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Author Topic:   Is there a legitimate argument for design?
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 241 of 638 (725298)
04-25-2014 12:58 PM
Reply to: Message 216 by Ed67
04-24-2014 4:00 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
Ed67 writes:
The CODE for building proteins necessary for life. In a molecule. Now you can't say that about salt.
Of course you can. The only "code" is the arrangement of the molecule. Every molecule has an arrangement which determines its reactions. What's so hard to understand about that?
If you could stop being hypnotized by words like "code" and "embedded", maybe you could start to understand the chemistry.
Edited by ringo, : Speling.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 216 by Ed67, posted 04-24-2014 4:00 PM Ed67 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 246 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 9:55 PM ringo has replied
 Message 268 by Ed67, posted 04-26-2014 11:38 PM ringo has replied

  
ringo
Member (Idle past 411 days)
Posts: 20940
From: frozen wasteland
Joined: 03-23-2005


Message 242 of 638 (725301)
04-25-2014 1:08 PM
Reply to: Message 222 by Ed67
04-24-2014 7:29 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
Ed67 writes:
You can't even understand the basic function of DNA.
Let's say XY is a molecule with a "code" (its structure). We have a bunch of XY swimming around in a beaker with a bunch of W and a bunch of Z. An XY attaches to a W to make WXY. Then the WXY attaches to a Z to make ZWXY. Then the original XY separates, leaving ZW.
That's pretty much how chemistry works.
Pop quiz: Can you spot the DNA?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 222 by Ed67, posted 04-24-2014 7:29 PM Ed67 has not replied

  
AZPaul3
Member
Posts: 8513
From: Phoenix
Joined: 11-06-2006
Member Rating: 5.3


(3)
Message 243 of 638 (725316)
04-25-2014 4:30 PM
Reply to: Message 235 by Ed67
04-25-2014 7:58 AM


Finally! Real code!
I think you guys have spent too much time sitting around congratulating each other. You've got some kind of creepy 'group think' going on where you all have developed the same blind spots.
Now that is code. Real code, not that bogus crap you've been pushing here. I can't say it is intelligently designed but it certainly is a human construct.
"group think" is code for being in substantial agreement on this specific issue and "blind" is code for disagreeing with the delusional ravings of IDiotology.
Yeah, Ed, you got us there. We often are that way.
Edited by AZPaul3, : No reason given.
Edited by AZPaul3, : spl

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RAZD
Member (Idle past 1405 days)
Posts: 20714
From: the other end of the sidewalk
Joined: 03-14-2004


(1)
Message 244 of 638 (725319)
04-25-2014 5:11 PM
Reply to: Message 243 by AZPaul3
04-25-2014 4:30 PM


Re: Finally! Real code!
"group think" is code for being in substantial agreement on this specific issue and "blind" is code for disagreeing with the delusional ravings of IDiotology.
Now if there were actual "objective evidence" (code for facts) rather than "the assertion of opinion" (code for fantasy) and "the argument from incredulity" (code for wishful thinking), if there were something other than the chemical connection of elements into molecules according to the rules of chemical bonding ... then you might experience a "see change" (code for objective evidence substantiated argument) ...
We gots lots a codes ...
Edited by RAZD, : .

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This message is a reply to:
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Taq
Member
Posts: 9972
Joined: 03-06-2009
Member Rating: 5.5


Message 245 of 638 (725322)
04-25-2014 5:56 PM
Reply to: Message 199 by Ed67
04-23-2014 7:44 PM


RE: Is there a legitimate argument for design?
good one. Any high school student can tell you that - in the base pair arrangement, of course.
No, seriously, you knew that, right?
I don't see a code. Can you please describe it for me?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 199 by Ed67, posted 04-23-2014 7:44 PM Ed67 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 249 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 11:06 PM Taq has replied
 Message 255 by Omnivorous, posted 04-26-2014 8:54 AM Taq has not replied

