the past. That's inane. Would that logic have worked at the time Jeremiah actually spoke? Nope.
Did I make up that argument. No, that argument is easily found just about everywhere this topic is discussed. It is hard to find rebuttals to it, but I am sure they exist. I'm also sure that what you have posted does not cut the grade.
Get a grip brother. If I have displayed any disdain it is for your tactics. I am very interested in God's word, and I am pursuing my interest in Ruin-Restoration theology elsewhere. It is your presentation that I find lacking and full of your own typical evasion.
I accept that your belief is sincere and I have never doubted your love for Gods' word. But none of that guarantees that you are right about anything. This is my last post in this thread. You are welcome to have the last insult.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people. Martin Luther King
If there are no stupid questions, then what kind of questions do stupid people ask? Do they get smart just in time to ask questions? Scott Adams

This message is a reply to:
 Message 160 by ICANT, posted 05-05-2016 12:23 PM ICANT has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 162 by Faith, posted 05-05-2016 7:41 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(1)
Message 162 of 1482 (783505)
05-05-2016 7:41 PM
Reply to: Message 161 by NoNukes
05-05-2016 4:30 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
I haven't been following all of this but as a result of this thread I have become interested in Gap Theory and have been reading up on it myself. I'm still particularly interested in the interpretations about the fall of Satan, and not too likely to be persuaded that it has much to do with present-day Geology but we'll see as I read more. I am right now beginning to read two books by believers in Gap Theory, Earth's Earliest Ages by G. H. Pember, and The Invisible War by Barnhouse. I'm looking forward to a good spooky read.
NN writes:
most people interpret Jeremiah to be warning of the future
But it does seem to have a special place in Gap Theory. For instance it is referred to in this discussion of Gap Theory at number "5. Other Passages" and also down further at 10. The following is from number 5:
In addition, Isaiah 34:11 and Jeremiah 4:23-26, the only other instances the phrase without form and void is used, clearly refers to some type of divine judgment. Hence, Genesis 1:2 must also be a reference to judgment.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 161 by NoNukes, posted 05-05-2016 4:30 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 174 by ICANT, posted 05-06-2016 9:13 PM Faith has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 163 of 1482 (783512)
05-05-2016 8:09 PM
Reply to: Message 151 by jar
05-03-2016 12:17 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
When you have to take pieces parts of stories out of context to support your position it makes little sense. If the Bible was inspired by God was God incapable of inspiring writing that does not require a patchwork quilt of pieces parts to support what the God wanted communicated?
But this is how many doctrines are constructed, the most familiar one being the construction of the Trinity from dozens of different references to Father, Son and Holy Ghost throughout the Old and New Testaments. Once you see all the parts of the Trinity it should be clear that the complaint that it's not in the Bible is complete foolishness.
This demonstrates that the entire Bible works together to reveal God's plan, and that is in fact the opposite of what you are saying: it shows that God is overseeing the Bible since no single writer has any idea about how these verses are going to come together in the end; only God does.
Interestingly I found D.G. Barnhouse discussing this at the beginning of his book The Invislble War where he's going to be discussing the fall of Lucifer. I know you have no respect for any of the theologians revered by traditional Christians but perhaps someone else will find it illuminating:
Barnhouse writes:
The proper method of Bible study, then, is analogous to the putting together of the puzzle. For any given doctrinal subject, read the entire volume, selecting every verse that bears on the truth under study. Put all of these passages together, and the synthesis of the result is the true Bible doctrine on the question with which you are concerned. A verse from Moses, and one from Ezekiel, and one from Paul, put side by side, each illuminating the others, fit into the perfect pattern of the whole design and give the whole light which God has been pleased to reveal on that particular theme....
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 151 by jar, posted 05-03-2016 12:17 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 164 by jar, posted 05-05-2016 8:17 PM Faith has replied
 Message 166 by NoNukes, posted 05-05-2016 10:00 PM Faith has replied

  
jar
Member (Idle past 394 days)
Posts: 34026
From: Texas!!
Joined: 04-20-2004


Message 164 of 1482 (783513)
05-05-2016 8:17 PM
Reply to: Message 163 by Faith
05-05-2016 8:09 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
Faith writes:
But this is how many doctrines are constructed, the most familiar one being the construction of the Trinity from dozens of different references to Father, Son and Holy Ghost throughout the Old and New Testaments. It demonstrates that the entire Bible works together to reveal God's plan. Once you see all the parts of the Trinity it should be clear that the complaint that it's not in the Bible is complete foolishness.
A great example of utter nonsense.
The Trinity concept developed over many centuries and was only created as a weapon to use against folk that held different interpretations.
And you are correct, it is NOT a concept found in the Bible, any of the Bibles, except through quote mining and taking passages out of context.
It was then later codified by several extra biblical conferences, first as a duality and then only later as a trinity. Remember the Holy Spirit was not included and even now only gets included based on the really slim fact that blasphemy of the Holy Spirit was claimed to be unforgivable where blasphemy of Jesus or the God character were forgivable.
You are correct though. Much of Christian doctrine is supported only by taking material totally out of context.
AbE:
Let me add that your quote is a perfect example of the difference between Science and Theology.
Any scientist that did what is described in your quote would be fired, likely never be employable as a scientist in any field, all of his prior work would immediately become tainted and require complete reevaluation and likely discarded.
Edited by jar, : see AbE:

Anyone so limited that they can only spell a word one way is severely handicapped!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 163 by Faith, posted 05-05-2016 8:09 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 165 by Faith, posted 05-05-2016 8:22 PM jar has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 165 of 1482 (783515)
05-05-2016 8:22 PM
Reply to: Message 164 by jar
05-05-2016 8:17 PM


Re: Implications of Gap Theory
The Trinity is in the Bible and that's what was codified at the conferences. If you were right it wouldn't be possible to construct it from all the different passages that define Father, Son and Holy Spirit, but it is very clearly there, very consistently, and I'm now looking forward to finding out from two books by gap theorists how different passages illuminate the activities of Satan in this world and from the beginning of the creation.
I added this to the post above after you answered it:
This demonstrates that the entire Bible works together to reveal God's plan, and that is in fact the opposite of what you are saying: it shows that God is overseeing the Bible since no single writer has any idea about how these verses are going to come together in the end; only God does.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 164 by jar, posted 05-05-2016 8:17 PM jar has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 168 by jar, posted 05-05-2016 10:06 PM Faith has replied

  
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