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Author | Topic: What Does Critical Thinking Mean To You? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Dr Adequate Member (Idle past 315 days) Posts: 16113 Joined: |
See above. That leaves me uncertain as to what your answer would be if you gave one.
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
I didn't say stories prove something is real. They may or may not be evidence of something real. If all you've got is people's accounts then you have to apply your Critical Thinking to those accounts to decide whether you find them credible or not. That could involve extensive interviews, comparisons with other accounts and so on. What's interesting about the reactions here to accounts of phenomena they haven't themselves witnessed is that they discount them out of hand on the basis of what they're ABOUT, not any actual evidence. Pure prejudice. Yet they seem to think this amounts to Critical Thinking. Seems to me it's a perfect case of NOT thinking. Where do you draw the line? It's different in every case I suppose, depending on the credibility of the person who had the experience, others who had the same or similar experience, the details given, etc. etc. etc. Not just what was described that you would dismiss because you never experienced it. That way you'll never learn anything about things you know nothing about from your own experience. Well i used to be really in to investigations in to the "spirit relm", if seen allot of so called evidence of ghosts and spirits nothing to convince me though. The best protection against spirits is to be a sceptic , no really theirs a "haunted" castle/hotel not fare from me i stayed many times never saw anything, but my mind wasn't plagued by fear that made every gust of wind in to a ghost like other people. what has you convinced of spirits, just the stories, or did you have your own private hallucination. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
But if you get a lot of people insisting on the reality of experiences that are independent but very similar, it might be reasonable to consider they aren't merely hallucinating.
in 1938 there was a Halloween radio broadcast based on the novel war of the worlds about 1,2 million people really thought the world was attacked and they reported the smell of poison gas, and lightning flashes in the distance. Its the same with ghosts and other similar phenomena, people at one time or another hear a story believe it to be real, and at one point when their scared or in other intense emotional states the brain draws parallels with the story, and makes them see and hear things that are not there. Houdini said to his wife if there is an afterlife ill come back and tell you, to test the spiritualist that is saying is talking to me il give you a "password" he should say to you. so fare no one passed his test. the james randy foundation was offering 1 000 000$ to any one that claims to have spiritual powers of any kind and passes his test's They gave up because most people dint want to go on the show after they found out how easily he will debunk them. But some idiots still tryed. So you see "supernatural" claims are being tested all the time ther just aint any that have passed the test. Edited by frako, : No reason given.Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
I reported my experience earlier in the thread, as well as the experiences of others who told me about them. They all happened in the context of religious practices (Zen for one, Rajneesh meditation for another) or in my case intense seeking through reading about such things. Mine was a threatening apparition, however, angry, wanting to kill me. These aren't "ghosts," in fact I don't believe in ghosts if you mean spirits of human beings. There may be demon impersonations of people, however. That's what I believe the "hauntings" are, and most such apparitions for that matter. I think the appearances of the "Virgin Mary" to millions of Catholics are real, but that they are demon impersonations. I also happen to believe that because of all the people getting involved in Eastern type religious practices in America, that increased enormously in the 70s, that there are probably a lot more demons around since then than there used to be.
If there are real spirits then they have minds and wills and aren't going to just show up when you want them to, but when it suits them. ABE: Other phenomena, such as "psychic" phenomena, is different and can be tested. But Randi should test the Yogis, not the average psychics. Edited by Faith, : No reason given.
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined:
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I reported my experience earlier in the thread, as well as the experiences of others who told me about them. They all happened in the context of religious practices (Zen for one, Rajneesh meditation for another) or in my case intense seeking through reading about such things. Mine was a threatening apparition, however, angry, wanting to kill me. And your sure you where not just seeing things, or dreaming, because? I once had a hallucination as i was pushing my scooter home, i ran out of gas, i saw a bear 20 meeter's from me, it was dusk and he was a big and mean looking, i was scared as hell, now i knew if i ran and he chased me id be dead, so i hoped that if i turn on the lights and point them at him he would get scared and run, so i did. The huge bear turned out to be a cat. Now as embarrassing as this story is its completely true in my mind it was a huge bear. Do you think you could have hallucinated the daemon?
These aren't "ghosts," in fact I don't believe in ghosts if you mean spirits of human beings. There may be demon impersonations of people, however. That's what I believe the "hauntings" are, and most such apparitions for that matter. I think the appearances of the "Virgin Mary" to millions of Catholics are real, but that they are demon impersonations. I also happen to believe that because of all the people getting involved in Eastern type religious practices in America, that increased enormously in the 70s, that there are probably a lot more demons around since then than there used to be. So you don't believe the stories of these millions of Catholics that see the virgin marry that you have not seen but believe they see daemons posing as the virgin because of some sinister plot or whatever?? The evidence for it is naturally your superior understanding of the world and god?
If there are real spirits then they have minds and wills and aren't going to just show up when you want them to, but when it suits them. Yea but the best protection against them is to be a sceptic they never show up for sceptics. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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ramoss Member (Idle past 643 days) Posts: 3228 Joined: |
None of the Yogis are dumb enough to get tested. They have their con job well in hand, and they know it's a con job.
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Faith  Suspended Member (Idle past 1475 days) Posts: 35298 From: Nevada, USA Joined: |
No I've had that kind of "hallucination" where I seem to see something in the twilight and that sort of thing. It may startle me but I can prove to myself it's not real. The apparition in my room was right there a few feet in front of me, real as real.
I should have said I don't believe in ghosts because of various indications in the Bible that human beings don't come back, and I think they are demonic also because of the Bible.
