Free will vs Omniscience

Again, what does that have to do with the topic Phat?And the RC Sproul quote at best shows his ignorance and more likely shows his carny con man tactics.

No, God is perfectly welcome to go through my files.What annoys me is the idea that God already has my place in Hell reserved, that I don't even know yet what it is that will send me there but He does - and YOU have the gall to suggest that its my choice.

It's true from our perspective, in relation to our human time-bound experience, completely true: He does change in relation to our prayers, our changes of heart and so on.But on the level of His being in eternity, no. The question about God's foreknowledge is on the level of His being in eternity, it doesn't affect us personally, which is why I keep answering as I do. There is no way His foreknowledge can change, so that He has it at one time but not another, in relation to one thing but not another, it's part of His very being. But again, it doesn't affect us at all in our everyday choices and actions.Yes, I think I knew the Bible was God's word before I actually read it or read much of it, as soon as I knew God is real. You do have to believe it in order to understand it. I think it was Athanasius who said "I understand because I have faith."Jesus said "repent and believe." Obey and see marvelous things unfold before your eyes.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

He said (Mark 1:15), "... believe the gospel" - i.e. what He was saying. He didn't mean you'd see anything "unbelievable".

Ah yes, but while the gospel can be stated in simple terms as the message of salvation by grace through faith in Christ it is usually presented by the theologians I most appreciate as encompassing the entire revelation of the Bible. In fact you can't really understand the simple terms without understanding the larger context.

As usual, it boils down to what you think Jesus said as opposed to what He actually said. Believe whatever nonsense you can dream up and it retro-actively becomes what the Bible "really means".

That's a lie based on what I just said. I didn't dream it up, it's the consensus of the theologians I trust. And speaking of who dreams up what, I have a suspicion that your version of the gospel wouldn't even be the one I put in simple terms. Your posts on the Bible are usually so outlandishly peculiar to you personally you shouldn't ever talk about others "making things up."

As folk have been saying all along Faith, you don't believe in the Bible or what the Bible actually says but rather what the "theologians" you trust claim the Bible actually says.AbE:You trust the fiction those theologians create like (there are no contradictions in the Bible) or (there are no errors and falsehoods in the Bible) rather than what is actually written even when what they say directly contradicts what the Bible actually says.Edited by jar, : see AbE:

And that's a lie too. There are things in the Bible that are hard to understand and need to be interpreted and to trust oneself alone with that responsibility is foolishness. The Bible itself says "There is safety in many counselors," and I don't trust any one of them to get it all right, I weigh them all against one another, and I could still make the wrong decision. You, however, trust in your own reading of the Bible apart from anybody else I've ever heard of, and so does ringo, and GDR seems to trust in his one favorite theologian who seems to be a law unto himself without any precedent in the history of theology whatever, and yet you all accuse me of doing what you all do.ABE: And by the way, if the Bible is God's word no theologian is needed to know that it can't contradict itself or say anything false.Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Grace isn't grace when there's a caveat.

Another sophist speaketh. I'll trust the Reformers over you.

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

More utter nonsense.It is not a matter of interpretation or understanding, it is a matter of honesty. It is a matter of actually believing that what is written in the Bible is what is written in the Bible. Yet it does often contradict itself and is filled with stuff that is factually false.

IF Hell exists, would you ever want to go there? If the answer is "no" what makes you think that GOD is somehow going to allow you to be tricked and even end up there to begin with?The only reservations made are the ones we make. IF you dont plan on making reservations, why even worry about ultimate foreknowledge?

Your arrogance is showing. Sproul likely knows the bible far better than you do. You have fallen for the whole idea that logic and rationality trump faith when it comes to understanding. As a result, you are unwittingly leading many people down a path that leaves them with more questions and less answers than they had before. This is fine IF GOD simply expects people to learn about the universe rather than about Him. Sadly, I believe that you are mistaken. But of course I too could be wrong.