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Author Topic:   If our sun is second or third generation, does this not conflict with Genesis ?
Percy
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Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(2)
Message 198 of 231 (720590)
02-25-2014 10:05 AM
Reply to: Message 196 by Son Goku
02-25-2014 9:26 AM


Re: Mythology...
You can make it even more obvious. The food is hot on the table and a candle is burning when there's a sudden emergency, everyone leaves and doesn't return for an hour during which the table and the food and the candle are completely unobserved. When everyone returns the food is cold and the candle has burned down a couple inches.
So if the table and food and the candle go out of existence while unobserved, what causes them to return to existence in such a way as to perfectly match the passage of an hour of time? In other words, it isn't enough just to store the state of the table somewhere while it is non-existent. You must also store the effects of the passage of time.
The example actually needs a little improvement because the unobserved room is still connected to the rest of the universe. Some of the heat from the food and the candle will escape the room where they can be observed, and of course there are innumerable other connections with everything else. Isolation from all observation is required for this to be the example Eliyahu intended it to be, but even if that were the case there's still all the things you mentioned.
--Percy
Edited by Percy, : Add a little more detail at the end.

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 Message 196 by Son Goku, posted 02-25-2014 9:26 AM Son Goku has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


(2)
Message 199 of 231 (720592)
02-25-2014 10:06 AM
Reply to: Message 185 by Eliyahu
02-25-2014 12:08 AM


Re: Mythology...
Eliyahu writes:
I'll explain this a bit. A while ago I was having the shabbat dinner in the house of a dutch friend here in the Judean desert. He is married to a russian woman who happens to have a university degree in physics, she is an engineer in physics. After talking to my friend a bit in dutch, I explained to her in Hebrew that I just told my friend that the very solid table from which we were eating, that if we would leave the room, close the door, and then nobody would observe the table, that that table then would go out of existence.
About this her only comment was: "That is correct."
That's what she said, but what she was thinking was, "If I tell him he's right, maybe he'll shut up."
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 185 by Eliyahu, posted 02-25-2014 12:08 AM Eliyahu has not replied

Replies to this message:
 Message 203 by NoNukes, posted 02-25-2014 12:28 PM Percy has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 200 of 231 (720593)
02-25-2014 10:09 AM
Reply to: Message 188 by Eliyahu
02-25-2014 12:28 AM


Re: Mythology...
Eliyahu writes:
Like I said, science discovered this almost a 100 years ago. How come you don't have a clue?
Could it be that we are being lied to by the scientists...
Science discovered the universe doesn't exist a hundred years ago, and now they're lying to us about it, but you have somehow uncovered their dark secret?
Are you testing the limits of how ridiculous you can be?
--Percy

This message is a reply to:
 Message 188 by Eliyahu, posted 02-25-2014 12:28 AM Eliyahu has not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 202 of 231 (720613)
02-25-2014 11:14 AM
Reply to: Message 181 by NoNukes
02-24-2014 9:55 PM


Re: Mythology...
Eliyahu made clear that he doesn't believe "in the beginning" means a single point in time. I'll go along with whatever interpretation he likes, but it does seem hard to avoid the interpretation that creation of heaven and earth was the opening act of the first day.
--Percy

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 Message 181 by NoNukes, posted 02-24-2014 9:55 PM NoNukes has seen this message but not replied

  
Percy
Member
Posts: 22388
From: New Hampshire
Joined: 12-23-2000
Member Rating: 5.2


Message 227 of 231 (726163)
05-06-2014 7:05 PM
Reply to: Message 221 by Blue
05-06-2014 5:48 PM


Re: Creation of light
On average the moon is in the daytime sky half the time. The main factor governing whether it is visible to the naked eye is its proximity to the sun in the sky. The further apart they are the more full the moon, the less the glare from the sun, and the easier the moon is to see. The closer they are the less full the moon, the more the glare from the sun, and the harder the moon is to see.
AbE: It's worth mentioning that when the separation between the moon and sun in the daytime sky is zero, that's a solar eclipse.
--Percy
Edited by Percy, : AbE.

This message is a reply to:
 Message 221 by Blue, posted 05-06-2014 5:48 PM Blue has not replied

  
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