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 3329 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 246 of 638 (725337)
04-25-2014 9:55 PM
Reply to: Message 241 by ringo
04-25-2014 12:58 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
ringo writes:
Ed67 writes:
The CODE for building proteins necessary for life. In a molecule. Now you can't say that about salt.
Of course you can. The only "code" is the arrangement of the molecule. Every molecule has an arrangement which determines its reactions. What's so hard to understand about that?
If you could stop being hypnotized by words like "code" and "embedded", maybe you could start to understand the chemistry.
You are desperate to squash the idea of a code embedded in the DNA/RNA molecule. Where do you think I got those quotes from? Did you click the links? It's not Creationist Propaganda - it's right in front of your face, from mainstream scientific sources.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 241 by ringo, posted 04-25-2014 12:58 PM ringo has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 247 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 10:11 PM Ed67 has replied
 Message 258 by ringo, posted 04-26-2014 11:59 AM Ed67 has replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1254 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


Message 247 of 638 (725338)
04-25-2014 10:11 PM
Reply to: Message 246 by Ed67
04-25-2014 9:55 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
Ed67 writes:
Where do you think I got those quotes from?
Well, I know you got one of them from James Watson, who thinks intelligent design is only for the uneducated. It's almost like you and Watson were using the word "code" in completely different ways.
Food for thought.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung

This message is a reply to:
 Message 246 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 9:55 PM Ed67 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 248 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 10:59 PM subbie has replied

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 3329 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 248 of 638 (725340)
04-25-2014 10:59 PM
Reply to: Message 247 by subbie
04-25-2014 10:11 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
subbie writes:
Ed67 writes:
Where do you think I got those quotes from?
Well, I know you got one of them from James Watson, who thinks intelligent design is only for the uneducated. It's almost like you and Watson were using the word "code" in completely different ways.
Food for thought.
...Yes, it's food for thought that even a committed materialist must admit that they've found a code in DNA.
What's wrong with the rest of you guys?

This message is a reply to:
 Message 247 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 10:11 PM subbie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 250 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 11:10 PM Ed67 has replied

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 3329 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 249 of 638 (725341)
04-25-2014 11:06 PM
Reply to: Message 245 by Taq
04-25-2014 5:56 PM


RE: Is there a legitimate argument for design?
Taq writes:
I don't see a code. Can you please describe it for me?
Here, I'll let the good folks at the University of Washington tell you what they see...
quote:
Since the genetic code was deciphered in the 1960s, scientists have assumed that it was used exclusively to write information about proteins. UW scientists were stunned to discover that genomes use the genetic code to write two separate languages. One describes how proteins are made, and the other instructs the cell on how genes are controlled. One language is written on top of the other, which is why the second language remained hidden for so long.
For over 40 years we have assumed that DNA changes affecting the genetic code solely impact how proteins are made, said Stamatoyannopoulos. Now we know that this basic assumption about reading the human genome missed half of the picture. These new findings highlight that DNA is an incredibly powerful information storage device, which nature has fully exploited in unexpected ways.
Scientists discover double meaning in genetic code | UW News
And here's the opening sentences of the abstract:
quote:
Genomes contain both a genetic code specifying amino acids and a regulatory code specifying transcription factor (TF) recognition sequences. We used genomic deoxyribonuclease I footprinting to map nucleotide resolution TF occupancy across the human exome in 81 diverse cell types. We found that ~15% of human codons are dual-use codons (duons) that simultaneously specify both amino acids and TF recognition sites.
Just a moment...
Two different codes now! Sounds pretty complex to me.
And the codes are specified to produce different results.
Here we go again, leading, recent research uncovers more of the specified complexity of the DNA molecule.
Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.
Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.
Edited by Ed67, : No reason given.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by Taq, posted 04-25-2014 5:56 PM Taq has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 313 by Taq, posted 04-30-2014 1:35 PM Ed67 has not replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1254 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


(1)
Message 250 of 638 (725342)
04-25-2014 11:10 PM
Reply to: Message 248 by Ed67
04-25-2014 10:59 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
You keep quoting James Watson as if his comments support your position when he has explicitly rejected your position and you ask what's wrong with us.
Curious.

