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Author Topic:   Report Discussion Problems Here 4.0
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 301 of 860 (753175)
03-17-2015 1:47 PM
Reply to: Message 300 by Admin
03-17-2015 1:38 PM


I consider what I do in trying to prove the Flood to be scientific and based on evidence. I get tired of being told I'm failing to do "correct science" so OK, maybe it's not "correct science" with its models and so on, so that's all I said, I wasn't "eschewing science." Proving the Flood DOES require a different approach than simply setting out as a scientist to discover something about the world. That is not "correct science" according to a million complaints people have dumped on me, and to that I say I could not care less. BUT I'm looking for evidence and arguing from evidence and I consider that to be science.
HOWEVER, for the last day or so I've mostly been responding to complaints and am rather fed up with the debate for the moment. So I'll stay off the threads until I have something to say in the debate.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 300 by Admin, posted 03-17-2015 1:38 PM Admin has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 302 by Faith, posted 03-17-2015 2:04 PM Faith has not replied
 Message 303 by Admin, posted 03-17-2015 2:34 PM Faith has not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 302 of 860 (753177)
03-17-2015 2:04 PM
Reply to: Message 301 by Faith
03-17-2015 1:47 PM


As for all the "what-ifs" they are attempts to find an alternative explanation for something that current science uses to prove the Old Earth. Every time I propose such a possibility it's denounced as not science. At least HBD finally came along and said it is an important part of science, as I would expect it to be. Edge however gets apoplectic when I suggest such alternatives to his expert knowledge. Sometimes he can give a reason for why he's so sure I'm wrong, and then of course I have to find a way to explain it in young earth terms and drive him even more crazy.
But sometimes he really just doesn't get something that makes perfect sense, like the "strain" at the top of a three mile stack of wet sediments from being stretched over an uplift at such a height. That drives ME crazy.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 301 by Faith, posted 03-17-2015 1:47 PM Faith has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 304 by NoNukes, posted 03-17-2015 3:07 PM Faith has not replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12998
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 303 of 860 (753181)
03-17-2015 2:34 PM
Reply to: Message 301 by Faith
03-17-2015 1:47 PM


Faith writes:
Proving the Flood DOES require a different approach than simply setting out as a scientist to discover something about the world.
Science is knowledge uncovered using a scientific approach. If you're going to use a (in your own words) different approach then it isn't science.
I get tired of being told I'm failing to do "correct science" so OK, maybe it's not "correct science" with its models and so on...
Not sure what you mean here. Science has no requirement concerning models, and I don't know what "and so on" refers to.
BUT I'm looking for evidence...
Which is a very good thing and something that all scientists do in support of a hypothesis. Where scientists differ from you is that they form a *plausible* hypothesis based upon available but currently insufficient evidence, and then they test that hypotheses by seeking additional evidence that indicates whether it is true or false. (Usually each scientist or scientific group has a preferred hypothesis, and so it is fine that you have a preferred hypothesis.)
So, yes, your approach differs most from science in that your preferred hypothesis is not plausible based upon the available evidence, but that isn't the chief concern. Far worse is that most aspects of your preferred hypothesis are directly contradicted by the available evidence, beginning several hundred years ago and becoming increasingly contradicted by it as our knowledge has grown.
As moderator I am not taking a position on the debate itself in the Origin of the Flood Layers thread, just on whether any particular argument or evidence qualifies as science.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

This message is a reply to:
 Message 301 by Faith, posted 03-17-2015 1:47 PM Faith has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 304 of 860 (753183)
03-17-2015 3:07 PM
Reply to: Message 302 by Faith
03-17-2015 2:04 PM


like the "strain"
What does the word in scare quotes mean. Strain already has an exact meaning. Strain is a mechanical deformation produced by stress.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Je Suis Charlie
Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 302 by Faith, posted 03-17-2015 2:04 PM Faith has not replied

  
Theodoric
Member
Posts: 9076
From: Northwest, WI, USA
Joined: 08-15-2005
Member Rating: 3.7


Message 305 of 860 (753820)
03-22-2015 3:15 PM


Petro again goes way over the top
Message 3341
Come on, everything Petro posts now is beyond the pale. He spews wing nut venom and hate, nothing more. This post is full of personal and ethnic hatred. There is no place for that on this board.

Facts don't lie or have an agenda. Facts are just facts
"God did it" is not an argument. It is an excuse for intellectual laziness.

