Register | Sign In


Understanding through Discussion


EvC Forum active members: 65 (9162 total)
4 online now:
Newest Member: popoi
Post Volume: Total: 915,815 Year: 3,072/9,624 Month: 917/1,588 Week: 100/223 Day: 11/17 Hour: 0/7


Thread  Details

Email This Thread
Newer Topic | Older Topic
  
Author Topic:   If our sun is second or third generation, does this not conflict with Genesis ?
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 216 of 231 (726132)
05-06-2014 4:46 PM
Reply to: Message 214 by Blue
05-06-2014 3:50 PM


Re: Creation of light
They are not visible if the sun is not able to shine on them. The vantage of this verse is from within the earth. "the holy spirit is floating over the waters". If light is not able to penetrate within the earth because of the gas filling the atmosphere, we can't see the gas.
Your claim is that the darkness is because of light being blocked by methane and carbon dioxide gas.
I would presume the darkness was carbon dioxide, methane, etc filling the atmosphere as is shown in Science.
Now you are telling me that it was too dark to see the invisible gas? That is not an explanation.
The days still flow. In day 4, it is speaking in past tense. The verse is about why we have seasons not that he created stars and the moon.
Let's look at the text and see if your explanation is plausible. I'll use the KJV. Please indicate if you would prefer something else.
14And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
15 And let them be for lights in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth: and it was so.
16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: he made the stars also.
17 And God set them in the firmament of the heaven to give light upon the earth,
18 And to rule over the day and over the night, and to divide the light from the darkness: and God saw that it was good.
19 And the evening and the morning were the fourth day.
I can see how one might interpret versus 16 and 17 as you suggest. They could be interpreted as undated descriptions of something God has already done. However there are some serious problems with that interpretation. Serious enough to let me know that you are trying to force science onto non-science.
If verse 14 describes the creations of the seasons on day four, then surely that verse and verse 15 are describing the creation of the sun and moon. It is also clear that the language 'rule over day and night' does not mean create light and darkness. The moon does no such thing, it is merely prominent at night. Apparently some poet simply described the sun and the moon as being prominent during the day and night. Nothing wrong with that, but it does refute your interpretation.
I'd also have to suggest that verse 14 is an awfully poetic way of saying that God tilted the earth on day four. You'd almost think the writer was clueless about the cause of the seasons.
In short I think it is pretty difficult to read the text of verses 14 and 15 and not come away with the conclusion that those verses describe the creation of at least the stars and sun. Most likely the moon itself as well. All on day four. All after plant life was created.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 214 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 3:50 PM Blue has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 218 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 5:23 PM NoNukes has replied
 Message 220 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 5:44 PM NoNukes has replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 228 of 231 (726166)
05-06-2014 8:03 PM
Reply to: Message 220 by Blue
05-06-2014 5:44 PM


Re: Creation of light
I don't think the story flows well if we interpret it that light was created, then life, then the sun. Where did the light come from if not the sun?
That much is true. The question is whether the story is just inaccurate.
There is simply no way to parse verse 14 to create the seasons but not the sun and at least the stars. And verse 15 is similar in grammatical construction to verse 14. You are grasping at straws.
Again you have to be able to presume God does exist for you to understand where I am coming from.
You also have to believe that the Bible is astronomically accurate. In fact that is the only requirement. I believe in God, but I don't believe that the Bible is a physics textbook.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 220 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 5:44 PM Blue has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 229 of 231 (726167)
05-06-2014 8:16 PM
Reply to: Message 218 by Blue
05-06-2014 5:23 PM


Re: Creation of light
In order for you to see something it has to have light on it. Do you know anything about how the eyes work? You have to remember this is supposed to be from the vantage of a human being.
Carbon dioxide is invisible to humans day or night because it is transparent to light (and does not refract it). There is plenty of it in the room you are in. Do you see any of it?
Darkness in space does not need an explanation.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 218 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 5:23 PM Blue has not replied

  
NoNukes
Inactive Member


Message 231 of 231 (726229)
05-07-2014 7:48 AM
Reply to: Message 230 by AZPaul3
05-06-2014 10:48 PM


Maybe he went outside early yesterday afternoon and saw the moon. Here in central North Carolina moon rise was around 12:30 pm yesterday.
There is still 'Non sequitur' boy to play with if you just want to be right about something.
Edited by NoNukes, : No reason given.

Under a government which imprisons any unjustly, the true place for a just man is also in prison. Thoreau: Civil Disobedience (1846)
I have never met a man so ignorant that I couldn't learn something from him. Galileo Galilei
If there is no struggle, there is no progress. Those who profess to favor freedom, and deprecate agitation, are men who want crops without plowing up the ground, they want rain without thunder and lightning. Frederick Douglass

This message is a reply to:
 Message 230 by AZPaul3, posted 05-06-2014 10:48 PM AZPaul3 has seen this message but not replied

  
Newer Topic | Older Topic
Jump to:


Copyright 2001-2023 by EvC Forum, All Rights Reserved

™ Version 4.2
Innovative software from Qwixotic © 2024