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined: |
No I've had that kind of "hallucination" where I seem to see something in the twilight and that sort of thing. It may startle me but I can prove to myself it's not real. The apparition in my room was right there a few feet in front of me, real as real. Well the bear was real for me too, if i handent turned the lights towards him and see it was a cat, i would swear under oath it was a bear. I do have a another example but it wasen't me who heard things, a friend of my girl stayed over once, and our conversation topic went to ghosts and such things. now when i drink a bit i can be evil so i told her that my house is haunted, the best part was my girl can be evil too she backed me up yea its haunted at night you can hear whispers in the walls and stuff like that. In the morning she said that she wanted to come and sleep in our bead a few times because she was so scared she heard whispers, people walking shadows moving the whole works i was pissing myself laughing, and she dont like me no more. Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3992 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 7.5
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Perv writes: In the morning she said that she wanted to come and sleep in our bead a few times Perv."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads."
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Omnivorous Member Posts: 3992 From: Adirondackia Joined: Member Rating: 7.5
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I've enjoyed every post (well most) in this thread. Many of them are subtle and closely reasoned; I respect the hell out of that, truly. But for me, the issue is simpler and older.
So I was a little monkey once, cute as the dickens ("You little devil," my mama would cry), and I remember that I could wail in distress when near my bigger cousin and mama would come and bite his ears, despite his hoots of innocence. That was cool. And I remember that everyone would pretend that only Big Bubba could hug the girls, but when he wasn't looking, they'd slip away with the Sneaky Huggers into the bush, and hush their cries with their soft furry hands. Some of the guys would gather above the plain when the storms came. They'd watch the lightning, shake at the thunder: they all knew something different about what it meant. Some of them thought the thunder approvingly echoed baby monkey heads bashed against trees; some of them thought the thunder disapproved of bashing baby monkey heads. I thought it was loud. So, now many lost hairs later, I consider other monkeys' hoots a used car they want to sell. If it's so good, why do they want to sell it? Why does it need any selling at all? When a monkey puts forth the proposition that you can petition the lord in prayer, resulting in a used car that runs forever, I remember wailing my big cousin into a biting, and the baby monkeys and the storms, and I walk around the car and kick the tires because I know there's something wrong with it because there's something wrong with everything monkey. Am I buying this car to cruise with just for fun and see how far it goes? Okay, I don't have to look too hard--I'll just drive it till it craps out and walk away laughing. But if I'm gonna drive this car to monkey business every day, if I have to trust it like I trust a 6" thick liana, then I wanna make sure some dirty monkey didn't put sawdust in the tranny; I wanna look at the odometer cable for tool marks; I wanna listen to the radio presets: what kinda tune suited the way that monkey treated this car? What color is the oil on the stick? There are are a lot of monkeys selling a lot of used cars. There's something wrong with all of them. That's okay--there's something wrong with every car. But I'm not buying the one where I hear muffled hoots in the bushes. That's how this skeptical monkey approaches critical reasoning: I'm 'spicious. And critical. Edited by Omnivorous, : And it's my native language..."If you can keep your head while those around you are losing theirs, you can collect a lot of heads." |
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined: |
Phat writes:
So, is it more important to accept something (anything?) than to make an intelligent, informed (critical) decision? Is it better to take a bad position than to take no position at all?
Too much critical thought prevents one from accepting anything.
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Phat Member Posts: 18354 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
not every decision can be examined critically before it is made. Some decisions only have an impact after they are made.
You cant realize that you should have turned right unless you turn left and notice that the terrain is unfamiliar. Sitting at the fork in the road gives no insight into the terrain ahead.
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Phat Member Posts: 18354 From: Denver,Colorado USA Joined: Member Rating: 1.0 |
frako writes: We all can be evil at times. There is a difference between an innocent joke and words that scare people or destroy their faith. We must ask ourselves what our motives are and also whether or not we are being honorable to others.
... now when i drink a bit i can be evil so i told her that my house is haunted, the best part was my girl can be evil too she backed me up yea its haunted at night you can hear whispers in the walls and stuff like that. In the morning she said that she wanted to come and sleep in our bead a few times because she was so scared she heard whispers, people walking shadows moving the whole works i was pissing myself laughing, and she dont like me no more.
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frako Member (Idle past 336 days) Posts: 2932 From: slovenija Joined:
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We all can be evil at times. There is a difference between an innocent joke and words that scare people or destroy their faith. We must ask ourselves what our motives are and also whether or not we are being honorable to others. LOL i couldn't help myself, when someone talks about ghosts and the like to me it sounds like:" and then the leprechaun came with his pot of gold riding a pink unicorn." We are still friends though, last year we went to the beach together we stayed at her place.She still believes in ghosts and claims my house is haunted even though i told her it was a joke. And if i could do it all over again i would because it was one of the best laughs i had in my lifetime. I know its evil and wrong but still if you believe in fairytale's enough to be scared by them i will make sure you are Christianity, One woman's lie about an affair that got seriously out of hand What are the Christians gonna do to me ..... Forgive me, good luck with that.
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ringo Member (Idle past 443 days) Posts: 20940 From: frozen wasteland Joined:
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Phat writes:
That's fine, as long as you're willing to unmake those decisions if they turn out to be bad ones. If you make a wrong turn, you can keep telling yourself, "It's just over the next hill," or you can admit you were wrong. not every decision can be examined critically before it is made. Some decisions only have an impact after they are made.You cant realize that you should have turned right unless you turn left and notice that the terrain is unfamiliar. Sitting at the fork in the road gives no insight into the terrain ahead. It seems to me that religions put a lot of effort into making excuses for staying on the wrong road.
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