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 306 of 860 (754515)
03-27-2015 2:47 PM


OK, I take it back.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

Replies to this message:
 Message 307 by Jon, posted 03-27-2015 3:04 PM Faith has replied
 Message 311 by nwr, posted 03-27-2015 6:16 PM Faith has replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 307 of 860 (754516)
03-27-2015 3:04 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Faith
03-27-2015 2:47 PM


Re: newbie out of line
I wouldn't make too much of it, Faith.
Just based on the quote, I knew who you were talking about without having to click the link. He/She pulled the same stunt with me in Computer Help Please?. His/Her other post in that same thread isn't worth anything either; just another dismissal declaring it all not worth his/her effort.
Personally, I don't think [mbrid=11338] is here to discuss much of anything. He/She just wants to grunt along with people he/she agrees with and dismiss the arguments he/she disagrees with as not worth his/her time... adding an insult or two for good measure.
I find the whole thing too sad and pitiful to be insulted or angry about any of it.
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Faith, posted 03-27-2015 2:47 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 308 by Faith, posted 03-27-2015 3:11 PM Jon has replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


Message 308 of 860 (754517)
03-27-2015 3:11 PM
Reply to: Message 307 by Jon
03-27-2015 3:04 PM


OK, I take it back.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 307 by Jon, posted 03-27-2015 3:04 PM Jon has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 309 by Jon, posted 03-27-2015 3:22 PM Faith has not replied

  
Jon
Inactive Member


Message 309 of 860 (754518)
03-27-2015 3:22 PM
Reply to: Message 308 by Faith
03-27-2015 3:11 PM


Re: newbie out of line
ABE: Couldn't find the post you were linking to, but finally did. Yes, this person definitely needs to be called out. /ABE
Sorry. Should have linked straight to the post
I think someone who is willing to come on here and slander someone needs to be called on it for the sake of the level of discourse in general, trying to keep at least a small semblance of civility.
I just don't think they are here to do anything other than waste bandwidth tossing about condescension and one-liners.
And I think that says more about them than they've said about anyone else.
Edited by Jon, : No reason given.

Love your enemies!

This message is a reply to:
 Message 308 by Faith, posted 03-27-2015 3:11 PM Faith has not replied

  
Admin
Director
Posts: 12998
From: EvC Forum
Joined: 06-14-2002
Member Rating: 2.3


Message 310 of 860 (754520)
03-27-2015 4:40 PM


Moderator Response
Faith and Jon,
If posts continue that provoke concerns please let know.

--Percy
EvC Forum Director

  
nwr
Member
Posts: 6408
From: Geneva, Illinois
Joined: 08-08-2005
Member Rating: 5.1


(1)
Message 311 of 860 (754521)
03-27-2015 6:16 PM
Reply to: Message 306 by Faith
03-27-2015 2:47 PM


Re: newbie out of line
Yes, I agree that the "newbie" was out of line.
But I also agree with Jon, that it's best not to make a big deal out of it.
I'd like to think that if we still had a "jeer" button, that post would have received a lot of jeers.

Fundamentalism - the anti-American, anti-Christian branch of American Christianity

This message is a reply to:
 Message 306 by Faith, posted 03-27-2015 2:47 PM Faith has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 312 by Faith, posted 03-27-2015 7:49 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
Faith 
Suspended Member (Idle past 1444 days)
Posts: 35298
From: Nevada, USA
Joined: 10-06-2001


(3)
Message 312 of 860 (754522)
03-27-2015 7:49 PM
Reply to: Message 311 by nwr
03-27-2015 6:16 PM


OK I take it back
Point taken.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
Edited by Faith, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 311 by nwr, posted 03-27-2015 6:16 PM nwr has seen this message but not replied

  
coffee_addict
Member (Idle past 477 days)
Posts: 3645
From: Indianapolis, IN
Joined: 03-29-2004


(4)
Message 313 of 860 (754528)
03-27-2015 10:07 PM


I apologize for my behavior.
Edit.
To explain a little bit, I came to this thread after I got a message from Admin. Personally, I don't think I've posted anything that would offend anyone.
I tried to engage Faith, but after seeing how it's pretty much Faith versus the world here, I decided not to get involved.
I used to debate on forums like this one. Nowadays, I've been more of a lurker after I realized no one is ever going to change. Ever.
But since I'm a newbie here, let me start slow by engaging with Jon on windows 8.1. Then I'll see where I'll go from there.
Edited by coffee_addict, : No reason given.

  
RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


Message 314 of 860 (755463)
04-08-2015 3:34 PM


Cleanup on Aisle PNT
spam

we are limited in our ability to understand
by our ability to understand
RebelAmerican☆Zen☯Deist
... to learn ... to think ... to live ... to laugh ...
to share.


Join the effort to solve medical problems, AIDS/HIV, Cancer and more with Team EvC! (click)

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


Message 315 of 860 (755525)
04-09-2015 5:13 AM


More spam. Message 1
{Reprocessed - Adminnemooseus}
Edited by Adminnemooseus, : Note.

  
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