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Member (Idle past 1404 days) Posts: 20714 From: the other end of the sidewalk Joined: |
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Author | Topic: Immigration -- what's the big deal? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
NoNukes Inactive Member
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Jon writes: Pointing out that RAZD lives in a fantasy world where all of his half-cooked ideas solve any problem imaginable. Interesting...
Jon writes: That's it? If you want to be a U.S. citizen to make it easier to fly planes into buildings then that should be just fine? I submit that statements such as the one above don't really require much of a response. They tell us a lot more about you than they do RAZD.Je Suis Charlie Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
Tomahawks. Uh, yeah, our "barriers" have had significant technological improvements since then. You think that might have something to do with whether or not they will work?
And who's to say that the new wave of immigrants won't be stronger than us? Got anyone in mind?
I wish a muthafucka would
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ringo Member (Idle past 411 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat's Eye writes:
I think the Berlin Wall was a failed strategy. Why do you think your higher, stronger Berlin Wall is an improvement?
Uh, yeah, our "barriers" have had significant technological improvements since then. You think that might have something to do with whether or not they will work? Cat's Eye writes:
They're already here. There's plenty more where they came from. ringo writes:
Got anyone in mind? And who's to say that the new wave of immigrants won't be stronger than us? Edited by ringo, : No reason given.
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member |
You've totally lost me.
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Jon Inactive Member |
Well, that's less than I question about you, so I'll take that as a win.
Love your enemies!
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ringo Member (Idle past 411 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Jon writes:
As I've said before, at EvC we set our own winning conditions. Personally, I don't take not knowing something as a win.
Well, that's less than I question about you, so I'll take that as a win.
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ringo Member (Idle past 411 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Cat's Eye writes:
If you can't keep up with me, how do you expect to keep track of the immigrants?
You've totally lost me.
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NoNukes Inactive Member
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You've totally lost me. Immigrants comprise about 13% of the current US population. We're probably not going to send the army after them with either tomahawks or Tomahawk missiles.Je Suis Charlie Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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We're probably not going to send the army after them with either tomahawks or Tomahawk missiles. When was the last time you were a brown guy wandering around southern Arizona without your papers?
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
When was the last time you were a brown guy wandering around southern Arizona without your papers? How's that working out in Arizona. Je Suis Charlie Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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New Cat's Eye Inactive Member
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How's that working out in Arizona. I dunno, I was in Scottsdale a little while ago, it was really nice. Its kinda funny down there though. You see, there's a whole lot of Mexicans that live by me, two towns down (its where my parents grew up and I've spent a lot of time there, I'm friends with a lot of Mexicans - some of them are the real Vato types), I took four years of Spanish in high-school and I can get by speaking it, but I'm not fluent or anything. Anyways, I'm down in Arizona working with a customer and we go to a bar and the bartender is hispanic and I can tell by his accent that he's Mexican. So I order my drink in Spanish - and the customer was kinda offended and was all: "Why are you speaking spanish to that guy?" And I'm like, well, he's Mexican, he speaks Spanish and its no big deal. Then he was all: "Whoa, whoa, whoa, we don't call them Mexicans down here - they're hispanics" He was implying that I was an ignorant hick, or something. So I call the bartender over and ask him where he's originally from. He tells us that he's from Mexico. And then I go: "See, he's Mexican." Then I proceed to explain that 'Mexican' is a nationality, not an ethnicity, and I was referring to the guys nation of origin and that it was actually okay for me to speak Spanish to the guy because I was not being offensive. The bartender actually appreciated it. Anyways, it was a bit of a culture shock for me in that people were so afraid of being politically correct that I couldn't even describe the nation that a guy came from for fear of offending some kind of cultural sensitivity or something. In the end, it was the guy from Arizona that was the ignorant hick and took offense to something completely innocuous and then tried to correct my behavior on it. I'm not sure why I'm telling this story, other than it was a weird situation for me that I was reminded of when you mentioned how Arizona was doing. I guess they're doing okay, but they do seem to be a bit sensitive with the whole Mexican thing going on down there.
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NoNukes Inactive Member |
NoNukes writes: How's that working out in Arizona. Cat Sci writes: I dunno, I was in Scottsdale a little while ago, it was really nice. The reason for asking was that when the SC looked at Arizona's immigration laws, they approved this final portion on the basis that it would not devolve into asking 'brown people' to show their papers.
I'm not sure why I'm telling this story, other than it was a weird situation for me that I was reminded of when you mentioned how Arizona was doing. Not sure what the point is myself. Here in NC, Hispanic people are often called Mexicans in less than polite discussion. On occasion I've asked how they know that the subjects of the conversation are Mexicans, and it turns out that Mexican applies to every brown Hispanic unless you know his nationality. Is that a real good assumption for North Carolina? Not sure what's wrong with speaking Spanish to an Hispanic anyway. Your customer was an idiot. Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.Je Suis Charlie Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846) If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass
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Tempe 12ft Chicken Member (Idle past 335 days) Posts: 438 From: Tempe, Az. Joined: |
NoNukes writes: Not sure what's wrong with speaking Spanish to an Hispanic anyway. Your customer was an idiot. Mainly, I am following this topic just to get some insight into different ways we could look at tackling immigration in this country, but I thought I would mention something, even though it is an anecdote, that could apply here. It actually can be offensive to individuals from Mexico to speak to them in Spanish as a white guy, especially with all the Right Wing talking points in this state about "You need to speak English" or "English only in classrooms". In most situations in AZ, I have never had an issue with speaking Spanish to the guys working with me in restaurants if they were Hispanic and they do often appreciate the attempt, however white man's Spanish it may be, to speak to them in their native tongue. However, a while back I began working at a restaurant and I needed something from one of the cooks, so I asked him for it in Spanish. His response was, "Hey, I speak English, not sure why you would think that I don't". I apologized and explained I was not trying to be offensive and him and I are good, but speaking English is sometimes a way to differentiate themselves from those that refuse to assimilate into the society they are joining. To him, assuming he would want to speak Spanish was placing him with those whom he considered as not wanting to be American more than Mexican. Now, this is a rare situation and definitely not the norm, so Cat Sci is correct that most times it would be appreciated. But, I can see how people could read offense into it. Also, in AZ a majority of us refer to "Brown People" as Hispanics until we can clarify where they come from. I agree that calling someone a Mexican is not racist (more a descriptor), but I did once offend someone who was mostly Spanish by referring to him as a Mexican before I got to know him. The theory of evolution by cumulative natural selection is the only theory we know of that is in principle capable of explaining the existence of organized complexity. - Richard Dawkins Creationists make it sound as though a 'theory' is something you dreamt up after being drunk all night. - Issac Asimov If you removed all the arteries, veins, & capillaries from a person’s body, and tied them end-to-endthe person will die. - Neil Degrasse Tyson What would Buddha do? Nothing! What does the Buddhist terrorist do? Goes into the middle of the street, takes the gas, *pfft*, Self-Barbecue. The Christian and the Muslim on either side are yelling, "What the Fuck are you doing?" The Buddhist says, "Making you deal with your shit. - Robin Williams
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