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung

This message is a reply to:
 Message 248 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 10:59 PM Ed67 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 251 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 11:23 PM subbie has replied

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 3329 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 251 of 638 (725343)
04-25-2014 11:23 PM
Reply to: Message 250 by subbie
04-25-2014 11:10 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
subbie writes:
You keep quoting James Watson as if his comments support your position when he has explicitly rejected your position and you ask what's wrong with us.
As i've established, Watson's factual findings support my position. His personal opinion is irrelevant.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 250 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 11:10 PM subbie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 252 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 11:30 PM Ed67 has replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1254 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


(1)
Message 252 of 638 (725344)
04-25-2014 11:30 PM
Reply to: Message 251 by Ed67
04-25-2014 11:23 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
Ed67 writes:
As i've established, Watson's factual findings support my position. His personal opinion is irrelevant.
I see. So your understanding of the implication of DNA is superior to that of one of the people who discovered its structure.
Curiouser.
Edited by subbie, : Tyop

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung

This message is a reply to:
 Message 251 by Ed67, posted 04-25-2014 11:23 PM Ed67 has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 253 by Ed67, posted 04-26-2014 8:16 AM subbie has replied

  
Ed67
Member (Idle past 3329 days)
Posts: 159
Joined: 04-14-2014


Message 253 of 638 (725355)
04-26-2014 8:16 AM
Reply to: Message 252 by subbie
04-25-2014 11:30 PM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
subbie writes:
Ed67 writes:
As i've established, Watson's factual findings support my position. His personal opinion is irrelevant.
I see. So your understanding of the implication of DNA is superior to that of one of the people who discovered its structure.
Curiouser.
You're curiousest

This message is a reply to:
 Message 252 by subbie, posted 04-25-2014 11:30 PM subbie has replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 254 by subbie, posted 04-26-2014 8:21 AM Ed67 has not replied

  
subbie
Member (Idle past 1254 days)
Posts: 3509
Joined: 02-26-2006


(2)
Message 254 of 638 (725356)
04-26-2014 8:21 AM
Reply to: Message 253 by Ed67
04-26-2014 8:16 AM


Re: What does the CODE in DNA do?
Ed67 writes:
You're curiousest
The old "I know you are but what am I" retort. What's next, "I am rubber, you are glue?"

Ridicule is the only weapon which can be used against unintelligible propositions. -- Thomas Jefferson
We see monsters where science shows us windmills. -- Phat
It has always struck me as odd that fundies devote so much time and effort into trying to find a naturalistic explanation for their mythical flood, while looking for magical explanations for things that actually happened. -- Dr. Adequate
Howling about evidence is a conversation stopper, and it never stops to think if the claim could possibly be true -- foreveryoung

This message is a reply to:
 Message 253 by Ed67, posted 04-26-2014 8:16 AM Ed67 has not replied

  
Omnivorous
Member
Posts: 3978
From: Adirondackia
Joined: 07-21-2005
Member Rating: 7.3


Message 255 of 638 (725358)
04-26-2014 8:54 AM
Reply to: Message 245 by Taq
04-25-2014 5:56 PM


RE: Is there a legitimate argument for design?
Taq writes:
I don't see a code. Can you please describe it for me?
I think I can help.
Other complex molecules do what natural law compels them to do.
DNA does what natural law compels it to do in the name of god.
You probably couldn't see that 'cause it's a secret invisible code.

"If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."

This message is a reply to:
 Message 245 by Taq, posted 04-25-2014 5:56 PM Taq has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 256 by RAZD, posted 04-26-2014 9:34 AM Omnivorous has replied

  
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